Dr. Brown and Dr. Joe Mattera Talk Jesus Principles

My friend Dr. Joe Matera has written a brand-new book Jesus principles really dive into that today stage for the line of fire with your host activist and author, international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown your voice of moral cultural and spiritual revolution Michael Brown was the director of the coalition of conscience have the president of fire school of Ministry get into the line of fire valves like always, 866-34-TRUTH's 866-34-TRUTH euro. Jim is Dr. Michael Brown looking looking friends to the line of fire Michael Brown lighted and last, be with you and the phone lines are open first half hour. I'll take your calls on any subject that relates all to the line of fire, 866-34-TRUTH it's 866-34-TRUTH 87884 Howard R faithful call screener on most days will be great in your calls momentarily just had a computer crash so Howard I trust her there and ready to service our callers 866-34-TRUTH 784 the bottom of the hour and a bring on my good friend and coworker Dr. Joe Matera talking about his brand-new book the Jesus principles lead a life that even death can't stop before we get into your calls before I talked to Dr. Joe I just want to emphasize important doctrinal point. I got a few questions yesterday by some friends and grads and colleagues ask about a message they had heard that denied the idea of penal substitutionary atonement. The idea that Jesus took the punishment for our sins that Jesus was punished with divine judgment so that we would not have to begin the fundamental word for me and all of this is substitution. It's a word that jumped at me decades ago as I was writing an outreach track for my friend Sid Roth, the Jewish outreach track and it was it was going be short just a few pages longer mini book and the interest Mike. We really need this to want to get this out. I said I know I just I can't ride I was waiting for the right sense of what to write when I finally got it. The word that just jumped out to me was substitution and try to open up the gospel through Old Testament sources for a Jewish person, pointing to Jesus as the 1 Who Took Our Pl. 5 years ago. I debated Pastor Brian song on this and and his position was the idea that God would punish his son on the cross made him into a monster. He was a monster. God and I said no it's monster man, our sins are monstrous, and that's the price that the son paid for our redemption and to me it's one of the most fundamental gospel truths that Jesus took our place on the cross that Jesus paid for our sins we send, he died we were guilty.

He was punished.

We received his righteousness he received our guilt. The most extraordinary transaction that ever took place in the love of God and as Paul explains in Romans three. This allowed God to be just and the justifier of the one who believes in Jesus. He was being just and that we say there is a penalty for sin, but now he was justifying the one he believed in Jesus because the payment was made and therefore injustice. He could say you're free to go exhibit. How is that justice is his own son that paid for us. That's justice and mercy together at the same time. All rolled into one and I see this taught most clearly in the Bible and Isaiah the 53rd chapter numbers. This is fundamental we have in the whole Tolman system of Israel with the animal that and without blemish would take the place of the guilty Israelite center.

We have those principles. There, we we see on the day of atonement that that one goat would be slain in the blood would be offered for the sins of the people clients and another goat that cynical scapegoat they would confess the sins of the nation over that goal. It would carry the sins into the wilderness so substitution substitution. The Israelite confessing his sin.

The animal dying.

The priest laying hands on the scapegoat transferring the sin and guilt of the nation. The animal in carrying that away, all as is prototypes is is foreshadowing's of what Jesus would do on the cross. Even the role of the high priest and in a certain level a sin bearing role. It is substitutionary role, although not in the fullness that took place on the cross. Now that reaches its fulfillment through the son of God. I just want to read a few passages to you here let me grab these so starting in Isaiah 53 we all went astray, like sheep. We all have turned her only in the Lord has punished him for the iniquity of us all. We send. He died we were guilty.

He took our punishment. Romans 56. The Messiah died for the ungodly. Romans eight with the law could not do, since it was limited by the flesh, God did, he condemned sin in the flesh by sending his own son in flesh like arson to sins of man and is a sin offering in order that the law's requirements would be accomplished in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the spirit so so here's the point. God condemns sin on the cross in his son.

In in Isaiah. The 53rd chapter it says that it pleased the Lord to bruise him. This was in the perfect mercy and justice of God, the righteous son who is of eternal value and worth. I can pay for the sins of the whole world by his perfection and righteousness dies our place and as he suffers the judgment on the cross and and suffers spiritually speaking separation from God.

On the one hand, God is always God and the father and son always in communion. On another level there. There is some displacement with the sun, say, my God, my God wife you forsaken me just left me abandoned to die. The cross is pointing us to Psalm 22 and the sufferings he is enduring and he is doing this so that the father can say everything is been paid for the cross. Everything is been purchased with the cross. The wrath of God in that sense has been satisfied is only those who reject God's mercy at the cross who will suffer God's wrath in the future. To me it's it's really important foundational document you say yeah but you know I've I've read Christus Victor and and the main emphasis of the cross is the victory of Jesus and things like that.

There is great truth to different parts of the skull Christus Victor. There are various theories of atonement different ones have different aspects of truth, but you cannot get away from substitutionary atonement to me if you get away from substitutionary atonement. You get away from the heart and soul of the gospel message. So these other aspects of atonement are are important and we learn from them.

The Christus Victor view and other things like that. We learn from they supplement or view of the cross and what happened with the death and resurrection of Jesus, but just don't displace substitutionary atonement when you do that, according to my understanding of Scripture you are displacing a foundational document of great importance. All right I am getting go right to the phones because again the bottom of the hour. I can be joined by Dr. Joe Matera, by the way, by the way you see if I can call in no problem an hour and five minutes from now. So 75 minutes, six, 760, only 60 minutes an hour. Note to self 60 minutes an hour, even after the time change. Here we fell back right get gained and out over the week.

Okay 65 minutes from now will be doing a live YouTube check, so will be taking your questions on YouTube that means just post them.

Whatever questions that may be if you're at your work. You can posted you will have to call in so 65 now 64 minutes for no doing YouTube had taken questions there all right. Let us go to the phone. Starting in Houston Texas. Ryan walking to the line of fire.

Thank you Dr. Brown. It great being here.

My question has to do with my meeting with an agnostic friend of mine, you want the study or reliability of any Permit and coordinate betting that the upcoming week, but he brought up something. About if there are any natural testimony correctly at the extra-biblical court. The thing that Jesus did supernatural work, but how early like that. If there was any kind of dental evidence for Jesus doing supernatural work is right you don't have contempt sees the contemporary sources and reports like you have 30 different news channels with video commentary and things like that but you do have later Talmudic references this debate as to whether it's talking about Jesus or not, because the chronology is not perfect but what is constantly attested about him is that he was a miracle worker. They had to say he was a counterfeit miracle worker and in in what's called the toast after which comes from all the early third century's about 200 years after Jesus. There are clear accounts about his followers who were known for healing the sick and driving out demons so it's it's these are other Jews who did this so there are other references their negative.

In other words there there. St. don't let them pray for you, even though they can heal you. That kind of thing, or you Jesus did these things, but he did them by occult power or by the power of other gods or things like that but it seems his reputation was so established in this way that critical scholars genuine generally say that what we what we know for sure is that he was associated with healing and driving out demons and that he was crucified and his his followers claimed that he rose from the dead. Even the most critical scholars tend to say this is pretty much undeniable, what was said about him by his followers, then you have attestation from the outside that others to get this is what is said about him as well and then you have your of the apocryphal accounts outside of the test with those written by believers and that just the those get more more far-fetched here you one thing that made no interest there.

Go ahead. A good is there a good fight online, we would recommend where they would get happy or lift it out for one do you think it actually is a good argument over all I can favorite be. I realize not that the nail in the coffin, but you as the apologetic Radke it it is a good to bring the bike with the beaker and not like my friend, it can be worthwhile ultimately is that I can believe the Bible. The question is why they can believe the external reports know they could just be agnostic about everything but yet it is it is worth saying that he did have a reputation as a miracle worker in the ancient world that that he was widely attested to be a miracle worker, even by critics outside of the New Testament.

That's that's worthwhile. And then I would bring them to contemporary accounts of miracles that are documented scientifically documented and say will consider these the Randy Clark's book eyewitness to miracles is a useful one if it's going in the big subject S Craig Craig Keener's two volumes on miracles. If you are really learn and study yourself Craig Keener miracles in two volumes, but otherwise just get online typing Jesus outside the New Testament and you'll get reference to some books and sources that that you find helpful in this regard, they may the Lord, you should speak to Ryan in late May God himself, his heart and opened his eyes thanks man for and it's the light a fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH here again is Dr. Michael Brown. I posted on Facebook twitter Instagram picture. One of the favorite pictures that we get to take with a new book comes out Job commentaries stacked high on my desk all with a piece of paper them with someone's name and address so those who personalize those of the first envelope may be hundred 25 books that came in from the first edition. From the first printing we number them so some like were breaking strong food. I think were Susan breaking the stronghold of food that's nice on the 400-5500 books to the Joe commentary may be hundred 25 books which thrilled to do so. That means on the way out. Everything is getting shipped out. So if you ordered them so enjoyed multiple copies to give as gifts to the family really pray that you be blessed by the commentary and what you get in your reading it post review on Amazon if you're straight from Austria ordering Christian Booker Summer also regarded that the apologetics conference in Charlotte last month of go ahead, post review on Amazon.

Let others know the book is been a blessing. Same with any of our books if they been a blessing to you. Post review on Amazon that encourages others to look at the book and find out more, plus many times we have people because of the controversial nature of things we address they will just post negative bogus reviews hosta review Zima seven read the book that I just hate me so they post something negative so the the positive truth reviews help balance out those dishonest ones, and by the way, some of this like a book that's their prerogative on some of the ones that are just nasty going to read it. Just don't like you. So this way honest good reviews help balance those out all right 866-34-TRUTH we go back to the phones in Georgia. Jonathan, welcome to the line of fire very well, thank you, really worked on. I'm very appreciative of your your work thing turned on, struggling with the question. The word, but no baby from travel not only want, but I limited the difference between diagnosed and there no hyper grace with what those pictures present. A lot of it fell romantic me like thinking about progressive thinking patient must accommodate most of Mike and Arleta Griffin expected to be more holy yard stuff like that but you have to think for the throughout your life your mind and think like that that mechanic that yes, some of it is semantics, but some of it's very serious and deep differences now was pleased to know what I met with Pastor Joseph Prince was three years ago in Singapore that he's he's would be the best known grace or hyper grace teacher in the world today that he says you can't be more righteous, but you can be more holy. So he believes in progressive sanctification and would take issue say with Pastor Clark Whitten who says that that the teacher progressive sanctification is a spiritually murderous lie. A he he would differ with that. So the first thing is if it's just semantics. Why do some of the hyper grace teachers get so hyper over why did they say it's a spiritually murderous lie water. They say you're missing your your mixing works with with grace. You missed mixing flesh with spirit. So if it's just semantics. Why get so exercised over it. That's the first thing the second thing is, is this it is very easy to just say well I'm perfectly holy. I just have to renew my mind to understand that rather than recognize. Okay I'm living in sin right now and this is displeasing to God. This is breaking my fellowship with God. This is detrimental to my whole life and God and and God calls me to be holy God calls me to come out and be separate. In other words, there are distinct things we are called to do in obedience to God to grow in holiness and if I just think it's a matter of renewing my mind or accepting a certain spirituality, you better believe that such a semantics. Plus the larger hyper grace package that the Holy Spirit will convict me of sin, because I'm I'm ready perfectly holy in my sense of ready been forgiven and I either Sunday for me to confess my sin to God and ask for forgiveness because I'm really completely forgiven those dangerous doctrines that can easily lead to the flesh and backsliding and we see it constantly, even though the hyper grace frenzy a just everyone getting into it. That's deathly calm down and and then some hyper grace. Teachers have modified and clarified some of their teaching. We were there. There was somebody eyesight in the book.

Hyper grace Pastor. She and her husband, pastors, if they were assembling God charismatic Pentecostal. He came into this amazing new revelation of hyper grace bashed me were nasty. The wife was nasty to me over differences. When I asked him under the nose and oh yeah there they become atheists and unbelieving God, the more so II look at this is real real possible open door to backsliding, not just semantics but real error and real serious error potentially go ahead, go ahead. All of the other convicted your guilt. But you are great you know that the word that's used in the Greek is convict.

It's it's the exact same word used in John 16 so everyone it's translated, he rebukes you he corrects you and then look some of them have only started to teach this because of what we expose in some of the error. There they may sing.

There were always teaching about.

Certainly, it became a lot clearer when they were single we have to know about what would Brown is saying he's wrong on this point of that point of it. In point of fact, I talked enough hyper grace practitioners with what I believe is different with them with a belief so let's say that I'm doing something of hard my heart against someone right they sinned against me. They came asked for forgiveness like I can forgive you some real not going to some walking and bitterness towards them and unforgiveness towards them. The Holy Spirit's gonna make me feel uncomfortable.

The Holy Spirit's gonna make me understand I am in sin and and in terms of my fellowship. Jesus is explicit that the father will not forgive my sins enters my salvation returns my fellowship. It will break my fellowship it it it will hurt my relationship with God. At that moment, and when I turn from it all. Experience freedom and forgiveness and and grace flooding my life. It's very clear and Jesus says in in Revelation 319 as many as I love I rebuke. That's the same Greek word for convict.

I rebuke and discipline. Therefore be zealous and repent. So what water they know we were not condemned them, and we've made that clear. Decades before I redressed hyper grace that there is no condemnation in the Messiah that there's a massive difference measuring conviction condemnation, but if they're saying the same thing I'm saying and what's their big Revelation. What's the big teaching what so liberating what so old and dead and destructive about what I believe and so wonderful and new and beautiful about what they believe. Right if it's just semantics are little little different angle and trust never interact with the folks that I was anything but sentiment semantics anything but I doubt all of it. I bet we could be a lot of yeah and again that's the whole thing.

The claimant's new grace Reformation you know trees being revealed. You know it did, Clark Whitten, but you know that or others. In John crowd and say this is near the Reformation did get it right and by the way on things Reformation was perfect and I'm sad we keep growing and learning in the Lord. It's like we just like a loser got his Revelation on face. We got our Revelation on grace and lust of this, but I was downright dangerous and is led to heresy, even some some of the people I quoted in the book authors have now gone heretical and and and to came to me privately and said you know I I don't preach the same thing right I see your point in so we just try to help but let them keep modifying it so that it ends up politically semantics in the end if if they if they fix some of the error in their position that would be that be wonderful. I thank you for the call.

These are serious issues. If you haven't read hyper grace. You'll see why 866-34-TRUTH let's go to California Ted, welcome to the line of fire. One bottle in the current when needed. I don't have the goal of my about my Michael part epic teaching that it brought me cry bonded by the cry and over all of his when at the left upper and those that lets you eat of my questions like my blood researchers question was, he now.

He was sitting there physically with his flesh and blood right if it was literal sent you on my arm.

It was literally to bite my finger was literally center-right mom cut my arm here and suck the blood course was literal gristle is symbolic from the first moment.

That's all think you're eating the bread which stands for my flesh. You're drinking that the wine which stands for my blood pulses and frisk.

It's 11 you show the Lord's death, so you're pointing back to it until he comes so know it's it's with all respect to my Catholic friends. He didn't teach transubstantiation look while he was on the earth. He said my flesh is is meat indeed, and live.

My blood is drink indeed of course it's metaphorical. Of course it symbolic and not only so the end of John six. This is what you do.

If I ascend to heaven when you fight ascend to heaven not hear the flesh profits nothing was what am I get it.

What you do when I'm not here physically. Obviously I'm not talking about literally, even my body and literally drinking my blood.

Obviously it was symbolic from the first moment as you just explain he gave them the bread, gave them the cup does symbolize his body but hate Ted about it, got a guest coming on and he sorry can get you and him in Kansas City doubling tomorrow Wednesday Thursday Friday of this week the Newton, North Carolina on Saturday.

Don't miss these made prior we will file the line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown get into the minor fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH here again is Dr. Michael Brown standard Time.

We will be doing a YouTube chat so that means all your questions, comments, concerns, I'll be answering on you to be on call and on those you just post your questions, comments we get to cover a time of ground that will start less than 45 minutes from now for 15 Eastern standard Time on the taking calls now because I have on the phone with me.

My friend Dr. Joseph Matera's brand-new book the Jesus principles lead a life that even death can't stop. Dr. Matera is a leader's leader he is respected in the city of New York where he's pastored for decades. Brooklyn is respected in the region as a leader of leaders that Austin America around the world and in this book the Jesus principles Dr. Matera opens up for us principles about leadership from the greatest leader the world is ever seen as a leader who led very differently than many others lead a Joe welcome back to 15. Thanks for joining us. Well Dr. Brown at nominal amount about you by your Christ with your to permit your articulation of culture and the application of Scripture to contemporary events so kudos to you.

Have a great worker to roll.

Thanks and I appreciate the kind words. So you been in ministry for decades you been teaching training leaders you've written a lot of books. Many articles what is it that got you in your life and ministry to this particular book. In this particular theme when we began evangelizing in the area of Brooklyn in the argument again, making it realize I was doing that a lot a government would be what I preach on the train so that I don't hurry your group together to gather don't play with them and then I was radically impacted by negativity, where Paul told Timothy to take people aside who were faithful able and willing to communicate the gospel and put bulk of his time to those people and that began to do so we started making disciples based on those who let the Christ of the street and out of that cycle, making agenda church arose several years later. So true truly came out of hard for you of pouring into people one on one to break the cycle so even though Jesus spoke to multitudes, and even though you may have good size crowd you speak to, or various venues we minister the key thing is to pour into those that are going to become leaders, train others point to those who can pour into to others. So if if you break down for us. Say some of the key things you've learned about the Jesus principles that you unpack in this new book by that title.

The Jesus principles what were your top two or three principles of Jesus that you have learned that you have now implemented, seeking to follow his example. Or are you coming out. The body of Christ or 11 years ago.

Were not not able to announce the perfect time because I believe that the Lord are related, highlighting globally challenging the church to go from a convert government rooted model to go from a firm commitment driven program driven to driven and if you look at what you read in The one you should follow me and I will make you become meant that the transliteration of the Greek, meaning process involved. So you become that which God assigned you to walk it and it sure been being an influence for somebody. Influence people for God to catch men for God and so become claim that old book to Jesus principles and then we unpack how you made them became how he released great identity and their assignment by taking them through the process that came not to Bible study but am calling them to be worth him doing life with them which means that discipleship is not just a thought.

Say follow me come to Bible study once a week for an hour come to church for two hours on Sunday and follow me. That powerful. Let me Separate doing life with somebody and discipleship takes an investment of your life into the life of another person in their life into your life is through reciprocal kind of arrangement if they not committed to Bay. I can't always fight for you. You have in the Jesus principles, but you've got 18 chapters understand your God-given identity unleash your potential going to do some understanding affirmation. Jesus affirmed in Jesus corrected have had of these things go hand-in-hand during life with them here to affirm them what they would be in the future.

For example, he told Peter your name but I'm going to change her name now to seek rather your assignment is under John. You shall be called Cephas that John 142 meeting he looked. He was and gave him a new identity to a recalibration inside of him.

That place as a result of being with Jesus.

So there's a process that changes how you view yourself, that enables you to walk in the destiny to garner culture. He did the same thing with Abram in Genesis 17 (no longer be called Abram, but your Abraham.

You are now the father of many nations, and he had to call himself that and everyone around them, and that 25 years until Isaac was so took a community Jesus disciple people, the context of the community can't do, which is one want to be part of the church. Abraham constantly reminded of the stress today to be the father of many nations. Every time someone called him and named him and but at the same token, because Simon was walking with ample opportunity to correct him. For example, when Peter tried to stop them from going to the cross, Jesus actually regularly for me for the things you may not think of God and had no problem correcting rebuking in love disciples but at the same token he told them "to be a change in her identity. He affirm them and even after Peter home to Christ. Jesus looked at him with eyes of love.

It tells us in Luke chapter 2280 him and in John chapter 21. If you love me Peter feed my sheep. He kept on affirming him, even after he fell 30 powerful relation yeah now we see this again with all this commitments serious commitment in this not the kind of thing you could just do the kind of having a social media relationship. From a distance or seeing somebody you know every couple months for an hour to is a serious investment but without that when not going to see the serious progress and transformation that we we long to see you talk about misconceptions about leadership that we often have Jesus told his disciples say that the Gentiles, the pagans, and nations do is certainly we don't do the same with water principles of Jesus leadership that that would be considered revolutionary in the eyes of many very different innovative in the eyes of many, and no army Betty Crocker. No military. He didn't write any book on your rowboat have been written about him than anybody else. Whatever he'd definitely inverted kind of leadership. From what we see in the US the nations world today will value and so is talking about is recorded in Mark chapter 10 the fact that the king loaded her subject, but he said if you want to be the leader of my kingdom. You need to serve that is bottom up.

You don't get elevated if you have a position in the church you're really being made lower the murder of a general term title or responsibility.

I like better.

God is giving you all prophetic letter so you should be more of you should be not an elevation of the body of Christ collected all of the hate responsibility and I'm going to be a greater movement that is one of the most emphatic iterations of how he led the different from today to met affect the words used in the New Testament thousands of time.

Maybe over 200 times the word leaders will you in the US want to have a conference on being a servant. You are very few people attempt but if you say would have a leadership conference, you may have a packed house and it Jesus you influence.

Influence comes from meeting healthy from serving.

It's not a top-down approach but it is bottom up approach of loving serving meeting the needs of people/killing. It's always less killing but then short-term pain long term reward you got for chapters entitled the sign actually the power of the power failure part of delegation power prioritizing the power of community.

The power of secure leadership will come back to some of these, but Joe in order to be a servant, don't you have to be secure in your leadership well leader and you threatened when somebody your mentoring hyperlink "to exhibit dear better equal to yours or even greater than yours exalted in the affected that we will do greater works than him is recorded in John 1412 and insecure leader is the bottleneck of an movement, you will not want people to be in competition with them will be jealous of the pastor.

For example, external concrete is good and better for someone great problem solver, and if someone has a solution to relate to people as good or better than them, but the kingdom leader is somebody I'm so secure themselves that there just wanting to advance God's kingdom, to advance God's glory.

And it's not about them it's about the kingdom of everything and when you secure in Christ. You can exalted the fact that while all these people imploring it to do greater works to Bayesian and at generations from now I'm not here earlier as able to get the space mass. My friends, Jesus, principal, possibly Joseph Matera MATC EERA Joseph Matera.com sun resources.

There is no line of fire with your host activist, author, international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown voice of more cultural and spiritual revolution get into the line of fire now by calling 866. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown I correct website.

Joseph Tara.org I get folks giving up mine wrongly all the time with.comments.org right Joseph Matera MATC TE are a.org lots materials their resources.

You can sign up for many free resources there as well and what I love about documentaries material many things.

I love there is always maturity and depth and scriptural soundness and wisdom.

But what he lays out his practical sonic okay and I read the book, how do I do it.

The book will tell you how to do it, and ensure heart is as well and Joe him in the book you you tell the story of a young man named Christian. You say, when I saw Christian walk into our church. I didn't see her father. This purposeless Hispanic teenager, I saw an emerging leader with the potential to be a world changer.

Now this young man has grown into being a key leader in many ways. How does somebody do that how you not to see with the naturalize and how to get God's perspective because often we stumble in stock is what we see outwardly the packaging is in good with maturity is in there and and we, turn away and don't give more time but from God's light like that's going to be a world changer hat how you get that vision. How do you see that there are all part of the discipleship process, we have to say things about people that they can't see in themselves. As we grow in the Lord as we know Scripture we know his heart.

And as we get sent to the spirit through prayer, growing servant, we could actually get it sent what God's call people to do would be an even just telling them the call to be a son of God, you know, meeting a child of God is revolutionary, you know, but we could see beyond that and show them what things God has in store for people pointed out, not detail, and when I saw Christian. It was a fatherless young man, his father died, Woody's girder young and in part of the process was. I had a brief father every parent him. He was brought up by wonderful mother Betty father and his life was brought up in a house he lived with us for seven or eight years.

We helped get them through college age issues and things like that in you became a leader in our church and he just became an amazing leader, amazing preacher.

He was sent out about four or five years ago and he'll plant a church that is now planted five or seven churches does preaching seminars that denominations like foursquare and others are now utilizing for their whole movement as he teaches churches had a race of creatures so that they could plant more churches, the phenomenal speaker, but when I saw him. He didn't think anything about himself God call on my life and pour into him and kinda like re-present Jesus in him.

Bring me by telling him things about his life that he did say again, you know, that's all. These people need. They need affirmation. They need a hug. They need some time to you to be a surrogate father and the mistake pastors make a lot of times they think they can make disciples from the pulpit.

Very few people will ever be disciple just by hearing messages. I also think they could farm somebody out role of the Bible school Lord institutionalize discipleship by having what say Wednesday night Bible Institute or Bible study is nothing to take the place of being like a spiritual parent to somebody or being a big brother bringing them into your life, bringing them into family and part of how we did it in our community is our house was always told people that needed more than a Sunday meeting the gangs in my community, which are not present anymore. We got there negated.

They had gang communities that provided something for these young men, 24, seven, seven days a week. If all I had was a Sunday meeting on a once a week. I would've lost all so have to go beyond weekly institutional meeting or program have to do life with them yet. Since the new book the Jesus principles lead a life that even death can't stop six and Joe just something really interesting here, and I'm always curious to see who wrote endorsements to buck you got many great endorsements present who wrote the forward to the books and books of Ford so I look at who wrote the forward and I wasn't familiar with the man's name of Seth. I lived in a certain area releasing communities I would've known his name, but this is a remember speaking of that, that he ends up being so transformed and discipled and growing into a calling God that he ends up writing a forward for the book we talk about doing these very things. I mean that's living testimony.

Is it not your I wanted to write the forward even though he is not nationally known because I wanted people to see firsthand that what is being coordinate work.

I also have my biological son Justin Wright: write an endorsement basically is that your spiritual children at your biological is a reason why have my son Jason write the forward for my book walk generational blessings and son Justin wrote a chapter in that book so I want them to see that this stuff really works and they have their firsthand accounts from people who been impacted by the principal and friends. Let me encourage you to buy a copy of this book. The pastor give great guest and it's a kind of thing that most pastors attesting to say love them love the Lord. They love the flock they want to see people grow in the Lord and yet there's a there's a place for a Sunday morning services in worship and preaching. There's there's a place for Libby since a place for Bible schools but none of it takes the place of the deeper relational discipling. All right friends get to get the book for the content but couple more chapters. The power of failure.

We just want to hear.

Like the good stuff all the good stories were where does this fit in the power failure is far as a Jesus principle of leadership training yeah well you look at Scripture you will find life stories of failure, and even reading about people being lonely feeling like God. Yet these are inspired Rick that are incorporated into the canon of Scripture just as much as Romans chapter 8 about a conqueror through Christ. The rift of a theology of failure, pain and suffering which goes along with how to make disciples because without discipled to fail where to fill them.

And we have to learn how to fail forward.

We have to understand how God redeems every situation even failure. We don't try to fill on purpose, obviously, but if we do what we do, God will use it and can you imagine if the scientists failure the way we the church.

Sometimes failure sign will probably fail in their hypotheses 500 times before they prove the theory if they threw away the previous 500 test never come to the correct conclusion that they were looking for and so they look at failure as part of the process to come to a solution to their hypotheses until after we have to look at failure.

Not that we want to fill on purpose, and we don't want our life in general to be a failure.

But part of the process is by learning walking with people where going to use some of their faults is teaching moments to Help Them Get Better Pl. in Christ and friends is even that illustration that was just given about the scientists ministered to me just to think about the things you seek to do for God and obey God, and you take steps and you see some of the results you expect within you don't see others or you fall short hearing.

Yet the these things that that look like stumbling blocks can become steppingstones in God and by the way, after chapters, understanding, struggle us in the future understand spiritual sorry the power of prayer ending well is a chapter on transformational questions to ask yourself, and then at appendix were things laid out really simply 10 proven effective ways for making disciples, but Joe chapter 18 transformational questions to ask yourself give an example of one we got only about 2 1/2 minutes left, but one question that I can ask myself, they could be life-changing in front of me, remember? I believe one key question is am I aware do I really know what motivating me in my being led by the spirit or by being driven by an you know where my getting my identity from another question is coming from, but I accomplish oriented coming from who I am in Christ or even Jesus didn't do a minister told her he heard the voice of his father say my beloved son in whom I'm well pleased. So the following pleased Regina before he healed before he prayed for every three minutes to report to the cross so he ministered out of the fact that he knew God loved him not to try to get God to love him and this is all part of the Jesus principles about effective thing about this book is loyalty of the books are written were primarily written leaders for everybody because not to surpass it because everybody make disciples whether he going to church every single you can even use this to raise your children. You could use this for you as you produced anything to get going because to Jesus principle working every situation in every country, every culture and every generation time approach on the books aloud like I've never seen any books I've written that sold out so quickly we can keep up with all the sales right now it's just really hit the mark.

That's always an amazing sign when you see it and friends super practical get it for yourself for your own growth in the Lord to help you make disciples of others. It's the calling that we all share in there's no calling. More important than that, and then get a copy for your pastor's gift as well. Dr. Joe Matera the website Joseph Matera MATC ER a.org. Thanks for being with us manner the Lord blesses book unless