Prophecy on War Part 1

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It helps to know what their church is taught in several basic topics. For this reason Gorman is a research ministry has provided its crash course Mormonism crash course, Mormonism includes concise articles highlighting what LDS leaders and church manuals have taught on issues that will probably come up in a typical conversation. You can find these informative articles. A crash course Mormonism.com that's crash course Mormonism.com viewpoint on Mormonism is a program that examines the teachings of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints from a biblical perspective view .1 Mormonism is sponsored by Mormonism research ministry since 1979 Mormonism research ministry has been dedicated to equipping the body of Christ with answers regarding the Christian faith in a manner that expresses gentleness and respect. And now, your host for today's viewpoint on Mormonism. So glad you could be with us for this additional viewpoint on Mormonism. I'm your host, Bill McKeever, founder and director Mormonism research ministry and with me today is Eric Johnson. My colleague at MRM there was an article in the August 2021. Addition of the Leo hold a magazine. It was written by Elder Matthew S: Matthew Holland is the son of Mormon apostle Jeffrey Holland and he was the president of the Utah Valley University between 2009 in 2018. He was also a BYU professor and served as a mission president as well. Currently a member of the first quorum of the 70 so Mr. Holland does have some authority and clout when it comes to members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints in this edition of the Leona magazine's article is titled prophecy of war prescription for peace that we've talked about Joseph Smith prophecy regarding the Civil War and as you know we are not all that impressed with a lot of the details that were in that prophecy, or even how that prophecy:" came about, but because Mr. Holland brings this subject up again. We thought that we would go through his article and critique some of the points that he makes.

That of course he feels makes Joseph Smith a legitimate prophet of God.

So let's begin. Eric was to start off with the second paragraph since the first paragraph is all that much related to what were going to talk about Bill. He writes on page 28 despite the real possibility of worldwide wariness over the lingering threat of covered 19 economic challenges and political and cultural divisiveness. Chances are that most of us will set such things aside and be utterly engage in a festive and spiritual celebration of the birth of our Savior, but in our current climate, we may sympathize with what was on Joseph Smith's mind on December 25, 1832 and of course that's why he makes reference to the birth of our Savior's because this prediction as Mormons understand it was given to Joseph Smith on December 25, 1832. Next is the subheading concerns led to Revelation. He writes as the year was ending. The prophet was alarmed by the increasing appearances of trouble among the nations. From doctrine and covenants section 87 the section heading, in particular, he noted a global pandemic of cholera and the threat of the quote unquote immediate dissolution of the United States. In his words, the state of South Carolina disagreeing with the direction and policies of the federal government quote passed ordinances declaring their state a free and independent nation." On December 25, 1832. These concerns open Joseph's heart and mind to a most remarkable revelation known today as section 87 of the doctrine and covenants. The revelation foretold key aspects of America's Civil War almost 30 years before he began. It also gave clear spiritual direction for all calamitous times. Let's stop right there because somebody just reading that and not knowing any history behind this prediction of December 25, 1832 can easily be led into thinking that this just pop up out of nowhere. How could Joseph Smith of come up with some of these things was he really unique in his thinking, and hence his prediction, and I would argue no folks, not at all remember at this time, the headquarters of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints was in Kirtland Ohio not far away from where Joseph Smith was living at the time there was a place called Painesville, Painesville, Ohio, Painesville, Ohio had a newspaper called the Painesville telegraph and just four days prior to Smith's prophecy the Painesville telegraph reprinted this story from the New York Courier and inquirer that was titled the crisis and in this article. It spoke of quote unquote the probabilities of dismemberment stemming from discontent in South Carolina and Georgia over states rights. This is right around the time when Andrew Jackson as president had really upset the southern states and they decided to respond by saying that they had the ability to nullify any type of decree that came down from Washington DC. This of course does not set very well with the federal government and there was at that time a lot of friction, especially between South Carolina and as it states your Georgia already. There were threats of secession.

This was not new at the time. Not only did the Painesville telegraph and the New York Courier have articles on this, but you can also check that other newspapers around the country were talking about the same thing.

So this was not unusual. Many people felt that there could very well be a coming Civil War, Joseph Smith, in my opinion is really kind of jumping the gun because he gives the impression that this is going to happen relatively quickly, which of course it took over 20 years for it to eventually happen. So in policing what Mr. Holland is written so far in its proper historical context. We don't really see this as being so unimaginable at that time. I'm going to recommend that listeners who would like to learn more about what were talking about can go to an article that was written by bill@mrm.org/civil-war and the title is called the Joseph Smith correctly predict the American Civil War we have in that article a tag to the Painesville telegraph story and as you mention it comes from the New York Courier and inquirer is entitled the crisis now as Mr. Holland goes on his another subheading in the subheading is observant or prophetic.

No. Naturally Mr. Holland because he does believe that Joseph Smith is a prophet of God and is trying to use this article to convince others of Joseph Smith's prophetic abilities naturally assumes that Smith is being more prophetic, rather than just observant, but I again have to stress that would Joseph Smith is going to talk about as far as the northern states in the southern states. That was pretty much common knowledge. A lot of people felt that that was probably going to happen if things did not get corrected between the southern states and Washington DC. He writes the revelation began with the warning. Soon the United States would be played with war starting with the rebellion of South Carolina verse one. In the ensuing conflict. The southern states shall be divided against the northern states were three Bellamy stop either because what Mr. Holland is written there.

As I said before is not news that is not unique to Joseph Smith, others during that particular time. If they were paying attention to current events in the United States would've probably said that that is potentially going to happen if things are not corrected, so that's not new. In other words, folks, you don't need a revelation to tell you what we just read here. You don't need a revelation.

Basically all your cooking heat. It was the Painesville telegraph which we know Joseph Smith probably had access to and a reminder. It was just four days before he gives this prophecy, so he had access to that paper for sure. And so this would not have been something that he could found out from other sources.

Hauling continues on and says if this were the extent of the prophecy, it might be said that Jesse Smith was just observant, not prophetic. In 1832.

It already appeared that South Carolina was in rebellion and that war might be on the way.

But there is so much more to this prophecy in the events surrounding it. After that paragraph Mr. Hollis's Joseph was told that and then he has a series of bullet points that he feels vindicates Joseph Smith calling as a prophet.

What is bullet point number one Eric. This conflict would precede war being poured out upon all nations. Verse three lesson 50 years from the end of the Civil War.

The first two world wars began. Now we've commented on this particular point because we feel that it is will to be quite honest, folks, it's silly to think that World War I or World War II had anything to do with the rebellion in South Carolina.

I've challenge Latter Day Saints to show me just one historian that can come up with this connection that somehow the assassination. For instance, of Archduke Ferdinand that triggered World War I was thought to have anything to do with the rebellion of South Carolina.

No historian is going to make that connection.

No historian is going to connect World War II with the rebellion in South Carolina to make that connection between World War I and two is relatively small when you consider what Elder Joseph L. Wirthlin, a Mormon apostle said in 1958. Listen to what she says. The prophet Joseph gave us this marvelous revelation. In 1832 the Civil War came in 1861. The war between Denmark and Prussia in 1864 Italy and Austria in 1865 in 1866, Austria and Prussia in 1866 Russia in Turkey in 1877, China and Japan in the 1994, 95 Spanish-American war in 1898, Japan and Russia in 1904 1905 World War I in 1914 to 1918. Then the next war was a comparatively small one. Ethiopia and Italy. When the people in that land of Ethiopia were taken over control by Italy.

I am grateful to the Lord that they now have their freedom then the world war just past World War II in brackets and of course the Korean War and then in brackets.

It also goes on to say since 1958 there been among numerous other wars, the Vietnam War Southeast Asia war in Angola six-day and Yom Kippur wars in the holy land in the Persian Gulf War. According to Joseph Wirthlin. I guess we can also connect all those wars with the rebellion in South Carolina did not Jesus himself predicted in Matthew 24 that wars and rumors of war were going to be commonplace until the day of the Lord comes all Joseph Smith seems to be doing is piggybacking off of something that Jesus declared centuries earlier.

It's ridiculous to assume that these wars have anything to do with the rebellion in South Carolina. They have much more to do with what Jesus said in Matthew 24. Thank you for listening. If you would like more information regarding his research ministry. We encourage you to visit our website at www.mrm.org you can request your free newsletter is a research we hope you will join us again as we look at another viewpoint on Mormonism you are knocking the door and opened it to find two friendly representatives from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, otherwise known as the Mormon church.

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