Virgin Birth Part 6

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So it came upon her to prepare her for admittance into the divine presence of the power of the highest who is the father was present and over shattered her and the holy child that was born of her was called the son of God.

Men who deny this or think that it degrades our father have no true conception of the sacredness of the most marvelous power with which God has endowed mortal man the power of creation, even though that power may be abused and may become a harp of pleasure to the wicked. Nevertheless, it is the most sacred and holy and divine function with which God has endowed man made holy. It is retained by the father of us all, and in his X exercise of that great and marvelous creative power and function. He did not debase himself, degrade himself, nor debauch his daughter.

Thus Jesus became the literal son of a divine father and no one else was worthy to be his father okay and what would a Mormon apologists say well I don't know, I know what they've said to other quotes and they said well maybe they're just talking about artificial dissemination or some sort of like spiritual figurative metaphorical equivalent to earthly sex did you catch something in this quotation that that stuck out with me when it uses the phrase into the divine presence. It gives us the impression it has.

McConkey has said also that there seem to be a physical touching of some sort between the two entities. Wouldn't that be even much more so of being in the presence of God the father than even Joseph Smith in his first vision, which some have said it was just a vision. He never really saw the person of God how this effort.

Some argue that Wayne is definitely not the father remotely exercising the miracle of human artificial insemination. In fact, I think the thing that most stands out to me in this act, quote, is that he says this very same power of basically procreation that other men have is what the father exercised here and that some men take the same power and make it a harp of pleasure to the wicked.

I don't think that he's talking about human artificial insemination here know when you think about people prostituting themselves or committing adultery.

You not talking about artificial insemination, talking about copulation here.

Melvin J.

Ballard has in so many words here taught that God the father came down into the presence of Mary and she needed the that the sustaining sort of presence of the Holy Spirit to prepare her. He says prepare her for prepare her for for admittance into the divine presence till you've tried so hard not to laugh at well is a desk if it's not laughing at it like it's it's it's repugnant to me right and what's repugnant is that these men claim to be spokesman for the Almighty making these horribly blasphemous statements. And sadly, so many Latter Day Saints if they know that Ballard said that shame on them if they don't know that Ballard made this comment or McConkey made these comments that's even tragic as well because they are associating themselves with an organization that certainly supports these people in this alleged calling that they have an apostle. Lord have mercy on us. This is pretty messed up. Harold B. Lee he said teachers hillbilly by the way, was a leader of the Mormon church is the president of the B was the 11th president.

He said teachers should not speculate on the manner of Christ's birth. We are very much concerned that some of our church teachers seem to be obsessed of the idea of teaching doctrine which cannot be substantiated in making comments beyond what the Lord is actually said you asked about the birth of the Savior neither have I talked about sexual intercourse between deity and the mother of the Savior. If teachers were wise in speaking of this matter about which the Lord has said, but very little.

They would rest of their discussion on the subject, with merely the words which are recorded on the subject in Luke one than the merry sit in the angel, how should this be seen.

I know not a man, and the angel answered and said it under her, the Holy Ghost shall come upon the power of the highest shall overshadow thee therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of the shall be called the son of God. Remember, he writes out. He says on that the being who was brought about by Mary's conception was a divine personage. We need not question his method to accomplish his purposes. Perhaps we should do well to remember the words of Isaiah for my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are my ways your way, says the Lord. First present heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, my thoughts are that your thoughts let the Lord rest his case with this declaration and wait until he sees fit to tell us more. I absolutely have to. Just point out here he did not deny through the teaching of other Mormon leaders that God the father had sexual relations with Mary. He just said would not be wise to teach it eat debase is the sort of like well it doesn't seem as official as other things yet. He basically leaves the details of the mechanics up to Mistry is basically the equivalent of modern Mormon saying, well maybe the father had relations with Mary, but we don't know he God has said very list little that clearly what Harold really is doing is what we call damage control. Obviously someone is saying this. Obviously they got the idea from somewhere where they get the idea of you don't get it from reading Luke you don't get it from reading Matthew where did these ideas come get it from Young and Pratt and McConkey and Talmage. Now he says not speculate well, isn't that exactly this and that, exactly, folks.

What these guys have done.

They have gone far beyond the biblical account in the Gospels to add all sorts of information to this event that is certainly not in the Gospels. Harold Bewley is recognizing that but as you said he doesn't correct those past leaders for doing that. If we had if we headed our way. He would have you rightly recognized here that this is not a nonissue. This is an issue even says some of the church teachers are obsessed with the idea of teaching it. I'm not. I've I've heard plenty be wise to decide about a BYU teachers adopted this idea but instead of just publicly saying look I know our leaders taught this and they were wrong and we publicly repent as a church for ever having taught this idea or ever having allowed this idea to be taught by her leaders unchecked, un-repudiated.

We openly reputed. P8 the idea we explicitly affirm the traditional notion of the of the virgin birth, and we as specifically denied that that term can be redefined to mean you know you may be only had never had relations with the moral but maybe had relations with an Immortal Way, Mormon apologists. Teachers have that apology is never forthcoming Mormon leaders don't do that. They just don't apologize for the mistakes or that the sins of past leaders of the false doctrine of Pasley and II did I tell you I testify, as it were, to all the listeners is still an issue I gone down to Temple Square last winter and and I went down one Thursday specifically to push this version birth issue. I talked to a descendent of James Talmage. I asked him what do you think about what young Pratt Talmage McConkie taught about God the father having physical relations with Mary and he said that's too sacred to talk about so he does understand is coming. We believe it sacred that we could easily say it was a version birth.

He was anything.

It's basically saying that if his response essentially was. Well, maybe God the father did have sexual relations with Mary, but I don't talk about that because that's too sacred. The odd part about that answer. Though Aaron is many Mormon leaders obviously did not feel the same way because they did talk about it. They did talk about what they thought actually took place.

And certainly what Mormon leaders have taught regarding the incarnation of Jesus is not at all with the gospel say it's not all Christians that believe throughout the centuries.

So obviously were Mormonism is in this particular topic is outside the parameters of Christian thought and practice.

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