The Narrow Path 8/4

Good afternoon and welcome to the narrow path radio broadcast Steve Greg and we are live for an hour is us all.

Usually the case. On these weekdays. We've been having weekday broadcasts of five days a week for 23 years, so that's been a lot of broadcast and we do the same thing.

Virtually every time we open the phone lines we say, come on in and join us if you have two if you want to bring up the question about the Bible or the Christian faith. Maybe you see things differently than the hosting like the balance, feel free to give me a call about such things is that to. Now, as I often have to save the lives of full, but I also usually say because it is true that if you take on this number and call us in a few minutes you will probably find that a line has opened All throughout the show. So the number to call is 844-484-5737 that's 844-484-5737 first call today comes from Mike in Albany, Oregon hi Mike, good to hear from you all the questions I am. I came from over 30 years and Mormonism and their if you have a critical question for Keith to do something wrong with you, like you made your singing and you are just friend at work. Maybe you do some studying math or yacht praying and reading scriptures that Think that obviously that's that's kind of The momentum for so long. Everything I something to do next.

Sent so just assume it is something wrong with my thinking to gather at their correct Internet would make sense but you've changed your view that a lot of things over the years, I received your good think about being critical with your beliefs, your processes for being critical about your own belief systems without throwing the baby out athletic you pertain to faith in Christ.

This would undermine the system where affect the way for doing that you would suggest crossing the bit to them. I don't at first make sense in the one understand that it I think it begins with knowing what matters. What matters to God. What matters to my salvation, and so forth. And that is something I've never really changed my view about and that is that is Jesus, I have my view has altered a little bit in that I used to think that I had a lot more to do with the specifics of my beliefs about about Jesus and there are specific beliefs that we have to have in order to betray Christians, but they are few. There's a lot of belief that Jesus never really based on very little biblical evidence, or none at all. I mean, when you find the church disputing over the hypostatic union of the two natures of Christ there discussion.

Something about Jesus that the Bible never addresses and never supplies information about so it obviously can't be that that's one belief in a Jesus that can be extremely important as God would've mentioned something about it, I think, and likewise a number of other issues. There are very few things of the Bible says we have to believe we have to believe. Of course, that Jesus is the Lord we have to believe that he is risen from the dead, and that God has made him the Messiah, the King we have to embrace him in that role. Of course it's not just academically set up so salvation comes from our embrace of Jesus Christ as Lord as the son of God as King over us and of course that embrace looks like something it's not just her reaching some opinion about it. It has to do with actually truly embracing him, and all manner of life so that he is my king is my Lord, whatever he says is my is my command and so I had that in place in my belief system for very very very long time on my beliefs on lesser subjects went through a lot of changes and I guess I felt safe examining my other views, knowing that my salvation did not rest on all my loyalty to any particular view, it did. It basically rests on my loyalty to Christ himself and so salvation is in Christ. It's not in having all the right opinions.

Of course I want to have all the right opinions and that's why do change my views because sometimes I get the suspicion that some of the things I've been taught some of the things I've believed are not really well supported in Scripture.

So that's why I re-examined. How do I begin to wonder about such things.

Usually it's by dialogue with good Christians who have other views in my own, in my view is that if if there is some issue upon which to very good Christians can disagree and still remain very good followers of Christ. It that issue must not be one of the nonnegotiable's it must be something that I can believe one way and my brother can believe the other way and it doesn't have any negative impact on my walk with God so I I in my own understanding have always been rather noninstitutional in my religion, but rather seen salvation and as a walk with God, a personal walk with Jesus and submission to him as my Lord and with that in place. Everything else could conceivably be up for grabs. Now that doesn't mean everything is. It doesn't mean that all the other doctors I holder on shaky ground, not at all, but there are some things that I've been taught which you know I began to suspect maybe they are on shaky ground and I would begin to search the Scriptures to find out and I I have not had the pressure that some teachers have had to conform to the views I was raised with. Because I'm not a professional I'm not a pastor I'm not a patent professor at a school that teaches him that pays me to teach what they believe or what I'm supposed to believe in their former free-agent. I I've often thought. I'm a very fortunate person have two things going for me, that have that many Christians would probably love to have going for them to date. It's just not in their circumstances. It's been the providence of God that a I am a Bible teacher by vocation. That's what I do and therefore justifies my spending far more time studying and meditating on it reading the Scriptures and the average person in other professions really ever would have time to do so.

I've had the tremendous advantage of being full-time in teaching, but I've also had the great advantage of not being paid to do so and and therefore I'm not beholden to somebody who writes a paycheck for me to make sure that they are happy with what I believe and so the average layman doesn't have the liberty I have just spent so much time in the Scriptures as I've had the liberty to do and the average full-time minister who does have time for that usually is beholden to somebody who is his employer and I've been free from those kinds of restraints and it's been very helpful to me because I can be relaxed about. For example, in what do I believe about Original Sin. Well, I used to believe something very strongly now I'm my my my views on that are undergoing cross-examination.

I haven't exactly change them but I might because frankly, no one is going to be saved or lost because of their belief about Original Sin. In fact, nobody in the church had the specific beliefs on Original Sin that I was raised with until Augustine so for the first 300 400 years of the church.

There was no required belief about that subject. And people were saved. Whether they had a correct or incorrect belief that there are so I guess also one thing that's helped me is having some grasp of of the trajectory of church history.

How that you know people have have seen have cross-examined the beliefs of the institutions that they belong to and often found that they could be improved upon by buying a better group. Treatment of the Scriptures and knowing that, for example, knowing that Luther, who I don't agree with about everything, but I certainly appreciate that heat cross-examined and criticized and changed his mind from the view that was taught by everybody he knew for centuries in the Catholic Church and the fact that he did so he took more risks in doing so that I to continue my views is something that I'm I think is a good thing, and too many times we assume that if were now in the Reformation tradition. We don't need to cross-examine our views a more in fact, some people are proud to to be firmly entrenched in the Reformation theology. I think why. Why would that be so important that would be in the Reformation. The other, why don't we just do it.

Luther himself did and go back to Scripture in and check anything out and maybe we find it, Luther himself had figured everything out either. We can do this we can have the liberty to think clearly for ourselves about such things as long as we know where our salvation is and as long as we have no fear of man see again if somebody is paid as a pastoral theologian to to support a particular viewpoint well and that that could very much inhibit them in their freedom to think and the fear of man says. Proverbs brings a snare you're trapped.

If you fear what men think about you. You just know there's limits to what you can do positive. I was still pleasing men. I would be the servant of Christ. So those are some of the things the factors I think that are related to my my my journey theologically and my freedom.

And of course I have never abandon a previous view held in favor of one that has less scriptural support because I don't I'm I'm conservative by nature. I really am. I don't want to change who who wants to change, especially at my terminal man old people like to just canopied settled. In fact, I my disposition is always been. I'd much rather say what everyone else has said I'd much rather show my loyalty toward teachers and those who came before me. Frankly there's greater job security.

Internet except I don't have a job in the ministry so the point is that we we just have to know where in our salvation lies it's in our relation with Christ and know that he is that if if anything we believe is not correct. He would want us to learn that interchange see sometimes people think will fight if I would even rethink some of the views of my church is that that make God angry me. Why would God be angry at you for trying to find the truth. I think that's exactly what God wants us to do. Not exactly what I you want to thank God that getting all these things. Well, Joseph Smith.

Most of the Pentagon, then, because he certainly challenged what all the churches were saying was that last I allowed to do that. I cannot make any sense and that you feel safe and getting Nantucket knowing that there's a price about art and the LDS church from your example from other people.

Example before I could actually start a critical level without feeling like I'm abandoning Christ to give that you need marketing to thank you for so long, but if you ever come across a patented your mind, nonsensical or to your mind to contradict other things that the process for figuring out between one. My assumption in this sense is based on my earlier convictions which are well-established on evidence that the Bible is written by inspired men, and therefore it's trustworthy. Okay, so I mean that's not that's not a gullible position I take. That's one that is risen and supported by the best consideration of all available evidence. My conclusion is the Bible is true by inspired men of God, whose whose understanding of these things is accurate and superior to mine.

Now that is a foundation when I find it to things in Scripture puzzled me because I don't know how they could be harmonized. My assumption is where they can be, but I don't know everything and so if I knew everything that God knows I would also know how those things are harmonized and it I see those things as allurement for further study is I like finding things about I don't understand because it is all great. I got something more to learn your learning is the most thrilling adventure that I've been engaged in in many respects is a Christian learning is exciting to me and if I thought while I got no more.

Learn to do everything just I understand everything now I think or what I do. Just settle down to boredom or find some new new form of entertainment that doesn't involve learning know I when I find there's something that's beyond my ken or something that baffles me. My assumption is still okay. This is in God's word so in whatever way it is properly understood is true, but there's something here.

I am not fully understanding and that that bids me on to my do further study and more learning what you my friends who left at church to Throw everything out because I knew at that point because it from everything else before you and I Mike people who belong to cults, Christian cults like like Mormonism, which I regard as occult and also Jehovah's Witness many times when they find fault with the group. They just abandon all belief in Christ because they been indoctrinated by the group to believe that all the churches are certainly wrong, I mean that's that's that's part of it means to be such occult is that everybody else is gonna be wrong and that's why our group is the one that God chose to you, and it's the right people so so what the cult is done is undermine confidence in anything that you get from a church or even from the Bible. It's contradictory to what your leaders say, and once you you therefore have only one thing you depend on and that your leaders when she began to see follow them. Then it's very unusual really for us and for example a Mormon to leave the Mormon church and stay a follower of Christ that happens in your wonderful example that I am very proud of you, as I've seen just three phone calls or to revive. I've watched that progression is tremendous example and values to critical about the Old Testament. The patient answered questions and that kind of thing that's for my condition art just really think you and you present. I appreciate talking to you as usual rights conferencing to Arizona. Welcome to the narrow path. Thanks for calling. Bennett was running hello Scott, welcome mad where during the and you started by light but you can't believe it, it will infirmity what he called you okay and I was wondering how that works out with him that my grief is made perfect through your week during your weakness is.

I think that's I think it fits perfectly. The word infirmity. I know that we think of infirmity may be meaning weakness itself and it is infirmity, is the normal.

The most common New Testament word for sickness. There is a Greek word that is used more often than any other, for sickness in the New Testament and it is the word is here translated infirmity and Paul twice in the passage, which is second credits 12 refers to this as an infirmity. He calls it a thorn in the flesh in a messenger of Satan sent about them, but when Jesus said my grace is sufficient for you, and my strength is made perfect in weakness. Weakness is infirmity. He says most gladly I will rather boast in my infirmities and then in verse 10 he says therefore take pleasure in infirmities and he's referring to his infirmities, which is the Greek word most often minutes sickness. Now infirmity.

Sickness is a weakness and Jesus told him, you know you want me to remove this infirmity.

You want me to remove this thorn in your flesh, but that's not what I'm going to do because actually your infirmity or your weakness provides an opportunity for my strength to made manifest in you without anyone mixing up for your strength and Paul said is also so that Paul might not be exalted above measure. He said that's why forms given to him so to keep Paul from being too high-minded about himself and also to demonstrate that what was being done through Paul certainly not done through his strength through the power of God that's been discussed her bed with maybe an hour know any thing but talking directly to Jesus. Direct response from Keith Jan that is not unique in Paul's life for me.

He prayed that it would go away and insolently seizes he says about concerning this thing I pleaded with the Lord three times that it might depart from me, God, the Lord of course usually means Jesus in the New Testament, although sometimes it is used of God himself. And so I don't know if Paul's distinguishing here between Jesus and the Lord are just saying you are afraid of the Lord which could be just a reference to God.

Whether it's Christ or or the father. I'm not totally sure that there yeah, he said he said to me, my grace is sufficient for you. Okay so so the Lord said to Paul, now he does Nestlé say that he was in front of him and talking to like somebody in the same room and you can see face-to-face, and that his statement Jesus told him something God told him something does not in itself tell us how that that was told it could be that he simply got a still small voice word were the Lord spoke to him these words he doesn't he doesn't elaborate on that okay YouTube I know all right – Charlie from Darnell Arkansas. Welcome to the narrow path makes for calling Shirley Arkansas at been listening to year some assembly required for new skin, part of an institutional charge, and demand that we are pastor carefully thinking. We all had create cryptically its 2008 S. approaching and I think it cleared the problem. He needs the Seabury. I am strongly of the opinion that is killing our church people are leaving. Jerry thinking that I think you may have been appointed and painful. I did not get, but without my question for you are an occasional decreased and guided to the king without well you didn't personally hire right here making you you yourself Charlie didn't personally hire is the church that had it right site. The organization hard so his organization meant only by definition if he's hired he's a professional is is he's got a job that does mean it doesn't, well, and unfortunately too many people in institutional churches don't understand what real church leadership is it's not that of a professional world, a man who's the big boss. Almost all churches see it that way. In a sense, because there's only relatively few churches have pastors who don't see themselves as the one who's like the CEO of the Corporation, now CEO of the Corporation shall be a man of vision is gotta be a man who rallies the loyalty of the of the others in the organization so that he can move the whole organization forward and make it more prosperous, and so forth. And that's what a great number pastors are attempting to do with the churches that they lead and in many cases they don't they forget that the church is not an institution. The church is people. Yes, it is a minute, it's an institution, but is not what I'm referring to is institutionalized. I mean marriage is an institution to bit it's a relationship obviously the the true body of Christ is simply the people of God in relationship with each other.

When God gives them leaders those leisure to serve the people. That's why Jesus said whoever wants to be chief among you should be the servant of everybody, the servant of all.

He doesn't serve an organization and an institutional church. He in fact the mentality of institutional churches is usually that if he doesn't grow the organization. If he doesn't bring in more offerings over time, or at least maintain the if you know if if if the church doesn't grow like a corporation supposed to grow under his leadership and vision. Well then he'll be replaced by someone who can get the job done.

Now this has nothing to do with anything the Bible would endorse about church church is a fellowship of people who have the spirit of Christ were brothers and sisters. Jesus even told his disciples don't call anyone, rabbi or teacher or master, you have only one teacher. That's the Christ you are all brothers he's telling the leaders facilitate leaders in the church that were your your all brothers everybody's brother sister stood family when father and so when a man comes into he thinks he's an organization.

When God may have called him to be a spiritual leader and he's he's got the wrong understanding of his job.

Now I have to say, in many cases, pastors who are hired, show themselves to not be spiritual leaders. All they might know how to run an organization and maybe they should go out and run one, but the patient believed in the flock, pastor of a leader of God's people has got to make the decisions that really benefit God's people, not the entity that is leaving and I see this all the time.

Pastors carry you down yes but they probably won't because they probably don't understand the church either mean we like Luther in his day live in a time when the all the leaders of the church in the West saw things a certain way and Luther saw some things differently. Luther still is an institutional church guy, but he didn't stay in the same official church head of another.

But the point is we have to realize help help bound many people are into the traditional views of their time. That series listening to his telling you about things that most people interested don't know. But yes, the church leaders should confront a pastor who is hurting the shape can it take a break, but I hope that helps your sister listening to the narrow pathway of another half-hour coming up were not done. Please stay tuned.

As you know, the narrow path radio show is Bible radio that has nothing to sound everything to do the right thing and share with your family and friends.

Tell them to tune into the narrow path on this radio station narrow path.com where they will find topical audio teachings blog articles and diverse teachings and the radio shows you know listener supported narrow path with Steve Greg share which you now radio broadcast Steve Greg were live for another half-hour take calls. If you have questions about the Bible would be glad to talk to about if you have a different viewpoint on the host on any subject. Feel free to talk to you about that to at the moment there are a couple of lines open. That's not often enough it will say that the number to call is 844-484-5737 that's 844-484-5737 our next caller is John from Dallas, Texas John, welcome to the neuropathic to calling you right now I radio program out about 100 yeah your Google will bid out about what it was bits here and there. Actually, the publisher, there is nothing in the book that the publisher objected to accept its length. They wanted to put out a book that was about two thirds the length of the manuscript, so they just kind of assigned me to to remove about 1/3 of the material which is a lot but you know how the book is peppered with quotations from authors and things like that. It had about twice as many of those denied you know who you find two quotations from authors make a single point I had for five or something like that. You know I have to. I hated taking that out every author hates editors make them do, but honestly think the other was wise because much of the quotes I took out would've been redundant and would've made the book bulkier probably than it needed to be. So I don't like the publisher doing that, but I have to admit they may have been right now. One thing they did. I don't like is they maybe change the title. I had a very simple title which was why hell which is very descriptive of the contents of three different views of why God created hell. What's it for. And that's what the books about the publisher required recalled all you want to know about hell, which to my mindset, a goofy that sounded juvenile actually set a little bit like hell for dummies and I did. I objected I we argued about that but they wanted it, and they were young. I was under contract with them so they got their way. Now that's why to put something out. Now it probably before November the I'm hoping our self-publishing.

I have two books published by Thomas Nelson. In both cases I wrestled with them over certain contents and things like that. I don't want to wrestle with the publisher them. I wanted to wear one old stubborn and rebellious, but I have to say by self-publishing will be able to keep everything in yet not. It's funny, it's a funny thing. They liked my book of Revelation, except they didn't like the first paragraph and they said your first paragraph seems a little too negative. So would you rewrite that.

So I rewrote it. I can even see that was negatively reverted to make it more positive is still still a little negative would you do it again and so I wasn't sure what they wanted, but I just rewrote it again and they still didn't like. And finally I came up with the paragraph they liked and it went on through and they didn't ask for any other changes. That's a six yeah yeah your your your your it is it with. I was going to write a book on the kingdom of God and I wanted to be about the length of my book on how which is 300 pages. As it turned out, it got way too long twice that long so I thought okay the book was divided into two discrete parts that I just make each part, separate, so to two books shorter books that are being one in book 2 and then and then at some point in the future I will release it as two books in one volume for the sick people who don't mind looking books and okay God bless you.

Thanks for calling the sea here Dwight from Denver Colorado how you doing, Dwight. Good to hear from you.

I have two questions you may talk about in the days of Peter leg Sears was divided in reference to the Tower of Babel. Do you think will these two theories.

That's one of them. The people were divided at the Tower of Babel and what that with that would be wasting the earth was divided is question was the word earth and the word world we sometimes reduce interchangeably but not usually in Scripture. The word earth usually refers to the land or the landmass of the dry land is what God called earth. Hebrews Ritz and and yet the word world which we usually think of the kind of the same thing as the as the planet Earth. The Bible use a number of different ways including the population world as when the Bible says God so loved the world that he gave his only son, it's referring to the people of so when it says that the earth was divided in his day, I would think that if you target the people were divided because of the confusion of languages at Babel it be more reasonable to save the world was divided because that would be very natural to say the earth's device. I don't know of any case word in the Bible the word earth refers specifically to people of the fit might, but I don't know. Now the idea that it's could be about landmass has incurred some people to see that as a reference to the dividing of the continents after the flood, you know, scientists feel that there's been with the call continental drift so that the continents were once one large landmass, but that because of the movement of tectonic plates over the years course scientists would never millions of years. If this is if this is what the Bible is referred to it all began after the flood, and it's only taken a few thousand euros for to move that far and I don't know that that would be the case or not but that some I think it's may be more common for me to hear people suggestive talk about the continental drift in the division of the earth itself into different landmasses. So either one could be on the table. I think okay and if I may last chapter of Leviticus I think is 27. I don't have it right before me.

It talks about a man making a vow to the Lord and then it talks about the valuation of a man according to his image in shackles and pain valuation for women and children. I understand what that money thing all about their yeah well the concept of the chapter is that people vow to give certain things the Lord and if they in any sense default on it. Then when they repented that they have to give that thing plus usually 20% interest on that is 20% of its value. That's what the most of its about, but there is also the special cases where people would file their children to the Lord as Samuel's mother did.

For example, Hannah vowed that Samuel would be the Lord, you know, I think, very possibly Jeff this daughter would fall into that category. Some people think you killed her. Other people think he just committed her to the Lord and she served tabernacle, but people could devote their children to God. In this sense that they simply spend their life serving the priesthood, not as priests but just as servants to the priests in an attempt tabernacle serving God for their whole lives and again if you if you vowed that your delight you give your son to God and in less you say you didn't do it in a timely fashion. Then I think when you came around to doing it you would have to add a certain fee to your to yourself for your penalty and in the different ages that are mentioned would refer to the amount of the fee for each like if it's a child or teenager. Whatever man woman. So I'm I don't know how all of that worked out an experience. It is a strange concept for us and I don't know how often it was really done, but the chapter does deal with, you know how things that are pledged to the Lord.

How failure in that area should be redressed with penalty and the penalty is a safer something it had monetary value was usually 20% penalty for a person the penalty would depend on the age of the person, presumably because their age would have something to do with how many productive years of help they could provide tabernacle okay thank you very much all right my thanks for your call all right. We talk next to George and Leo Minster, Massachusetts hi George, welcome financially so I can question on what the Bible the boat, the eternal soul knows, always my understanding that we had sold the eternal and caring in the newer farm. You know, in the minority, but now I'm hearing a lot of question saying that that was a great convention and that the Bible never really says anything about what your take on well it's ambiguous in the Old Testament. I think it's less so in the new.

The word soul in the Old Testament is the Hebrew people were Nefesh which is that when God breathed into Adam's nostrils the breath of life he became a living Nefesh and are transitions usually say living soul on the other hand, the animals were also called living Nefesh so it's you for thinking of a soul as sort of an eternal part of us that God put in us, then we have to attribute that to animals as well because there also called Nefesh but those passages do not say that he gave man or animals living soul. That man became a living soul, and the term Nefesh is used throughout the Old Testament, usually to simply mean a living thing.

Sensate being a man became a sensate being only after God breathed his breath into his nostrils. Before that he was just a piece of clay that was shaped like a man and God breathed into his nostrils and then he became a living being. Animals were also living beings. Now you will find in the Psalms.

For example, David speed using the word soul. Sometimes as if it's referring to something other than his whole person is a living being. For example, he says bless the Lord, O my soul, he says in Psalm 1031 and all that is within me, bless his holy name. Now there's some hemp there that he sees himself as having a soul, not just being a soul but there's not much elaboration on we don't have very much in the Old Testament about people having a soul and certainly not anything that really speaks clearly about a soul that is immortal. That man would have a soul or you can use that term. For example, in interchangeably with the word heart or mind or something like that we could speak of me I could speak about my heart or my mind about them so to speak about me, but I'm not necessarily referring to anything about how long it lasts. Same thing when a man speaks of his soul.

In the Old Testament is not necessarily make any comments about its eternal reality. The idea that the human soul is eternal is indeed a Greek concept and it did come into Judaism as a result of the Diaspora with the Jews after Zerubbabel returned and built the Temple in Jerusalem in Jews who had been scattered throughout the Babylonian and Persian empires most and remained there, and many of them were in Persia.

A lot of them were in Egypt and Alexandria, Egypt, but both of these lands were brought into Greek culture by Alexander the great and therefore Greek culture permeated the secular world around Israel and was to a large degree imbibed by the Jews who were in those regions and apparently eventually such ideas drifted into Judaism proper even in Judea. So before the time of Christ. There is already this idea that man had a soul that survives after his physical death, for example, when we read about Jesus talking of the rich man and Lazarus Sunday after they die. One of them is in hell, and the other is in in Abrams Buddhism I think it's understood.

This is not suggesting that their bodies which were buried and moldering in the grave were in Abrams was more in flames. It was there something there, their essence of life, the personality with their soul and all in the word soul is not used there, but it's very clear it's not referring to the bodies which are now in a grave somewhere and deteriorate and this idea was already present before Jesus was born in the book of Enoch, which dates to a couple centuries before Jesus time so and it's a Jewish book. But not written by Enoch is not written by the inspired author. It's just a religious book written by a Jew of the inter-testament time and you can see from reading Enoch that he is picked up some of the ideas of the Greeks about the soul living on now.

The Greeks did have this idea that soul is immortal, but it's not entirely clear whether the Jews thought that amid some of the juice may have been some deftly thought that the soul that goes to hell. Some of them believed it was annihilated. Others believed it was not now in the Christian documents. The word soul seems to be used both of of an interview of sensate person and also as a part of a person because it says in first Peter chapter 3 that in the ark, eight souls were saved through water at the end of the first Peter chapter 3.

That verse 20 or so and so it does use word souls to refer to whole people, but Paul talks that your whole soul and spirit and body being preserved until the day of Christ, in which case he definitely distinguishes the body from the other things mentions spirit and soul and so he does indicate that we have a body and we have spirit and soul. Likewise, in Hebrews chapter 4 verse 12 it says that the word of God is alive and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, dividing to the piercing thunder of the soul and spirit in the joints in the Maryland of the joints and marrow, would be of course the physical body soul and spirit would refer to something other than the physical body is distinguished from it. So the New Testament does confirm what the Old Testament does not state clearly that is that there is a human soul that dwells inside of man.

Some people think it's distinct from the human spirit. Some think it's the same thing as the human spirit. But the both parties would believe that it is nonphysical and lives in someone. Paul said that a textbook of death is being absent from the body while the body is one thing but what is it that's absent from what if I'm dead and I'm absent from the body with and who am I the one who's absent from my body unless it must be non-body. My nonphysical identity my soul or whatever so you know the Bible kind in the new test of the county takes for granted certain things that have become normative teaching in Judaism and confirms at least some of to be correct, but it never assumes that the readers need an explanation of this also. And that's too bad because we would certainly enjoy one, but you know it just assumes that we know something of that so we have to deduce what they thought and what is true from what they allude to it seems to me that we we have to say the New Testament at least alludes to a soul or spirit that survives beyond the bodies death. Now whether that is eternal or not is which question I think with the idea that everyone has an eternal soul is a Greek idea in the Bible doesn't anywhere specifically confirm that.

Certainly the Old Testament doesn't and I'm not really sure that the New Testament has anything in it that would confirm that the soul is eternal. The idea that it lives somewhat after the death of the body does not mean that it lives forever, so we need some some other information than what we have to know that in fact the Bible seems to deny it, because in first Timothy 616 we are specifically told that God alone possesses immortality now far human souls remodeled and we also would possess immortality pulses God alone possesses immortality which is a way of saying we don't but we can have his his is given to us as a gift. As we've known John 316 whoever believes in him shall not perish but will have everlasting life. So conditionally unconditional faith in Christ we are capable of being immortal having eternal life. That's because we are in him and he is immortal. We don't actually get a more totality as an innate quality but as a derived quality from being in Christ, who is immortal, so it says in first John chapter 5 verse 11. I think 12 it says is the message that God is given to us eternal life, but this life is in his son and he that has the son has life. He who does not have the son of God does not have life. So eternal life that we have is only ours in Christ. Those who don't have Christ don't have John that's about all I can say I appreciate that call right already experience Randy from Sue soon city, California how you doing Randy good. Thanks for calling.

Thanks church like a drum devil out… No, I can't find the Scriptures about that some drummers could be from the devil. But I think drum is the eye.

There are many people been influenced by the build offered seminars that may have been before your time if you're young, but okay so now I was young. A lot of people went through the bill got thirds. What is it to Institute of Christian youth conference is basic you comfort him.

Now this guy became a some kind of a Guru.

Too many people and that he had some interesting.

I guess we could say insights about lots of things and and therefore he had a lot of people who really felt like he was the bees knees and that whatever he says to Scripture, which I believe, but he did say he did have let insights into certain Scriptures, but he also said a lot of things that weren't scriptural. Neither neither's new stated nor denied.

In Scripture, one of the things he taught.

As I recall is that when it comes to music, the, the melody of the song appeals to your spirit. And that's good. Peace and harmony appeals to the soul and I don't know if that's good or not.

I like it so good and aunt Betty said, but the the rhythm or the beat appeals the flesh, and so he felt that you know three aspects of music exists. The melody, the harmony and the beat and he felt like the beat is of course from appeals, the flesh, and therefore minutes. It's evil, not not not a single thing in the Bible it would support a notion like that. I mean, I don't know why a person who had so much to say from the Bible would go on say something so extra biblical with any kind of confidence. I don't believe there's any truth in that it all. I'm not saying that my body is like a beat. Sometimes what to say. It's of the flash is is a different thing than than to say it's carnal Flashdance, but something that I am not sure that he would really be capable of providing any Scriptures for that that that paradigm is just man-made and to my mind seems to go against Scriptures to certain degree, for example, Psalm hundred 50 which is a Christian musician you may be familiar with says praise the Lord.

Praise him with in the sanctuary. Praise him in his mighty firmament says praise him for his mighty acts and says praise him with the sound of the trumpet, praise him with the lute and the heart is her stringed instrument. Praise him without him. Tim Burrell and the dancer timber tambourine that's a percussion instrument and dance and a set of people gathered like that. Praise him with its influence praise and with allowed symbols of symbols that's percussion to and with high sounding symbols. Let everything that has breath praise the Lord now at least three percussion instruments are mentioned as David urging ours, not Nestlé.

David doesn't say consolidated, but the songwriter and Psalm hundred 50 is urging people to employ these things in the praise of God. So even I have to say that when I was a youngster I played in a Christian rock 'n' roll band and we had loud drums, loud guitars out everything and a lot of people, especially older people didn't think that was appropriate but we were in plain evangelistic music.

We were we were directly involved in worship and we were actually explaining college campuses, parks and open-air places where unbelievers could hear some of the songs were all evangelistic and frankly the music seem to have an appeal to the people were trying to reach.

Now some could say yeah but appeal to the flesh. Well I don't know if it did or not to tell you the truth that I think when Jesus fed the multitudes. I probably appeal to their flesh to but it doesn't mean that he didn't give them something spiritual at the same time so I I don't think there's any wrong that now when it comes to worship music in the church.

I can't.

I can't be opposed to drums or anything else except that I will say that in modern churches.

It's so very often the case that the music leaders and often it's a whole band with amplified answers even even now amplified drums. A lot of times they drown out the Congregational seem to point where people who actually like to hear congregation sometimes I'm one of those.

I mean I do I'm I'm not against loud music and I'm not against even drums and so forth.

In worship music is not to love, but I I do think that when a worship band is so loud that the congregation cannot really hear their own voices singing. They might encourage muscle sit down and listen to the concert and a lot of that's what I am doing okay. I can't hear my own voice so I don't feel like a part of the congregation singing I feel like I'm listening to the band and you know I've actually been a church is not an oath uses one of those types, but I've been to churches where the band was so loud and they knew it that they had a basketful of earplugs at the door for old colleges like me who come in and who was ears hurt from the loud music and and I always thought they give them away. Earplugs at the door if you want, and I was not save the church money is just turn the music down.

Is there any reason why using Sears appeals to you. We should aim at having church service to God and I think church service for the music drives people away is not really anyway, those are my thoughts about time.

I hope that's helpful to you joining us I'm out of time. Start listening to the narrow path, we are listener supported.

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