Wisdom for the LDS Missionary

Beginning with all things were made through him and without him was not anything made that was made in him was life and the life was the light shines in the darkness and the darkness has not overcome it. We were all born and raised in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, headquartered in Salt Lake City, Utah, commonly referred to as the Mormon all of us have left that religion have been drawn to faith in Jesus Christ based on biblical teachings name of our podcast outer brightness reflects John 19 calls Jesus, the true light gives light to every we have found life beyond Mormonism to be brighter than we were told in the light, we have is not our own.

It comes to us from without. Thus, outer brightness. Our purpose is to share our journeys of faith in what God has done in drawing us to his son. We have conversations about all aspects of the transition fears, challenges, joys, and everything in between were glad you found us and we hope you'll stick around listening. However, this podcast from post-Mormons who are drawn by God, to walk with Jesus rather than turn away out of sound brightness brightness wailing and gnashing of teeth. Here except for Michael's angry that is angry that is angry.

That is why Matthew, the nuclear columnist Michael BX Mormon apologist Paul Bunyan going on mission is one of the most iconic parts about being a latter-day St. when your child.

You idolize the missionaries sing songs like I hope they call me on a mission you spend your life preparing dreaming of going and watching the relatives leave for two years only to come back more mature and stalwart in their faith in the moment finally arrives and you get the call to go somewhere foreign and exciting to preach the restored gospel is an experience like no other. The bond you make with your companions. The heartfelt discussions with investigators. The strange foods you have to eat often members of the LDS faith feel closest to God during these missions and are filled with spiritual experiences that bolster the faith of the missionaries all Matthew and I all had the opportunity to serve two-year missions for the LDS church.

In this episode will be setting up a hypothetical situation will be asking the question what if our younger missionary cells knocked at our doors.

What we say to them now that we've crossed over to the other side. All right, Paul, in Matthew tell me again where you served what language you are speaking and tell me about the strange foods that you were fed on your missions. First, the first is probably probably at some weird stuff on your mission so you know I like all it will follow that act so so I served in the Belgian Brussels Netherlands mission, but if there's two different languages and I mission so one side the northern side which included the Netherlands and the West northwestern part of Belgium. They spoke Dutch and the southern part southwestern and southeastern part skews me of Jim. I was called wall money in the northern part of France there was an admission that was the French-speaking side sized so I served in the French-speaking side, although I did serve as office missionaries was able to visit several Dutch speaking cities which is pretty cool and I got stuck with a lot of those missionaries there and I also served in Brussels where, since it was an international community because they have the European Union that is also a lot of English-speaking All-Americans in military and things of people that visit there. So we are in an English-speaking branch, but then they mixed it with the French-speaking branch so half the branch couldn't talk to the other half the work and talk to the other half awards of, mess is an experiment at it like they're literally merging the two at the time so like I was able to like that sought side spoke English and French in and that's out so mostly French stars. The weirdest thing I so a lot of the people that we taught a lot of the members were from Africa. So I think the weirdest thing I had wasn't it wasn't Belgian food was something I think they were there from Congo and I think it was some Tripe some kind of black cow intestine type thing and I never had that before my life, and the date it was really good because ice soaked it in this really spicy sauce. I like the soft part, but eating it tasted like your chewing bubblegum but then you're supposed to swallow it, which is a really weird combination. You know that the texture of bubblegum to swallow it.

So yeah. Is this really strange is like when you bite into it.

Your teeth bounced back. You know is like chewing on rubber bands, the sales probably the weirdest thing I so you cheat on rubber bands. Yeah the central cool. So first there have like escargot yeah so you can buy it even you know how you can have like the Walmart brand products. You know the cheap stuff left so we bought his faith in circa four I bought some dislike cheap brand escargot and you put in the put in the oven. Cook Alani Triton is pretty good so hunting is only time I had it when Angela and I were first married and will disclose to taste of Cincinnati festival downtown and all the local restaurants come out and put them to loosen up a couple of bucks to try different foods. There is a pretty fancy French restaurant that had a business down there. Selling escargot and I never had. Angela never had a summer like well, why not try something new. So I think that my three dollars for some escargot ice.

I took one and started to chew on it and it was the most bitter horrible thing had an interest in my life and it was like it was when I described Angelos was lecturing on those rubber balls and get out of the machines and she she one of the tribes. I know you don't want to try to talk so it was a waste of three dollars per similar situations have any like herbs or flavors of the fire is just straight escargot must have missed whatever the flavor was and is very bitter so is typically put some kind like butter garlic or something on there to make it more tasty benefit was super bitter amateur thought event probably tried again, so to question Michael. I served and hungry spoke Hungarian language and there was one mission in Hungary had been split off from the Austrian mission. I think they started sending missionaries in the hungry, and in any nine from Austria and then I think 91 is when it was actually split office at submission 93 I can remember exactly, but I look couple of things little strange that I want one was some but is not really strange thing like a cherry soup selector called fruit soup was cooked, but then they would let it get cold unit and I really like that went to the branch's surveillance of the study presents house for a meeting one time and she was making cherry soup but it wasn't until the next day mission, fed us, and should invest some cherries that she had left over to my companion at the time did not like cherries.

And of course missionaries are taught to whatever you're given and don't don't don't offend people. So he was like member cherries. I like your cherries getting choked up a bowl of cherries is literally choking down. I was like that, but the strangest thing is probably first they make us assume using carp because it's a very cheap and available fish for them to use them basically just throw it in their hole and cook it up with a bunch of paprika and other spices it ends up being really spicy. I actually didn't mind it too much, but like everything in their lifetime balls and productive organs and everything), the Supreme Court in their hands. There was this one investigator teach English to her daughter and teacher discussions in the last area and so I had a great time and I was for those who don't know a grandson manumission.

I first met first area and I'm in my last area and go home Tuesday night going to just this young girl English mom would cook us dinner and she would put our names into a hat and then she would draw the decision got to pick what you made for dinner the next week so she got my name one time and it chose fish soup because I was messing with my granny and telling them you have to try this time. Well, she my name one time you try so when she put my name on I told her I wanted for student she was surprised because usually missionaries don't want that mission made at the next meeting just so happened that my granny was not with me splitting the different missionary that week so this other Elder had to go with this soup and he was not happy about it is like what's this and she's like productive organs of fishing was like all this horrible form that's my story. While real quick to like there is another meal that came to my mind is also African metro is stranger than the tribe, but it was deftly awesome and weird but it was is called froufrou I don't that's actual name of it but we just called froufrou and like so Africans by these big bags of froufrou flour and it's like you just basically mix it together and become like a paste. Almost like you got fried up and up and the skillet at some oil and think is is water and I don't see making some kind like bread and put into a pan right in the catalytic set skillet set for a while that kind of really comes up and then you make soup with it, which usually consists of like some kind of meat like beef or pork or something and then you mix it with tomatoes and vegetables and he also put peanut butter there some kind of weird but I think in public, fish sauce, or whatever you else you want in there and then you mix all up and then you take the food foods like you take this scrape with your fingers.

The food from flour.

It's cut like a paste kind of stuff and you can mix it in with the soup and eat it that way. Always awesome is good stuff.

But like it is almost like hardens in your stomach, you know, it's also to get a Brix member so we met once in our apartment with like six missionaries really do froufrou flour in the soup so good, but only just like all crashed in our beds for like an hour and 1/2 slept for like half of RP day just because yes is too intense to me carves a. While I Michael soon I could not answer this question I just I feel bad because I'm I can have as cruel of an answer is, so I went to Anaheim, California, and I learned how to speak English but I was out there and so yeah eat a lot of normal food. The whole time I was out there remember one of my families friends came and visited the ward I was serving you and they went back and saw my parents and they only cause you know how's Michael looking in the like, well fed guy got fed by the members. Pretty much every night like there was never any any wondering when my next meal was going become so yeah I think the weirdest thing that is probably a tossup. There were some other cultures out there, so it's not like I never came across food that I wasn't used to, but Kim she is with that but Korean cabbage kinda – very right sure what they do with that I but it's it's very very strange.

I didn't like it but the thing that really took the cake was a piece of Mongolian cheese. The somebody gave me and my companion is aware this lady's house were talking to her actually run a piece of Mongolian cheese.

More like yes that sounds great. So it was so dry that it's like it's locked our mouth like dry like just eating it just like trying to see this stuff down. It was just very very tasteless. Unlike why we couldn't swallow it. I just left it in my mouth, trying to be polite and so we walked out and then we both spat it out only one think this is sounds like a drug deal. She's probably just looking for a way to get rid of its and she saw some slick I can pass the curse on them. So yeah, I'm sorry if any of the listeners love scenes from Mongolia yet wasn't the best experience for me daily study.

What animal and from that is a good question, no, but I don't think it was from a cow or go or anything you forgot the site was like something weird like mac & cheese or something they didn't tell me at all aware that she's the animal just the region that it came from but if I had to guess it was something extinct historic that's probably goat or something like that go cheese yeah right next question guys.

I would ask this one seen Nepal first. Would you say to yourself, if you came over as a missionary and it was your first day out on your mission related question because a lot of times as much unlike the Mormon story is good to see people talk about their missions and sometimes the really angry and feel like it was a waste of time. I don't feel that way about my mission at all. I think it was a good opportunity for me to get out into another culture and learn to love and serve people. And so what about I would say to my younger self. If I can cross myself on oriented missionary really on their first day.

My first whatever is just to love people learn to serve people in a lot of letter young kids go out on special.

I was out lobby entrance when out because of societal pressure cultural pressure within the obvious church and it might not have been something chosen for themselves. If you took away that cultural pressure that was certainly the case for me. I went out because it was something my mom taught me for a long time was really important to do so I would.

I would tell my younger self to love people serve people and pay attention to people because I came across people who God used to teach me things that were important so all right what about you, Matthew saw great advice. I would see for me personally to give advice myself for not starting on my first day I really struggled with early struggled with feelings of inadequacy was also really, I was told by lots of people mistreat like wow you've only been in France for a week and 1/2 or two weeks like your French is great.

It always complement me on how I was able to speak French but I could. I can understand the word anybody said you know I like at least six months before it even starts. Put sentences together because French is so fluid you know it. So the words go. It's hard to parse out every individual words such as took me so long to figure what they're saying.

So I just really struggled with depression and like I cried a lot. My first transfer so I'll probably just tell myself just not to worry about it you know just it'll come in time. The language comes in time. You know that's just one barrier that takes time to get over it just also just take the time to like Paul said, you know, really try to interact and really try to understand the people you're talking to. Assuming I tried, but that the language barrier just kind of pushed me estimate you have kids there sale went to stuff and then I was like okay so I'm assuming you said you had kids, try to continue the conversation wanted to relate out there saying Beatrice will try to connect to people in and not worry so much about you know, making sure you try to save everybody because I feel like there's this huge weight of like I've got to preach the gospel on know their salvation is on my hands and I don't do well enough, then back at me. Mine condemnation so just know it's not worry about so much. Just enjoy the experience and take the time. Do you know the proverbial smelling the roses you enjoy your experience taking the time to enjoy the culture to learn about the people on try to find time to have some fun learning in outgoing museums or whatever. So much so there's only PAs were, you know, I was worried and do the kind of stuff. There were PAs, were we did go visit cathedrals and historical siteson my most memorable time so deftly take the time to appreciate the culture and visit when you can decide. That's one of my favorite things as they were. There were days when it is and I'll go out on the island and play frisbee golf or do things like upward basketball. But a lot of times we would go to museums or girls were the communist Dr. Parker whatever slicing definitely. Those are some of my best memories of my favorite experiences was when we visited a Holocaust Museum outside Brussels and I mean it wasn't a pleasant experience is very humbling that they had like pictures of people that were in the hot know that were at the concentration camp and they had audio to interviews of people after they left, and experiences they had and it was intense, but you know it's like, that's why I just don't get Holocaust deniers. It's like I've been there, you know, I've seen the concentration camps.

You know can't deny the history so I think that something that we in our generation leads a tap into is just connecting to history. Good answer was because those kind of thing about this team and connect echo what you are saying Matthew, I had a lot of feelings of inadequacy to not really didn't speak the language because that I had down you know. Mostly I was the company with this trainer named Elder Dana's and he was just a beast but he was also so bold, so persuasive United CM talk to people's doors. Unlike humans never got turned away by people and no matter what their objections were. He would just find a way to turn it around and start talking to them like man you he baptize so many people in my comes, I'm never going to add up to these other missionaries that are out here in you have a lot of members of my family that just have these crazy experiences on the mission that had younger brothers that had the blessings said they were going to have all these miracles on their missions. And unlike the others, all this pressure on me to be this amazing missionary and I just didn't believe that I could be.

So I think the first thing I would probably tell myself is just to stop doubting myself so much. I just had a lot of self-doubt and just I'm probably just tell Mike tell me you know you really teach just as well as as these other missionaries by the end of this you know just just give yourself time so I think that the main thing that's really the main thing I would tell myself at any stage of my life is just you know don't doubt yourself so much. Don't you just don't ruin yourself like that, but the other thing that I would encourage him to do is to start diving into the Scriptures. I think it was probably 3 1/2 months into my mission when I really take an interest in it and you know I really go that deep into the doctor right away.

But what if nothing else, I would encourage my younger self to really start studying the Scriptures and finding the answers that just knowing how much I would love it later. You know what an impact that would make inside probably just want to get that ball rolling a little bit more. I think that's what I would tell me on my first day as mentioned in the Scriptures because I mentioned before that but I'm set a goal for myself to meet all the standard workflows on my mission to see us that that process of studying through the Old Testament and New Testament sitting through the Bible really for the first time meeting every page and every story and there was a different experience than it ever had before and it changed me just written the foundation. I think an understanding both my religion is latter-day St. Anthony's how things help Christians and things differently so speaking of Christians Matthew asking first, but did you did you encounter Christians on your mission.

If so, how do they treat you and what was your impression of them. One is reading this question. I was thinking back in its basis the fog of time, but I don't really remember having a ton of conversations with Christians. I do remember I had conversations with Catholics and most of them were kind of nominal Catholics cultural Catholics. I do remember going to think it was some kind of Pentecostal church invited us to a service of their so I tended that we don't really have any deep theological discussions, we can adjust attended. I didn't know them personally is another missionary and are district that got the invite suite was so I went with them yet. I remember while conversations with Christians. So I do remember proselyting on the street one time and so I just quoted two escalations, 18 through 10. I think it was you know the one where Paul says know if you preached lift preach any other gospel now which we have given to you, let him be accursed.

I think they just they didn't even save the did anyone read the passage they just said the reference Galatians 18 or 10 like okay I have a good day and I looked it up later.

Like okay so yeah I don't have much of an impression. To be honest because I didn't really interact with any really know Christians were really stronger really, really hard-core in their faith like us consent suddenly have much impression as I mentioned before that the Southern Baptist convention had their meeting in Salt Lake City that I was leaving on my mission and so going door to door rethinking at the time that that was persecution in some I don't know why I thought that because I'm at the same time was going door to door with C missionaries serving in Salt Lake City is kind of like a training opportunity for those who were getting ready to leave so I don't know why I saw this persecution but I did so my my impression of Christians was that they didn't think we were Christians is latter-day Saints generally don't and in terms of how they treated me on my mission.

It's a mixed bag.

I don't know that I could ever say a Christian slammed the door in my face.

I did get the door slammed in my face a lot but I don't know if those people were actually Christians know that that the actions did last generally long enough for me to know for sure whether they were Christians or not. A lot of what we got because areas use is largely Catholic. There's some pockets of new trainers and there there's one sitting. Debits in this very Calvinist very reformed and go knocking on doors and get will be called.

A lot of times the double back L like her hand like this, like Catholic enough of this without killing most times from people who were religious in some way, but there was one time when attracted into attracting and knocking on doors knocked on the door of a guy who was a Lutheran pastor and he invited us and was, like the proverbial Bible – session for a couple hours with him is very strident so that was that as a negative experience but it was still an experience that that I came away with realizing that there's some areas where I really couldn't defend my faith time when attracted into young Baptist couple.

They were also man's husband and wife and I had a young child he was a Baptist missionary in the city where I was serving at the time and they were very kind to us. They invited us in and he opens the Bible and talk about Grace for an hour or so and I remember leaving that meeting with him feeling completely different than the meeting. I've had with the pastor.

He was very kind and willing to patiently try to teach us the doctrines of grace and I was thankful for that.

I left that that meeting with him. I was in some ways questioning I left that meaning with him feeling like that I didn't have the truth so most cases, they treated us very well. There were some some Bible bashing experiences, but for those people who I got to know were Christians in some way they treated us very well and the people that I met had been baptized. All the guests from the Catholic Church which is horrible accordance Mormon ghosts there's one gentleman that I can think of in particular was very very kind and was for many many years working in like directory that has Catholic Church working with priests. He was very soft-spoken, very kind man really appreciated the friendship that I developed with him. So was that was a Lutheran is a Lutheran pastor was he the one that showed you the book from like the Dead Sea Scrolls. Remember from your story yeah I know he's not that guy. We never had any interaction with that guy other than just that.

The front window of his house when he did not. That packet of photocopied papers that was the war scroll from the Dead Sea Scrolls so other than getting that from him returning at the next day and giving them a book of Mormon we never had any interaction with him SO you don't know if he is Christian or not. Either okay well yes so there were a lot of Christians on my mission where I went and I think a lot of the reaction I got was pretty negative. Initially just to see people watch me from the doorways of these judge mental stairs and they wouldn't interact. For the most part are just contactors real briefly the door and end the conversation and close the door as fast as they could. So no real positive view of Christians.

In fact, I thought that they were lazy that they didn't really have very much conviction nor care about the commandments of God that much.

You know the work certainly won't like us latter-day same's know there is a lower level they were terrestrial. You will be were good people, but you know if they weren't so lazy they would join the church so that I met my friend Eddie Noxon and he debated us for several hours and I left.

Same thing as Polly. I didn't think the church was true anymore and I can awaken and start studying and kinda figure out how to start defending my faith in preparing for these dialogues and I had a really low view of Christians. After that debate will negatively and I started almost equating them with Satan like their Satan's minions. You know they are what makes them dangerous is that there's so close to the truth, but it still you know a false gospel in the trying to bring people like me out of the church to believe in Protestantism and actually have this dream and this should illustrate just how much I distrusted Christians, but agreement we are in our apartment always missionaries and then there was a knock in the Christians came in and you like to since Amelia had to go to the bathroom and they let me leave the apartment so I like walked out and it was those apartments are.

There's a hallway like I was still indoors sorting when I laughed and I heard screaming inside like them yelling at each other and so I looked through the keyhole and I saw the Christians pull out guns and shoot the other missionaries you know I woke up and I'm just like you like to tell you like a Mike. You know they might act nice, but deep down you only have this message of death, and they are trying to pull us down to hell with them so yeah just a really low view of Christians, even the whole dialogue, I thought like silly omissions like only have we heard about Christians doing something like this and they just cornered the missionaries and persecuted them. And that's what I thought was can happen to them like they're gonna put us in the corner there gonna throw fruit Madison and call us names and is seen heading like people drive by us on our bikes and they just kinda yell out the car windows like Jesus is just like like you know or they just yell things out of this, but not actually have conversations like Satan lied to Adam and Eve when he said they could become God's dislike is that is this all Christianity has to offer. Just yelling from cars and from the other side of the street, but not being willing to engage in actually finally did the dialogues in his 20s. After that a lot of the Christians in the neighborhood recognized me like my friend Eddie Noxon that I was the celebrity missionary that was what he dubbed me and so will start letting me in their houses because the they knew me from the dialogues and so I she started to get to sit down and talk with Christians a lot more and my mission, my perception completely changed yet I couldn't deny that Christians are good people actually really liked them a lot so I trust that I didn't have those fears and concerns I had earlier on in my mission but I still thought that they were your little lazy, and obviously had a false false gospel and you know were just a little bit special. That way just to clarify doing we save other lazy is because he thought like him.

They just don't want to give up their tea and coffee and like all their simple stuff that Christians can do or was it just like all they don't have as many commandments as we do ordinary know they don't do as many charitable works as we do not think it was it was a little bit like the second thing you're saying like they don't have as many commandments. It's like the gospel light.

Basically, they couldn't keep all these commandments if they had them and I talked to some crazy Christians on the street were, you know that they're like oh were saved on my what we do and I just kill somebody and you'll still go to heaven just go like hijack a plane and and kill everybody on board and there like you Mike okay sounds like you in my mind like the commandments mean nothing to these guys like it doesn't matter to them at all. The you know, so I tosses you Latter Day Saints is being more clearly than Christians because we actually uphold God's law and we care about it and I thought that they did but just you know to what extent you know I just didn't extend anywhere near as far as us and yet they didn't do as many charitable good works. You know if there was a natural disaster. We were the ones out there. Mormon helping hands, you know, helping everybody rebuild after after any disaster. But I may make sense because we are churches. A lot of money and is capable of doing a lot of stuff like that.

Does that answer your question. Matthew is that there's a quote right to paraphrase Excel exact, but something about like religion doesn't require everything of its people is not capable of providing salvation to them or something like that, a religion that does not require the sacrifice of all things never have the power to grant salvation or yeah that's pretty close yet so that that in our mission is largely Catholic mission. We had this this feeling of superiority make fun and all they only show up to church on Christmas and Easter. You know they can't Bother themselves come out to church every week and things like that.

We had some negative news so yeah old man.

I was kind of a brat as a missionary.

By the way I wrote this entire song about born-again Christians to make fun of them so like some of the lyrics were born again, saved from sin. Fornication saved from sin never going to have to work again hallelujah a man my brothers in jail. My sister Gabe were all saying so that's okay hallelujah amen when you read James we get mad because I works of all that bad, hallelujah is when on for like 20 minutes. I don't even remember lyrics now. I just just goes to show like I do something were ridiculous essay reminds me of some conversations we've had recently.

But not the name drop interesting – like a soundtrack yeah yeah so soundtrack someone else probably pick up that song now in yeah that's going to be used against us. So thanks a lot this is going to go triple platinum owner was a South Park episode because it was a Christian music. They couldn't go platinum that can only go gold, frankincense and myrrh go double murder Bill good. You just need Nick human eyes or something to do backup vocals and I think you think the good yeah and somebody else to do. Primary vocals all right. So next next question. How would you treat your younger self and dismantle your preconceived notions about Christians I think it's Matthew's turn to answer first so I can silently interact with a lot of really faithful Christians. Most of them are kind of nominal Christians or nominal Catholics so most of my ideas about work of Christians were that they were kind of just naïve or they were ignorant of the fullness of the gospel that there were probably probably had good intentions, so that they just didn't have the fullness of God's revelation to man so I would kind of explain myself because I had this notion in my mind that Christians read the Bible. They probably enjoy the Bible what they don't really understand the Bible because I know that I read Bruce R. McConkie a lot before my mission and one thing he would repeat always works is that you can't truly understand the Bible in its fullness. Unless you see it through the lens of the restoration so you kind of have to have that understanding of the restored gospel as taught by the Latter Day Saints church to understand what the Bible says so.

I thought the Christians probably read the Bible and they like to put it in really understand it, so it kind of explain myself I was younger like hey you know Christians really do study the stuff in depth. A lot of times, a lot of them study it from the original languages going to exegetical theology which is just reading the Bible passage by passage and really pulling out what it teaches, rather than trying to force your views into the Bible they really want to extract what the Bible teaches, and they also do a lot of expositional preaching, where they would just know go through passerby passage since the start, I would introduction to the book to give you the context and they go in all verse by verse and just go through and say what the authors saying so a lot Christians do that kind of preaching in and it's really commendable so so it kind of try to give myself a higher view of Christians in less of a kind of view of Christians as being naïve or ignorant to the extent the very knowledgeable about all many of them are very knowledgeable about their faith.

That's not the case. Obviously for everybody who professes Christ, but that's probably the biggest thing on site and also I kinda probably had similar ideas that you did Michael where kinda like the antinomian idea that you don't have to really keep God's law that doesn't really matter and I left, my view was to allow Christians. I thought water saved by grace. So what's the point of commandments sought kind of try to explain to my former self. That the Bible teaches that you're saved by grace alone through faith alone in Christ alone. But once you're saved are called to live a life of holiness are called to live in dye to your sins and to pick up your cross and follow Jesus. So if you really are a follower of Jesus, you should be keeping the commandments are striving to keep the commandments.

So that's without explain yeah I think I just can't be overstated. The importance of explaining the Latter Day Saints that we do believe in a process of sanctification.

I think a lot of them just goes over their head, don't realize that week, except that you have one Latter Day Saints just going after me like all week discussing OC and you believe that your saved life's easy. You don't have to struggle with sin anymore and I think that's I've never said that is certainly not what I believe. So I think that's a really good way to go if you're not struggling with sin, you may have to ask yourself in early Christian because I don't think you ever stop struggling with sin. It's a struggle everyday.

Amen to that. So how much you must know yourself and dismantle preconceived notions about Christians talk little bit about how sometimes Michael is US similar Christians yelling from across the street or not really engage just can't have short statements they would make to try to challenge them but not really interact the Christians that I was on my mission really made an impact were the ones who invited me in and show hospitality within their home and I don't think they compromised anything by that. I have seen Christians use second John chapter 1, 7 to 10 witnesses for seniors and going out into the world. Those who do not confess the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh. Such a one is a deceiver and the antichrist want yourselves may not lose what we have worked for me when a full reward. Everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ does not have God abides in the teaching has both the father and the son. If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive them into your house and greeting for whoever grants and takes part in his wicked works so soon. Christians use that passage as a reason to not interact with LDS missionaries all not invite them into their home and soon some suggested fixed its justification for treating them poorly and ice strongly disagree with that. That approach to two second John one, 7 to 10 very specific teachings within that passage that John is warning his readers to avoid and not have any interaction with. I don't think those teachings letters that are listed there are teachings that the Latter Day Saints are generally generally trying to bring and and also say like I said the one the Christians who had the biggest impact on me is a lot of your submission were the ones who treated me with hospitality to their home taught me from the Bible and I know you know us as the C mission. You're told you're not going out to be taught going out to teach and Latter Day Saints that's that's why you end up with Bible bashing situations because missionaries don't want to hear necessarily what what a Christian is saying to them, but I think it's important for Christians to find a way to interact with C missionaries in positive ways. Michael and I talked about sometimes when you done that since you become a Christian. So that's that's why would trade with hospitality and vitamin Bible with them and challenge them to think through some things teach them grace, having just come to my mind when you were saying that all is a member and I remember being on a mission in and get moved around so much. You know you not around your family.

The friends that you do make on your mission you get moved. And then there out of your lives and so I think that a lot of these missionaries are desperate for the ability to connect to somebody and mean. I think they want people invite me to their house and they showed me hospitality was amazing and so goes Christians have the biggest impact on me as well to sometimes. Sometimes a companionship to pay shipping to missionaries or sometimes three missionaries sometimes Christians are talking to missionaries. Our members were talking to missionaries. Sometimes it seems like everything's going great with the companionship you know to get along elders. Everything is going great.

But then, behind the scenes, you know there's there's they just don't.

I just, I mean, you guys probably experience to do there just some companionship swearing you got a long unite clicked. Sometimes word just there's a clash in your personalities or something that just doesn't work in the fact that you're with them 24 hours a day seven days a week.

You Be away from your companion, except for on rare occasions like exchanges and things like that. You just cut a grade on each other's nerves and just having the experience of going to a members house or going to an investigator or just a non-Christian someone that invites you in just to chat and or give you meal. You didn't have to have a meal just have a discussion. Sometimes I was just like everything I would just look for to that every week just because the rest of the week was just so difficult trying to love my companion trying to get along with my companion and not really having any other relationship other than that sought meeting other people and in the cabin. Having this experience is like explain my gorgeous like they just, that's me. My weekend. I struggle a lot with depression.

My mission and there were a lot of times where I just told myself I was wasting my time is wasting my money and my parents money because missionaries up to finance themselves out there like just go home and I just wasting your time is just no point and so yeah just like those tiny little tokens of mercy and that people would give me.

You know, just a meal or just ask me. Sincerely, how you doing and are you struggling with something in your mission you know you know just just wanting to show Karen show show affection for missionaries because the people you know that ultimately people sometimes like to think of Mormons as far missionaries as robots or something like that, you know, like all their just agents of the devil and we just you know, we just don't. We should talk to them should relate to them. Like Paul explained, but the people in the you know that feelings and have struggles and I think if you try to connect in some way and that currently connection from the bridge with them. Yeah is to like about things to experiences that stand out to me where a Christian really shifted the paradigm of what I thought about them and one I mentioned was on the podcast before but we moved on to Christian women that were walking and we tried to reach Mormonism to them in and they were just really nice is like oh you know what we as a church we pray for you guys. Every Sunday and of course I knew that they were praying for us to be successful in our missionary endeavors or anything, but still, just as a man you Christians hated us like you can't say that somebody has praying for you, hates you, know it's kind of hard to say that so that was one thing and another one was the we were teaching this this teenager guy open the door and it was a really powerful lesson we were giving him and like I thought he was gonna convert but that is parent showed up while we were there, and his dad was a pastor's was kind of interesting but his dad, Kylie Cusick, Amy Holland, amenity came out with like a bunch of groceries and gave them to say like I know you guys don't always get get fed.

Which wasn't true in my mission. But you know we were happy to take the food.

Anyway I just thought that that was a really sick Bowls going off was a really nice gesture so but yeah those things that I try to be like if I was talking myself as a Mormon missionary probably do the same thing that I do with the local missionaries that come over to my house and being an ex Mormon were already you know at a huge disadvantage because more members of the church. Look at us and were as despicable as they come. You know, abandon our covenants. We left the church, but we can't leave it alone and so I think this this stigma with X Mormons.

That's like these people are really out to get us these guys are our enemy and so I really try to just invite the missionaries and I do introduce myself to them and I'm upfront and honest about them, about who I am and in everything, but usually try to to build some connection with them and will share our crazy missionary stories for for a while because it's something that we share in common.

You know I can't tell them about the crazy lady rebranding said that church ruined her life and then she ran out and got in her car and tried to run us over and you know will just try to top each other's stories for for a while, but I usually don't talk doctrine the first time that I meet them. I can just use it to to build a friendship. You know the kind of build that box. I know they wanted and I know they want to talk about Dr. just as much as I do so usually I'll invite them over for dinner on and will talk doctrine over dinner and I'll make them like your floats or something. It is try to make it fun for them when when they come by and have an environment where there is not.

You know this is in so many houses on my mission which is like this, you know, gloom and doom like I got you kind of thing and I'm not trying to set an environment like that.

Like I want them to want to come over and discuss and I usually don't take the approach that I am an apologist or I'm trying to preach at them and I take more of an approach of a lion. I'm just like you guys. I'm on a journey to find the truth. So let's take this journey together, and here's my perspective. And here's why. I have it, you know, what would you say about about this. You know how to go through the Scriptures that way and I just found in my experience over the last two years I've had the opportunity to do this with a couple sets of missionaries in gone really well, their understanding of what we believe is is wrong. They actually understand my position and you they call me Brother Flournoy, which I take as a compliment you as a term of endearment.

But I've had at least two of them credit. Contact me afterwards and stated that they trust me, you know, in the they know I disagree with them.

They know that I believe that that that a false gospel.

So it's not like I have not given them the message loud and clear, but I think that it can be done with respect and they don't view me the way that Christians usually are that Mormons usually if you ask Latter Day Saints so I know that it can be done so yeah so I would do this with my younger self as well. All right into the next question here is Paul first.

How would you answer the charge coming from yourself that Mormons are Christian to they believe in Jesus and that heavenly father loves all his children, so the first question how I answer the charge that Mormons are Christian to challenge it I would. I would ask them what they mean by saying Mormons are Christians today mean that Mormonism falls within the broad category of the Christian religion because they and follow Jesus Christ and his teachings.

So as it is a sociological Christianity that they are claiming or do they mean that they have on an individual level been born again because that's that's the definition of what a Christian born-againdrawnbyGodthefathertosongivingthegiftoffaithjustifiedsavedindividualiseveryonewhoisattendinganevangelicalChristianchurchLutheranChurchReformedChurchiseveryonesittinginpewsandthosechurchesabornagainChristiananswerthatquestionisno,andIwouldarguethatthat'struestrengthaswellandIdon'tknowthattheycouldcounterthatrightbecauseeveryonehastohavethatindividualexperiencewherethefatherdrawsthemto.Sothat'showitcountedoutbecauseIthinkIthinkalotoftimeswasthecaseforwhatIwantedwashavingtheclubkindoffeelingtherestofyouall.SowasmoreofasociologicaldefinitionofChristianthatIwasafterIfitinthiscategorywhenyoureallygetdowntobrasstacks.WereallygetdowntotheheartofthematterhashasgiventhemyourhearttoloveGodandseekafterhimbecausewithoutthatthey'renotreallyseekingafterthesecondpartofthequestionthattheybelieveJesusandheavenlyfatherlovesallofhischildren.Iwouldchallengethataswell.JesusrightJesuswhenhesaysunlessyoubelievethatIMCwilldieinyoursinsthat'sthat'sanimportantquestiontoaskyourself,whattobuyunlessyouthatIwilldineyoursensesoIwilljustchallengethemgentlytotheScripturessoIwouldstartAngelo'smatchingyourthoughts.Yeah,IthinkPaulgaveagreatexplanationforthefirstoneIdon'thaveanythingtoaddtothefirstquestionansweringthecharges.MormonsareChristiantocometoclarifywhatforthosewhoarelisteningandmightnotknowwhatPaulissayingwhenheisquotingJohn824.HesaysifyoubelievethatIamhe.IfyoudonotbelievethatIamevenyouwilldieextendsbasicallythewordsairingtheGreekareago.ImeanwhichofwhichisthesamewordsareusedintheGreekOldTestament,theSeptuaginttorefertotheGodoftheOldTestament,Yahweh.SoJesuswassayingemphaticallythatifyoudonotbelievethatIamwayorJehovahthatyouwilldieinyoursinsandLatterDaySaintsmaysaywellwebelievetheseJehovahgreatwillyoudoyoubelieveeverythingthatJehovahsaysabouthimselfintheOldTestamentre-saysthathedoesnotchangethatinGodthatthereisnoshadowofturningorchangingthatheinessencehaseternallybeenGodthathedidnotprogresstoGodtousethatwereborn.Hewasnevercreated.He'seternallybeenGod.SothoseareallattributesthatareessentialtobelievinginYahwehandintheGodofScripture,andsoandwhenyouthinkaboutitthatway.ThedoctrinesthatareessentialtoLatterDaySaints.Theologysuchaseternalprogression.PartofthatistheunderstandingthattheybelievethatweareallliteralspiritchildrenofGodthefatherandGodthemotherandsoisJesus.JesuswasalsoanoffspringofGodthefather,Godthemother.Sothatmeansthathewenton,heunderwentsomekindofchangeknowsomeLatterDaySaintswillsaythathewasstilleternallyGodevenbeforebirthasaspiritintelligence,butIdon'tthinkyoucanrelatemakethatcasebecauseGodsayshedoesn'tchange,andyetweseehimchangingfromaspiritintelligencetospiritbodytoyouknowgoingthroughtheeternalprogressionoftheplanofsalvationLatterDaySaintstheologysoIdon'tthinkyoucanreallysaythattheLatterDaySaintsviewofJesusisYahweh.AsweastheBibleexplainsitfromeverlastingtoeverlastingyouareGod.Psalm90versetwothereisnochangingGod.He'seternallybeenGod.He'she'snotbornormadeorcreatedandthereisnootherGod,Yahweh.SotheonlywaywecanexplainthatandthefactthattheBibleteachesthatboththefatherisYahwehandthesunisYahwehisthattheyareboththeoneeternalGod,theretheorthodoxviewofworksofexplainingthisisthatwhatwhatevermakesGod.Godisclinicalnoisegodliness.YoucansaythatishisessencewhatmakesGodwhoheisisisessenceandthatessenceissharedbyboththefatherandthesonandalsotheHolySpiritbecausetheHolySpiritiscalledGod.Sothere'soneessencesharedco-equallyamongstthesethreedivinepersons,sothefathernotthesonsumsupthespiritdespairsupfather,buttheysharethesamedivineessenceeternallyandtheybeenendingineternalrelationshipinJohnoneverseonesaysinthebeginningwasthewordandintheGreekitsaysitinthebeginning.Thewordalreadywas.Hewaswasin.Youcouldsayusetheyardexistedinthebeginningsoyoucangoesbackasfarasyouwantthesunexisted.Thewordexistedandhewasprocessedondayonwhichmeanshewasface-to-facewithGod.Hehadaface-to-facerelationshipwithGod.Godthefather.Thefatherthesonwhenaneternalrelationshipface-to-facewithoneanother.Soit'snotlikehewas.Hewasstillaperson.Hestillhadnoconsciousness.AwillthereiscommunicationtherewaslovebetweenthepersonsandnotonlydidthewordeternallybewiththefatherhewhathewasGod.SothesonisGodthefather'sotherfacetofacewithoneanother.Youhavetoreconcilethesethingstogetherandthat'swhyChristiansareforcedtobeTrinitarian'swecan'twecan'tcompromiseonthatthatsothat'salineinthesandsothat'swhythroughouthistorywhenwhenyouseesomeonechallengingthesedoctrinessuchastheNestoriansthatyouknowtheytrytosaythatJesuswastopersonsinwithinJesusoryouseeAriansessaythatJesuswasacreatedbeingthathewasn'talwaysGodorthathedidn'talwaysexist.Theseallcounterwiththebiblicaltestimonyofaneternal,unchangingGodthathasbeenrevealedinthreedivinepersonsnotsomethingwejustcan'tcompromiseon.SowhenwesaydoyouloveJesusquoteunquote,IwouldhavetoaskwhichJesusbecauseIthinkthedifferencesbetweenwhatLDSbelieveaboutJesusandwhatChristiansbelieveaboutJesusisdifferentenoughthatwecan'tbetalkingatthesameGod.WecanagreethatyesaredifferentversionsofJesusbothwerespokenofintheGospels,youknow,hetaughttheparables,etc.buttheredifferentenoughthatwecan'tbetalkingaboutthesameGod.Andthesame.Samegoeswithheavenlyfather.ThereisnoGodbeforeheavenlyfather,GodthefatherdoesnothaveawifesoandwesaythatGodloveshischildren.LatterDaySaintseveninthatphraseorsayingthatthethatGodlovesallofhisliteral,spiritual,andwebelievethatGoddoesnotgivebirthtousasspiritchildrenweuse.WeseeinJohnchapter1thatdoestothosewhobelieveinGod,hegavethemtherighttobecomechildrenofGodbecomechildrenofGodbyadoptionupatbirth.Sothesearejustfundamentaldifferences.ThesearechasmsthatthatseparateitwillgoChristianityandlatter-daySt.theologythatwejustcannotcrosssowecanbefriendswithLatterDaySaintsandwecansharethegospelwiththemandwecanhavegoodfriendlyrelationshipsandwecanyoulovethemandandandgrowingfellowshipinacertainsense,butwecan'tcallthembrothersinChrist.ForthosereasonsyeahreallyanswerMatthewreallyappreciatedthat.IwasthinkingabouthowIwouldcounterthisaswellandIthinkthefirstthingthatwetalkaboutislikeaboutthesubtosomeLDSfriendsofmine,butitisthisthisguyinRussiathatkindoflookslikethepaintingsofJesusthattheyhaveintheLDSwardsanyclaimstobeJesusandhe'sgotabunchofillfollowersaroundhimandsomyquestionisarethosepeopleChristianandyouLatterDaySaintswillsayno,they'renotChristiansaysinMark13thatfalseChristwillriseandsoifyou'reifyou'refollowingafalseChrist,thenyou'renotaChristian.Andsotherehastobealinedrawnsomewhere.Youcan'tjustsaynobecauseIbelieveinChristandhimusinghisname.ThatmakesmeaChristianthatissimplynottrueandonceyouacknowledgethatthereisalinetherethatiswhenIsaylet'sdigintotheScriptures.Let'sdigintothedifferencesandlet'sseeiftherearesignificantbecauseIbelievethattheyaresignificantenoughandoverallit'sthesamethingisinterestedrightnow.Matthew,butoneofthebigthingsiswhatIwasLDSIkindathoughtifIwentbackintime100trillionyears,andIsawJesus,hemightjustbeapileofsparklyintelligenceyouknownotreallyaspirit.Yet,muchlessaGodandnowIbelieveifIgobackyou'llhundredtrillionyears.SheisthesameasheisrightnowweknowGodisGodisstillGodisnotlowerinhisprogressionintelligence.Idon'twanttoworshipaGodwhoI'mfartheralonginmyprogressionthathewas100yearsago.Justdon't.Idon'tseetheexcitementandthattheotherthingIwouldbringupisifGodlovesallofhischildren,thenwhydoeshesendsomeofthemtohell.Specifically,youknowthedevilandhisangelsarestillGod'schildren,buttheyareinouterdarkness.AccordingtoLDStheologyandtherewillbesomewhoweresonsofperditionwhowillgotoouterdarknessforeternity.AndIknowthatallowLatterDaySaintswouldsaywellyouknowthey'restillinthecelestialkingdomandtheterrestrialkingdomknowingJesusisinthecelestialkingdomandinthecelestialkingdomissobeautifulthatyouwouldkillyourselftogotherebutthefactstillremainsthattheyarebanishedfromthefather'spresenceinthecelestialkingdominanyofthoseplacesandsoifGodlovesallhischildren.Whydoesn'theacceptthem.YouknowCharlesarenotherejusttoseethatIwoulddefinitelybringupthepointthatinChristianitywebelievethatGodseemsandaccepts100%ofhischildrenbooks.IwillyousayingMatthewMichael,sorryaboutyourdogtogetyouoff.yeah,it'sinterestingtobecausealltalktillILatterDaySaintsandwillquoteversesfromtheBibleitsayswhilethisisyourgreatestyoursavedbygrace,apartfromyourworksasagiftofGod,theywillyellamen.Youknowyouneedgraceweresavedbycompletelybygracetogettothecelestialkingdomandtogetexaltationyouneedordinancesandworksetc.etc.butlikeyousaid,itisbygracethewhydoesn'tGodgivegracetothoseintheterrestrialandcelestialkingdomgracesandsomethingthatyoutakefromGodassomethingthathegives.Sowhydoeshegivethatsamegracetothemthathegivestothosethatmakeittothecelestialkingdom.Sojustsomethingtothinkaboutyeahyeahforsurejumpintothenextquestionhere.WhenaskedPaulthisfirst.HowwouldyouanswerifyourformerselfsaidthatGodstillspeakstousthroughprofitbecausehelovesustoday.FirstIwouldagreewiththepremisethatGodlovesustodayGod.God'slovedidn'tstopandsoIwouldagreewiththatpremise,butIwouldchallengechargethatbecauseofthatGodstillspeakstousthroughprofitandwithalotofthesame.There'sacoupleapproachesyoucantakeoneistoaskwhathasGodsaidthroughlatter-daySt.prophetsthatwasn'tsaidthroughpriorprofitsorthatisadditionaltowhatwealreadyknowfromtheBible.Andwhenyouaskedthatquestiondidavarietyofanswers.Sometimespeopletalkaboutthewordofwisdomandhowthatisforpeople'shealthandsothereforethatshowsGod'sloveforpeople.Othertimes,peoplewilltalkabouttherevelationofthetruenatureofGodandthatopensthedoortoaskthequestionwhentalkingaboutandelect.MatthewwassayingbeforeGarzaTrinitysameclaimingthatyouhaveadifferentunderstandingofthenatureofGod.IfyouarethenreallyhavesomethingtotalkabouttheirsignificantdifferencetointothechallengeforLatterDaySaints.IftheymakethatclaimisthatrealmeaningofadditionalteachingsaboutthenatureofGodareoutsideoftheircanontheirs'sallusionstoD&C130rightwhereittalksaboutGodhavingabodyfatherhavingabodyoffleshandbonestangiblesman'soutsideofthatyouhavetogotoJosephSmith'scanfollowsermonorthesermontheGrovetoreallydigintotheirdifferencedifferenceswithregardstothenatureofGodandsothat'sonewellchallengetheotherwayisthebiblicalway,rightandjustsaytheOldTestamentrightOldTestamentIsrael.TherewerethreeofficesthatwerereallyimportantintheOldTestamentIsraelprofitPrincetonKingrightandyouhadpeopleservingwithineachofthoseofficesofKingDavid.ReallyimportantkinginIsrael.IsaiahreallyimportantprofityouhavethehighpriestswhoservedinthetemplemakingthesacrificetabernaclewithAaronandhissons.SothesethreeroleswerereallyimportantrolesintheOldTestamentIsraelintheNewTestamentappliestoeachofthoserolesandtheircessationtoJesusChristrightJesusChristintheNewTestament,especiallyastheultimatehighpriestandfinalprophetandsheistheultimateking.Soifyou'regoingtoclaimthatGodspeakstousthroughtheprophettodayyouaredenyingwhatHebrewssaysaboutJesusChristaswellassaystheonethroughGodhashislastorspokentotheworld.Sothat'smythoughtsonanything.Matthewwouldyousaytoyourself,ifyousaidthatyeahIstudyitsoIstudiedwithintheChristianworldthere'sthere'skindofadivisionintermsofthecharismaticgiftsmess,sitetopic,butinstudyingthatIreallystudiedthistopicofcontinuationofapostlesandprophetsandthingslikethatifit'snecessary.Ifitcontinuestodayandit'sreallyhardtoprove.IsaidIthinkthatpassageinHebrewschapter1rightversus1to3.Ithinkthat'swhatyou'retalkingupallIthinkthat'sareallyclearteachingthatalloftheprophetsandapostleswereleadingtoChrist,butasalatter-daySt.ManyofthemwillsaywellafterChristascendedtoheaventherewerestillapostlesandprophetsintheNewTestamentchurch.Sowhyarethosenotsupposedtocontinueandandsoit'shardtoreallypindownatimewhenyou'resupposedtosayokayatthisprecisetime.That'swhenpropprophetsandapostlesendedrightbutwehavetolookatallScriptureasawhole,andyouseethateverytimethere'sanoutpouringofspiritualgifts,prophecies,thingslikethatmiraclesit'sbecauseGodiskindaputtinghisdivinesealuponthatperson.SoweseelikelyespeciallywithElijahandElisha,GodperformedmanymiraclesthroughthemtoprovetheirtheirpropheticcallingbecausetheywerebeingchallengedbyworshipersofBallinandotherpeoplethere.TheywerebeingchallengedbythemastowhethertherearetrulyprophetsofGodworkthroughthem.MosesalsothereisahugeoutpouringmiraclesandsoGodwasbasicallysayingthisismyprofit.IcalledhimtomyworkandsoIwillshowallthesesignsandwonders,asisdivineproofofhiscalling,andwedon'treallyseethatveryoftenuntilwegettotheNewTestamentwithChrist.Christperformedmiraclesbypeoplebackfromthedead,andthat'swhytheythoughthewasElijahandthenweseealsowiththeapostlesafterthedayofPentecostthattheoutpouringoftheSpirituponthem.Theywerespeakingintonguesandcongregationswereprophesyingwheretheydidn'treallydothatbeforeandweseemembersinthechurchesspeakingintongues.SoweseethisoutpouringanditgoesfrominconcentriccirclesyoucansayyounotstartedinJerusalemwiththeJewsandthenitkindawentoutwardtodifferentgroupsandthenwentouttowentouttoJewswhowerenotinJerusalematthetimetherewerethosewhohadbeentaughtbyJohntheBaptist,baptizedbyhim.Sotheywereknowtheyweretaughtbuttheyjusttheyjustweren'treadyortheywantpreparedtoreceiveChristandyouknowtheywerereallylookingforwardtoit.Itreallyquiteunderstand.SotherootandtherewasdifferentgroupsintheSamaritansandthenyouknowtheNaughtonoftheGentiles.Basically,ultimately,soweseeGodworkingfromhiscovenant,startingwithhiscovenantpeopleouttotheGentiles.AndsowhenyouseethatGodisshowingthatthisishiswork.He'sbuildinghischurcheast,layingthefoundationandChristiansagreewholeheartedlywiththepassageinEphesiansasaysthatthatwerebuiltuponthefoundationofapostlesandprophets,Christbeingthechiefcornerstone.Webelieveinthat.Andsowhenyou'rebuildingahouse.Howmetimestomakeafoundationideallyshouldonlymakefoundationonce.Ifit'sstrongenoughifit'ssureenoughitstableenough.Doesn'tmatteriftherestofthehousecrumblesofthefoundationissureenough,thefoundationwillstandsothefoundationwasbuiltontheteachingsandthedoctrinesoftheapostlesandprophets,andinChristbethechiefcornerstoneandweatPeterspeaksofChristiansasbeingspiritualstonesbeingbuiltintoaspiritualhouseofGod.Sowearebuiltuponthatfoundation.Soreally,apostlesandprophetsareneededinthatfirstcenturybecauseitwasanewchurchinwhichChristwasbuildinghischurch.Hewasitwastheydidn'thavethefullbiblicalrevelation.Ittookyouknowittookatleast300yearsforthemtoreallystarttocompilealloftheNewTestamentrelationtogether.Peoplehadsomepeoplehadcertainletters.Somepeoplehadcertaingospelandallofthem.SofortheentirechurchtogetalltheNewTestament.Ittooktimeandinthefirstcentury.Theyneededthatoutpouringofpropheciesintonguesandrevelations,butwedon'tneedthattodaywewhatwehaveissufficient.Weknowwecanlearnfromthebiblicalcanon.NowwecanlearnwhoisGodwhoisChristandhowcanweknowwecometoknowGodinChristandhowcanwehavearightrelationshipwiththem.Howcanwebesavedandhaveeternallife.SoeverythingthatweneedtoknowisinScripturenowsowedon'tconstantlyneednewinformationprofits,givingusnewrevelationdaybydaybyday.Justbecausewehaveissufficientforsalvation.ToknowGodandsecondTimothy316through17saysthatit'ssufficienttoforexhortationforpreachingfordoctrineandforleadingthemanofGodtoallgoodworksandtomakethemcompleteandperfectedsoit'sit'saverypowerfulpassagesthatspeaktothesufficiencyofScripture.Andyes,technically,thatspeakingofOldTestamentatthetimebecausehedidn'treallyhaveafinishedNewTestamentcanon,butIthinkit'sspeakingbroadlyofallScriptureisbeingGodbreezeandissufficientforfurthertrainingusrighteousness.SobasicallythefunctionofapostlesandprophetswasfinishedafterthefirstcenturychurchbuiltupinChristthedistendedcompletedhisworkandthedoctorshadbeentaughtChristianchurchgrewinthebiblicalcanonwascompleted.That'swhyit'sreallyhardtostartoffbysayingit'sreallyhardtopointtoScripturesayatthisspecificpointwedon'tneedapostlesandprophetsanymore.Ithinkthat'swhathewas.Oneistalkingaboutbutitdoesn'tgiveadateortimeoryouknoworanyspecificslikethatthatalotofthesemiaskusalittlebitmoreinvolvedtocomeexplainallthisfromScripturewhywedon'thaveapostlesearntheprofitstodayandwhywedon'tneedthemheresospeakingtheroleoftheprophettheirs,todo.TheycanprophesycanforetellthefuturebyrevelationfromGodortheycanforetelltheirsforsellingandforthtelling.I'veseenLatterDaySaintsrecentlykindapickupthosetworolesandapplyittoapplythemtotheveryobvioussituationthattheroleofaprophetwithintheLatterDaySaintstraditionisverydifferentforthemsooncameafterJosephSmiththatitisforhimandsotheywillarguethatSmithwasawasfulfillingbothrolesasaforetellherin1/4tellerandthosewhohavecomesincehavesinceSmithhavejustbeenfourthteller'sandthereforeonesettlementprofitsandexplainswhythere'ssuchadifferencebetweentheoutputofSmithandthosewhofollowedhim.Ifhewerechallengedinthatwaywhilemodernizingmissionary,whatwouldyousayMichaelaswell.That'sgreatactuallyactuallycametomymindwhenwearetaughtwhentherightasIwasfinishingoutlikeIcouldgointothatbutitbutIdidn't.Soreallygladyoubroughtthatup.Butyeah,so,inthesenseofhavingthegiftofprophecyasintheNewTestamentisreceivingdirectrevelationfromGodandspeakingtheinfalliblewordsofGod.Wedon'tbelievethatthatgiftbehavesinthespiritdoesn'tworkthatgiftednesstodaysothepreachergoesuptothepulpitandpreachasermon.He'snot.He'snotreceivingdirectcommunicationfromGodtotheHolySpiritandspeakingthewordsinthatfashionbuthedoeshave,youcansaythatthegiftofprophecydoesfunctionthatsensethatGodtheHolySpiritaidstheminforthtelling.InpreachingthewordofGodfaithfullyandmypastorsaidinintheirsermonsbeforetheysaidinthesensethatwhenthepastorpreachesthewordofteachesthecontentofthewordofGodfaithfullymeaningtheBible,thenthatisthewordofGodsoyoucantakeitasauthoritativeasifitwerefromGod.AsinasmuchasitisfaithfullypreachingthesothatsinceyoucansaythatquoteunquoteChristianshaveprofitstodaybutit'snotthattheydon'tperformallthesamefunctionsasprofitstudentbiblicaltimesasyouexplainthethingaboutthat.Ithinkit'sabitofadoubleedgeswordisalotofthingsinLatterDaySaintssayaresocommittedthatthesaleoftheprophetstodayaredifferenttheresayingtwothings.Onethatgotchangedthattherethey'renotthesamethingthatwehadintheNewTestamentsoitlosesalotofitsappealrighttherebutyeahthenandthenyou'vegot,youknow,dilutionofwhattheirclaimtohave,whichisongoing,ongoingrevelationisyoudon'treallyhavethatongoingandit'sjustfairintheorybutit'snotthere.Inreality,andsoitjustkindastartstotakethemdowntoourlevel.Wordslikeyouknowit'sliketheoppositeofwhatMatthewwassayingwherewecansaywehaveprophets,butwecanalsosaythattheydon'treallyhaveprophetssoitdefinitelyevensoutthegroundthere.IttakesawayIguesswhatmakesthemsospecialit'snotreallythere.Yeah,Imeanthatwasasellingpointalwaysforus.WhenIwasonmymissionawehaveamanlikeMoses,whoreceivesdirectrevelationfromGod.HeknowsandtalkstoGodpersonally.Soifyoutakethataway.He'sbasicallyjustImean,soI'mnotreallyencounterthatargument.Also,maybeyoucouldexpandallthebetter.Butitseemslikewhatthey'resayingisthattheycanstillreceiverevelation,butit'slikethey'regivingnewdoctrinethere,justreceivingrevelationtohelpthemteachalreadyrevealeddoctrine.IguessyeahexactlythewaythatthebestpredicatearoundsChristianschallengingthem,why,whydidSmithtranslateScripture.WhereisthesealedportionofthebookofMormonplatesthatwereforetoldwouldcome,comeforth.Whydon'tyouhavesectionsofthedoctrineandcovenantsaddedeveryfewmonthslikeyoudidintheearlyyearsoftherestorationsothatthosetypesofchallengeshaveledsomeLDSapologiststhatI'veseenonline.TrytousethedifferencebetweenforetellingandforthtellingusorasawaytoexplainthedifferencebetweenaseniorandinprofitsofspeakingintheirtermswillthenextthingIwouldtennisafterthatisinthenintharticleoffaithsaysthatwebelieveGodwillyetrevealmanygreatandimportantthingspertainingtothekingdomofGodandifprofitsarejusttheirfourthtowelnowhowisthatsupposedtohappen.Iwasmoretoberevealed.ButIamgoingoffoffthepathherejustcan'tanswerthequestion.TheleadersansweredKathyabouthumanusingthe.TheideathatGodspeakstousthroughprofittodayandattachingthattotheideathathelovesusisjustreallydangerousbecauseitisthatisproofthatGodlovesus,thenworkstheotherwaytowhere4000yearsofapostasy.Doesthatmeanwegotdidn'tlovethatbecausetherewasnoprofitontheearth.AccordingtoLDStheology,sothat'sprobablythefirstthingthatIwouldbringupbutwhatIwouldreallywanttohammerinisthatinmybeliefthatGodpreservedhiswordforusbecausehelovesus,andbecausethewordispreserved,andbecausetheScripturehasthepowertospeaktoustodaywenotneedprofitstogiveusnewrevelationsbecausewebelievethatlikehehasn'tsaidthatScriptureissufficientandthesecondprofitstothemix,youaresayingthattheScriptureisnotsufficient,isjustabyproductofthat.Soit'sreasonableanditmakessensethattheLDSchurch.ItsaysinthebookofMormonthatplaneandprecioustreeswereremovedfromtheBibleandsothereforeityouknowitlegitimizestheneedforprofitstoday,butifitwasn't,IbelievetheBiblebeencorruptedandyoudon'treallyneedaprofitorsomebodytospeakforGodbecausetheBibledoesthatforyousothatisthatisdefinitelythewaythatIwouldgowiththatwithoutargumenttodayrightquestionseventhinkWho'sWhoSuissewastoaskfirst.ThistimePaul,howwouldyoudealwiththeclaimofapostasyandthenlaterarestoration,sooneofthemostinterestingexperiencesthatIhadonthemissiongovernmentcountofthisteambefore,butIwassendingthetrainstationwasactuallytherewasatrainstationinthecenterofBudapestwhereseveralmetrostationsalsocamethroughtheresowasagoodplacetogoandstreetcontactpeoplebecausetherewerealwayspeoplerushingtothetrainsortothesubwayorgetuponthesurfaceandgotobusesontheirwaytoandfromworkinvariousplacesthattheyweregoingsogothereoften.WhenIwasinmyfirstareaandtowardstheendofmytimethereIreallyhadlearnedtokindaunderstandwhatpeoplespokebacktomewhenIwouldaskquestionsandIwastalkingthisguyandIwassharingwithhimpassagesfromtheJosephSmithpamphletwaswhichwasbasicallytotracktheyearsthatwasokayandtranslationof1838JosephSmithhistoryandIwashavingreadaboutnowhatSmithsaysabouthisexperienceasayoungteenageseekerwantedtoknowwhichofallthechurcheswastrue.Hehadhisfatherwashisfather.MethodistwasfoundinthePresbyterian,achemicalwhichIthinkishismomandhissisterwerewerelikethePresbyterianfaith,andhisfatherwasaMethodistandknowshowtopersistanywhere.Iwashavinginthispassageisrightaboutgoinginthegroveoftreestoprayandtoknowwhichofallthechargesweretrue,andIknowasked,ofcourse,Iquestionyourtalk,toask,isthisanLDSmission.Doyoueverfindyourselfconfusedbyallthecompetingclaimsofthevariouschurchesandofcoursesinceit'saquestionaimedatgettingsomeonewhoseektoansweryestheguywastalkingtosaiddoesn'tmakealotofsense,butthere'salwayschurchesversusoneGod,whywouldtherebesomenewchurchesandsothenIhadsomeotherpassagesaboutGenesisclaimthathewasuponprayingtoknowthetruthandwasvisitedbythefatherandthesonandtoldthatheshouldjoinnoneofthechurchesallthemorefalseandthatthetruechurchwouldberestored.AndsothenIaskedtheguywhatwouldyouthinkaboutthatisnotgreatthatGodloveshischildrenenoughtorestorethetruechurch'sresponsibilitytookmebysurprisebecausehesaidwaystoanswertoalltheconfusionGod'sanswersalltheconfusionallthechurchesistostartanotherchurch,andIhaveneverreallyconsidereditthatwaybefore.Someofthosethingswaskindoflikealightningboltformeandshejustkindalaughedandwalkedaway.HewasdonetalkingtomeaboutpointforthenexthourorsowhileIwasstilltryingtostripcontactpeopleIwasrunningoutoverinmymind,butthatdoesn'treallymakeawholelotofsensedoesit.IfthereisonetrueGodlovestheworld,gavehisonlybegottenson.Whywouldheever.Ifthat'sthesolutionwhywouldyoueverletthatfallintoapostasyandrestoration.Seethat.That'swhenwehaveachallenge.ItwouldjustifIwastalkingtoayoungerversionofthesystem.YoushouldjustshareaboutthestoryfrommymissionsaiditwaslikealightningboltwentoffinmyheadsowhatwouldyousayyouencountertheseargumentsquitefrequentlywhentargetedLatterDaySaintsplottimesyou'llseeinthediscussiongroupstillpostsomethingcrazythatsomebodydidyouknowlikeyou'llseesomeofthesegroupsthattheyintentionallydrinkpoisonorarebittenbysnakestotrytoprovethelongerendingofMark,whichisindisputewhetherit'sactuallyoriginalornot,butthepartofthatlongerendingamarketsaysyouknow,ifyoudrinkpoisonyouknowyouwon't.You'llstillbehealthyeatingisassignedoftheChristian.AndsoisalookatthiscrazinessisthisproofoftheapostasyandsoorthepointtosomeweirddoctrineorsomewherepracticethatachurchthataparticularChristianchurchpracticesthattheythinkisproofoftheapostasybutyoureallyhavetothinkaboutit.Okay.DidChristeverpromisethatallofthechurch.Allthebelievingchurchwouldbe100%doctrinallypureandgoingtotheNewTestament.Idon'tthinkheeverdoesthatwhenhepromisesMattwhathepromisesPeterinMatthew16hesaysyouknowmattersorrygettingnamesmixedup.Itdoesn'thelpthatwe'vegotPaulinMatthewhealwaysapostolicnamesandstuff.Itdoesfeelconfused,soPetersaysChristiswhoyousaythattheSonofManeithersentimentM.AndPetersaysyou'retheChristthesonofthelivingGod,andhesayslessonareyou,SimonbarJonahforhisnotmanisgiveyouthisknowledgebutskipbutitwasfromGodandhesaysthatuponthisrockIwillbuildmychurch,andsodoesourdebateastowhatthisrockiswhatit'stalkingaboutPeterOrta'sconfessionoffaithinChristandI'mfinewitheither.TobehonestbecausewedoseePeterbeingthechiefapostleintheearlychurch,andsoitisMimi'sPopeoranythinglikethatbutwedoseethatthatitdoessayinScripturethatthere.Thechurchisbuiltuponthefoundationoftheapostlesandprophets,sotherebuiltontheirteachingsonontheirlegacyonwhattheythechurchtheybuiltupsoIdon'tseeanyproblemwitheitherinterpretation.Thus,sidenote,thatthisidea,orJesussaysuponthisrockIwillbuildmychurchandthegatesofHadeswillnotprevailagainstit.SowhatispromisedheretoHaitithatthechurchwillnotfail.ItwillnotfallbutheneverpromisesokaytherewillneverbeanyfalsedoctrinestaughtmychurchessowhatweseethroughouttheNewTestamentweseeallkindsofproblemsintheearlychurchdoctrinallyandchorus.It'sjustamess.Thereisamanwhosestayingwithhisfather'swife.WeseepeoplecommittingadulteryreceivedpeoplebeingtemptedbyfalseGospels.EventheJudaizersandinGalatiatherearebeingtemptedbythisgospelwhereyouyoucan'tbecomeaChristian.IfyourGentilehonestybeencircumcisedandyoufallthefeastinalltheJudyJewishlaws,andthensurmiseeverythingsothey'reconstantlybeingtemptedbythesefalsedoctrinesandandthere'salsoalotofscholarshipthatshowsthatPaul'sepistletotheColossianswasspecificallytocountertheearliestGnosticswhoweretryingtosaythatJesusdidnotactuallycomeintheflesh,butthehecameasaspiritbutnotasinfleshformbecausetheearlyGnosticssawanythingrelatedtothematerialworldandthebodyhasbeenevilandsothey'retryingtosayJesuslooklikeaman,buthewasn'ttrulyamanhejusthewasaspiritualdivinebeingwholookedlikeyoujusthavetolooklikeaman,andsoPaulspendsalotoftimeexplainingthatnotonlydidJesussettlebodyandhe'sresurrected,butalsothatheisthecreatoroftheearthbecauseanotherGnosticteachingwasthatGodisthemostpureandrighteousbeingissoseparatedfromus.Wecan'treallyknowhimandtheirintermediateeonstherecalledspiritualbeingsbetweenthatoneGodandusandatthelowestofthatofthat'softhatspectrumofAon'sisthedemiurgewhichcratedtheearthwhichisbasicallythedevilsotherecanyoutrytosaythatthedevilcratedtheearthandPaul'steachingknowChristisGodandChristcreatedtheearth,soweseeevenintheearlychurchpeoplearestartingtobelievecrazystuffrightsoPaulandtheotherswhowritetothesepeoplestillcallthemSaints,sotherestillhavetemptedbytheseweirdstrangedoctrines,buttherestillholy.Therestillpartofthechurchandsoifyoucanpointtosomeoneandsayallthecrazything.Theybelievetheycan'tpossiblybeChristian.That'sisprivyapostasywellImean,Paul,PeterandJohn.Theydidn'tthinkthatthereisagreatapostasybackthenandtheybelievedinsomeprettycrazystuffsoIdon'tthinkthatyoucanreleasethatbecauseChristiansthroughouttime.InthecenturieshavedifferedondifferentdoctrinesandevensometimesofGodintegrateerror.Thatmeansthere'sapostasy.ChristpromiseschurchwouldalwaysbehereandthatitwouldremainthegatesofHadesandnotrebelagainstandthat'strue.WestillhavethepreservewordofGodinScriptureandwestillhavethatgospeltherethatanybodywhoreadsitcanunderstandandknowhowtobesaved.KnowhowtocometoChrist.SosorryIwerearealisthatthroughoutthisentirediscussionthatmyresponsetoBenMikefibers10isokay.Imeanyouwillmakeupforme.WebalanceeachotherouttoMadison.Yes,youbroughtupMatthew1616,18,andthedatesIhadsomereallysomethingreallyinterestingthatIlearnedfromDr.MichaelHeiserinhisbooktheunseenrealmaboutthatpassageyoulotsofcommentersonthepastbecauseit'sdefinitelyoneofusisknowingthat'sthat'susedtheclaimthatthechurchwouldfallawayrightandpointed.Dr.HeisermakesaboutIthinkstrengthensthatpoint.HesaysandunconstrainedonthisbookpromisesthespiritualskirmishesagainstthepowersofdarknessareevidentthroughoutJesus'sministry.Oneofthemoredramatic,asdescribedinMatthew1613the20JesuscalledhisdisciplestothedistrictofCaesareaPhilippionthewaysheasksthefamousquestion.PeoplesaythatIamPeteranswers.YouaretheChrist,thesonofGodJesuscommandsPeterBlessedareyou,Simonbudgetfortheflesh,fleshandbloodisnotrevealedthisinmyfatherwhoisinheaven.YouarePeter,andonthisrockIwillbuildmychurchandthegatesofhellshallnotrebelagainstit.Skipaheadalittletalk.SothefactthatthelocationofCaesareaCaesareaPhilippishouldbefamiliarfromourearlierdiscussionsaboutthewarsagainstgiantclanssincePhilippiisadjacenttotheriver'sgeographyandwecanseeexactlywhereJesuswasinthefamouswordsaboutthisrockhelpedPetersincePhilippiwaslocatedinpartoftheOldTestamentmanagementBushontheplaceoftheserpentatthefootofMountHermanandfinallyfinishupwhathe'stalkingaboutthegatesofhellisreallyinterestingisthetheologicalmessagingcouldn'tbemoredramatic.Jesussayshewillbuildhischurchandthegatesofhellwillnotprevailagainstit.WeoftenthinkofthisphraseasthoughGod'speopleareinapostureofhavingtobravelyfendoffSatanandhisdemons.Thissimplyisincorrectordefensivestructures,notoffensiveweaponsofGodistheaggressorJesusbeginsatGroundZerointhecosmicgeographyofbothtestamentstoannouncethegreatreversalisthegatesofhellthatareunderassaultandhewillnotholdupagainstthechurch.HowwillonedaybesentencedtosoIthinkDr.Heiserprovesthatbuildingthatdefensivestructuresinuschurchthatisontheoffensiveagainstthegatesofhell.Theywillholdupagainstthedefensiveactsofthechurchmakesthatclaimthatthechurchwerenotfollowingthemstronger.Generallythoughtaboutthatbeforeyouhadneither.That'samazingperspectivesoIdon'thaveawholelottoaddtothisquestionistrickyhascovereditreallywell.Iprobablywouldn'ttalkawholelotabouttherestorationitself.Iprobablyfocusmoreontheapostasybecausetheapostasydidn'thappenandtherewasnorestorationsubmittedbyfocusrealrealheavyononthatthelittlethingsIthinkthissomethingIstrugglewith,evenafterbecomingaChristianforalongtimetoseemoreapologistsgetonlineandthensay,well,youdon'thavealotofyourlegtostandonbecauseeither.CatholicismhasthepriesthoodhaveanunbrokenlineorelseitbrokeandnowwehavethepriesthoodyouknowyoujustcameoutofCatholicismwillyouknowyoudon'thaveanyauthorityyoudon'thaveanypossibilitytostandandwasyouMatthewthatwasbroughttheideainmyheadthattheCatholicChurchhadn'tfullyapostatizedwhentheReformationhappenedthatitwasn'tuntiltheCouncilofTrentwasn'tthattheysaidthatSophiawasanathemasothatwasdefinitelysomethingyouhavebecomeavailableagainsoonsowholedifferentperspectiveandI'munitedaboutthesomebodysandsandtheywereshocked.Theyneverheardanythinglikethatbefore,butitdefinitelydismantlestheideasofveryaggressivestanceagainsttheideaofanapostasybecauseIwasMormon.Ican'tbelievethattheapostasyprobablyhappenedbeforehundred80likeitwasreallyearlyonthatthisapostasyoccurrediniftherewasnoapostasyandwerenotevenclaimingthattherewasanapostasyiftheylookatProtestantsandtheysaylikethat'sproofthattherewasanapostasybecausetheyrecognizethattheCatholicChurchwasanerrorthatitwasn'tthetruechurchandandthentheytriedtoleaveandandfixitbutyouknowyoucouldn'tcouldn'tfixitwithoutthepriesthoodkeysandsothat'swhyGodrestoredthemthroughJosephSmithSundaytohearussayingthattheCatholicChurchhadapostatizedisisreallysomethingthatIthinkthey'dbeunpreparedfortheonlyotherthingImightmentionisjust,youknowPres.Nelsonsayingrecentlythatyouknowthechurchistherestorationiscomplete,andjustwhatthatthatimpliestherestorationisnotcomplete.IfthechurchisstillrestoringthenthatmeansthattheapostasyisinoverMormonismistrueandtheapostasyisnotcompletelydonewerestillinthegreatapostasysoyesIthinkthat'sthat'sallmythoughtsononthatglossisaninterestingarticleabouttherestorationthatyoupublishedrecentlysoyougetputthatinthedescriptionandwecandothatiftheywanttoreadaboutit.Yeahtherestoringgospelthink:usingmymemorybecauseI'mgettingoldcatchingup.PaulcatchingupsoundworksasPauljusteternaltimeashiskidsbecausehediedwerejustcopyingclips.PleasegetaRolodexofreactionsandphrases,whichispushbuttonsinjustlikethesame100justkindofjustjustasthatproduceinterestingthingsIsayallrightsoMatthewashewasfirsthowdoyouthinkcovert,19willchangetheconversationseealotoflatter-daySaintsinthedebategroupsthesedaysbecausethey'renotabletogooutandtalktopeopleface-to-face.So,personally,wouldyoufinditeasierorhardertoengagewithyourselfonlinesoyeahthisisonewillbeconfusedaboutmaybeyoucanclarifytobed.DoyoumeanlikeifIhadanopportunitytotalktomyself,youknow,ifyouknowmyyoungermissionaryselfordoyoumeanlikesecondwhatyoumeanyeahifyouwishmyselfwastalkingtoyouonadebategroupratherthaninyourhouseandandIwasservingmymissionduringthe19yesyellowIthinkIfeel,reallybad.Foley'smissionariesareinthesediscussiongroups,becausethat'sitseemslikethat's,whatmostoftheirmission.Theirmissionisnowthey'rejustkindofonlineandaretryingtofindpeopletotalktoyouandyou'llseethemalsosayingnoassemblywantedtoaBiblestudywithmeandtrytogetpeopleinterestedthatwayaboutfarmjustbecausethehardestparts.MymissionwasintheofficebecauseIwasdoingwhatpaperworkIwasworkingonthelegalitypaperworkforallthemissionariesIwouldmakesurethattheybuiltsignaturesallthepaperworktheyneedtostaylegalandothervisasandeverythingandIwasalsothemissionsecretarysaysduringscheduledfortheMr.presidentisreallyhardislikeanofficejobisliterallylikea95or96orsomethingandIjustdidn'tlikeit,youknow,asamissionarywouldbeoutandtalkingtopeopleandmeetingpeopleandthingslikethatsoIfeelreallybadforthesemissionariesbecausetheyknowsittinginfrontofacomputeralldayisprobablynotwhattheysignedupforwhentheyputintheirmissionpaperssoIwouldn'tsayitwouldmakeiteasierorharder.IjustwouldprobablytryitslightlydifferentlythanifIweretotalkmyselfinperson,youknow,IwouldprobablytrytoshowmoreempathyandsayheyyouknowlikeIknowthatthisisprobablydifficultforyou.Beingstuckinsidealldayandnotbeingabletogooutandtalktopeople.Sotrytobemoreempatheticthanthatsense.ThenotealsotrytoIwouldtrytodoit.Trytotalkmaybeovervideolikeweredoingnowjustbecauseit'ssoeasytotakethingsthewrongway.Ithinksometimessayingsomethingboldlycancomeoffasbeingsarcasticorbeingoffensiveoraggressive.SometimessometimesIjustwanttosayokaywhilewedisagreeonthisandthat'swherewehaveadividinglineisyouknowsometimesI'mtalkingtolettertoSt.getoffendedandsaywellyou'resayingI'mnotagoodpersonevilareyouknowlikeyoujusthatemeorsomethinglikenotsomethingsayingweifwedifferonthis.Weneedtotalkaboutitintheresomuchcommunicationthatisverbalandinphysicalyouknowthatyoudon'tgetjustyourtextsoifourtalkmyselfthroughtextonly.IwouldhavetobesuretomakesureI'minarespectfulandyouknowjusttryingtotalkthingsoutlogicallyratherthantrytostartafight.Soyeahprobablywouldtalkmyselfslightlydifferentlyonlinethroughtextonly,ratherthaninpersonpressurelooksyourthoughtsisinteresting.ItalkedearlieraboutshowinghospitalityassistancetodoonlineandgoingaboutmanagingvideoandMichaeluniteforadmittanceFacebookdiscussiongroupforlatter-daySaintsandevangelicals,andhadthisconversationwiththeadminteamallowthemissionariesintothegroupassignmentsfeelprettystronglythatweshouldisnotthis,notconducivetowhatthewhattheirpurposesandalsothattheyprobablyarenotpreparedtothinkthat'sprobablytruebutatthesametimeIrememberwhenIfirststartedstudyingatCincinnatiChristianUniversity.IwasreallycuriousaboutthatgoesbacktoAmericanrestorationandAlexanderCampbell.CriticsofthebookofMormonandofcoursetheyhaveperiodicalstogobacktotheearlyyearsoflatter-daySt.restorationisreallycuriouswhatreferencesaretheretoLatterDaySaintsintheinthoseearlyperiodicals.IspentoneeveninginthelibrarylookingupeveryreferenceIcanfindtwomorningsinthoseearlyAmericanrestorationperiodicalsandIfoundreallyinterestingarticlethatwasaboutmissionaryobviousmissionarycomingintotownandchallenginglocalpastorstodebateandnotetogetherallgatheredtogether,oneofthetown'schurchesanddiscretionarycourtagainsttherestoftheChristianpastorsthatwerethere.Itwasaboutthatwaskindofinteresting.That'sadifferentwayofdoingmissionaryworkthatIwasevertaughttodoandaftergoingtojustchallengechallengepastorsandsosometimesIthinkyouknowifififthemissionariestodayareunpreparedforthedebateshallbeoutanddorecognizethattheregoingoutyoungerthanwewentoutbecausethepatientischanged.Thisamount,especiallyinthecovertwheretheyhavetobeonlineandreallyshouldbepreparedpreparedforbestnottosaythatIthinkallthebiggroupsarehelpingplacesforthembecausethey'reprobablynotbutyouknowtheonewherewetrytokeeparespectfultonetrytoprettyheavy-handedcasebutisgettingoutoflinesoIthinktheyshouldbeinterestingonlyoptiontheyhavetotrytogettheirmessageacrossthenationchallengedthatmessageintermsofwhatIfinditeasierorhardertoengagewithmyselfonline.Ifinditharderbecauseisnotlikeallofthesocialcuesyouhaveinpersonthatletsthepersonknowthatyouarenotnotbeingsarcastic.You'renotbeingajerkisjuststraighttextconversationonline.Ihaveengagedsomemissionariesonlineandcanbealittlebitharderinpersonconversation.YeahmeandItotallyagreeverydifficulttotalktomissionariesonlineandyouaresaying.GoMatthew.Ifeelreallyreallybadforthemtobecauseyougrowup,yourwholelifeandyouhavethispictureofwhatamissionthisisgoingtobe…Excitingadventureandtojusthavetositthereonacomputer.Itisjustmustbealetdown,areallybigletdown.Soyeah,Iknewyoufeelalotofsympathyforthemissionariestogothroughthat.Butyeah,likePaullikehewassayingMatthewreallyhardformetotalktomyselfonline,especiallyinthedebategroupsyouknowwhatendsuphappeningyetyoulosealotofthesocialcueswe'retalkingonline.Theotherthingthathappenstohaveamuchhardertimehavingaone-on-oneconversationbecauseyouknowmaybeitstartsoffasaone-on-oneandotherpeoplestartjumpingininsertingtheirargumentsandincreasinglyjustgotnoamountofpeoplefrombothsidesgoingatitandthenthatMichelleyouweretalkingtomejustsaynoonecanevennoticeifIwalkawayfromthisconversationnowsoifIweretotalktoamissionaryone-on-oneortomyself.Myyoungerself.Iwoulddeftlywanttodoitinthevideosotheywerenotbeinginterruptedbyotherpeople.Wejusthavethatthatheart-to-heartconversation.Ijustdon'tthinkit'sIthinkthatInternetyouknowforhimdebatingitreallydoeslosealotofthatthatpotentialthatyouyouhavewhenyou'retalkingtosomebodyone-on-one.Imeanit'sgreatbecauseyoucanresearchyourarticlesinandpullthemupandthingsbutIcanstillsayhimtosendyousomethingstoread.AfterthisdiscussionandIlikeyouropiniononitnexttimewemeet.Youneedthatinstantaneousnopostingthingsbecauseitjustkindofdistractsinthemiddleoftheconversationsothat'swhatIthinkaboutittakingtheconversationslikeprivatemessage.Ithinkthat'sthat'sbetteryeahIdon'thaveaproblemwithtakingtheconversationintoaprivatemessageisalwaysyouknowyouhavethetimetodoit.Ithinkthat'srightwasthereasonIprefershavingrealtimeone-on-oneconversationbecausereallybusypersontosothesearefromyousetasidethetimeandsaygoodforthishour.Onthisdayasopposedtowehavethisongoingconversation.Inthelastforlife.FiveminuteseverydayandIlosewhatIwasgoingwithsomethingcompactalotmorealotmorepoweryouknowMCUashortevenashortdiscussionthatyouhavingone-on-oneforlike30minuteswithsomebody.Nothingismorepowerfulthananongoingmessengerdiscussionwithsomemissionary.Thisismyopinionit'sfascinating.It'ssomethingofaninterestingI'veseensomeChristiansdon'tthinkmissionarieswillinvitepeopletogotofixsomethingupinaprivateconversation.SomeChristianssaythatsomethingcanyouciteruleyouafraidtotalktomydearfriendsaboutthegospellikeyouthatIdon'tunderstandyet,Ithinkthere'sprobablyjusthopethatifwekeepitintheinthediscussionforumthatifIdogetcorneredaboutthesafetynetofhavingmyotherbrothersinherewithme.Ithinkthatmaybeacompromisetothatistosay,hey,youknow,IamassumingthatthesemissionariesonlinestillhavecompanionsbutIdon'tknowhowthatworksnowbutheyyouknowwhatIbringmyfriendandwillhaveaT-1toconversationhimandIthinkthatstillwaybetterthanyouknowit100on100conversationisjustnotgoingtogoanywhere.SoIwenttothenextquestionhere.Howwouldyoudealwithyouryoungerselftotheworld.IchallengesayingthatyoucanprayoverthebookofMormonandreceiveananswerthatitistrue,andI'llstartwithPaulonthisonesaythatI'vedoneitdone.Thechallenge,Ithink,whatshouldbeconsideredbymissionariesisthatlatter-daySaintsaretaughtspecificbornandraisedinchurchtaughtfromthetimeyou'reinthecradleyoustartprimarythatGodspeaksincertainwaysandtheirwaysthataredescribedinthelettertheysenttermsintermsoftheburningwasanotherstopthislettertoSt.Redman24buttheweightofchancewithinthedocumentcovenantsinreferencetothebookofMormonandtranslatingallthecabinetry.Specifically,there'sthere'sacertainwaysthatyou'retaught,youwillreceivetheanswerfromthetimeyouwritesowhenIwasgettingreadytoleaveonmymissionandbornandraisedintheLDSchurchhadgraduatedseminaryandrealizedifIgooutandteachthisreligionthatisminedbybirth,Ishouldprobablyhavemyownwitness,butit'strue.OfcourseIgotdownonmykneesandIprayedaboutthebookofMormonquestionnoted,thereisveryemotionallyfraughtsituationthatIwasandIsuspectthatalotoflatter-daySaintsweremadewhentheyactuallygetdowntoprayingaboutthebookofMormonthereinsimilarsituations)wantingtoknowtheirwantingtoknowifwhattheyhavebeentaughtistruethere,wantingtoknow,especiallyforgoingonamissionandwantingtoknowwhatIwassoit'sit'sveryemotionallyfraughtsituationandtothinkthatpsychologicallycanmanifesttheirexperiencethanpeopleinotherreligionsaswell.Itdoesn'tit'snotit'snotacadreoftruthandifitwasthere.Frommyperspective,IwouldnothavecontinuedtodoubtthatexperienceandIdoubteditforthem,butIrealizedthatIexperiencedexactlywhatI'vebeentoldoverandoverandoverandoveragainthatIwouldexperiencesomethingmorethanthat.NowIknowLatterDaySaintsandSeoquestioninyourspiritualexperience,butIthinkit'swisetoquestionspiritualexperiencethatisexactlywhatyouweretoldoverandoverandoveragain,youwouldexperiencewhenyoudoacertainthing,especiallyinasituationwhereIwasstaringdownmissionintwomonthsandreallyfeelingemotionallylikegoingouttoteachtheworldthisthingsoIknowmyselfasifitwasitreallywasaspiritualexperiencefromGod.Idon'tthinkIwould'vecontinuedtodoubtit.Throughoutmymissionandwould'vecontinuedtoprayforawitnessthat,it'sreallyinteresting.Fascinating.Imeantalkaboutitaskindofanemotionalresponsethatyoucangenerate.Maybethatexplainswhyitneverworked.WhenIdidit,youknow,becauseIdon'thaveanyfeelingssoIcan'tjustpsychopath.SoMatthewwhatareyourthoughtsonthisquestionhadtodosomeinvestigationCalifornia.TheremightbeaslewofunsolvedmurderstherethatwecanprovidesomeevidenceforitisMichael,oh,soIhadtogocover-upsomeevidenceyeahIthinkboughtalotofreallygoodpointsareandyeahsototokindofgooffwhatyousay.Thiscanbekindofamanufacturedoraforcedexperience.Now,asIwasprayingformonthsforaconfirmationofthebookofMormon.IdidfeelthatIhadcome.Theburninginapleasantexperience,butIdon't.IthinkitwasyouPaulandyourstorywhereyoutalkabouthowifyoukindoffocusonyouknowhavingthatfeelingyoucankindoffeelthatburningorthatthetinglingfeelingweakandcan'treproduceitoncommand.Evenifyou'renotreallyprayingoranything.TherealotoftimeswhereIhadsimilardoubtsthere'saftermymissionwhereyouknowyoubewatchingaDisneymovieoraveryemotionalmoviewherethemusicisveryenthrallingit'sit'spitchgetshigh.ItstartsreallytuggingatyourheartstringsintheEstarttofeelthatsametinglinginthesameburningthatIhadwhenIwasreadingthebookofMormonandprayingaboutitandsosometimesIwonderhowIdifferentiatethosefeelingswithgoingtothespiritbecauseIknowthatthespiritisnottellingmethatfrozenisatruerecountingofactualratesothatkindofalwaysstuckoutofmymindsoIaskedmyselfokaywellifififyoucanhavethesameexactfeelings.InothercircumstanceswherenotprayingornothavingaspiritualexperienceforyourjustlisteningtomusicorwillwatchamovieorjustlookingatnatureandthingslikethatisGodtellingyouthateveryallthoseexperiencesare:courtroomweknowsoandthenIwouldalsogothroughScripture.Youknowtheheartthepassageswhereitsaystheheartisdeceitfulandwickedyouknowwhocanknowit.Weknowthatthefallenman'sheartorjustmen'sheartsingeneralarecorruptedandthatwereeasilyturnbackandforththeiremotionsandGodhasgivenusthegreatblessingofhavingamindhavinganintellectandsoI'mnotsayingthatIthinksometimesmaybeintheWesternchurchwegoabittoofarawayfromfeelingsandsayyouknowtherejustcompletelydiscountthemwhatsoeverinthinkaboutonlylogical,rationalargumentsforthefaithbecauseIthinkyoucanhaveaspiritualexperimentexperiencethatconfirmsherfaith,butbutthatshouldnotbetheprimaryCompassforwhatistruth.Truthisconsistent.TruthisrationalandweshouldnotbelieveinanythingthatisirrationalatsomethingDr.SpruillsaidhesaidinIwouldcertainlyneveraskanybodytobelieveinsomethingthat'sirrationalorillogicalmeeting.Itbreaksthelawsoflogic.YouknowlikeappeartotrytogotthereandsaythatJesusisnotGodandheisGodsimultaneouslylettheaxleoffcaughtnon-contradiction.That'sacontradictionyoucansayJesusisGodandnotGodiseitheroneortheothersofaithestimatefortestbebaseduponrationalprinciplesandsometimeswedon'tunderstandeverything,butIwouldjustsaytomyselfyoureallyunderstandwhattheBibleteaches,ordoyouonlythinkyouunderstandwhattheBibleteachesandhaveyoucomparedwhattheLDSchurchteachesascomparedtotheBiblebecauseifyou'reifyou'retosaythatyourreligionistherestoredgospelandthatit'sthesamegospeltaughttheBiblewifeyou'veneverreallystudiedtheBibleindepthorderfullystudiedouttheargumentsforChristiansandhowcanyoureallyknowthatforsure.Howdoyouknowthatthesamegospel.YourteachingisagospelwhattheBibleteaches.Soreallystudyit,understanditandunderstandtheargumentsofChristiansaremakingandevaluatethatagainstthebookofMormondoctrineandcovenantswiththeLDSchurchteachesstuffandstuff.Iwas,Ijustcannothavethisepiphany.YouknowthatI'mnottheonlyonethatneedstogotoasylumbecauseforthelastlikeourwe'veallbeentalkingabouttalkingtoourselvessoyeahtheonlyonecrazyhereMr.sowhatIwillrespondwithtothemoremychallengeismyownexperiencesthatledmeoutofthechurchbecauseitwasn'tjustlogicalthingsatafamilymembertrytotellmethatIintellectualizemywayoutofthechurchandIsaidyouknowitwasjustasmuchspiritualasitwasdoctrinalformewasbecauseIhadacoupleofdreamswhereIfeltlikeGodwastellingmetoleavethechurchsoprobablytalkaboutthosethingsandthatisyouknowthatisastalemateatthatpointbecauseyouknowyoucanhaveGodtellingthemthatthechurchistrue,andthentellingmethatit'snottrueandIneedtoleaveitandsoatthatpointyouknowyouandpassyoucan'treachananswerbybyaspiritualconfirmationofwhatIwouldkindagotonextisultimatelythespiritualexperiencesbythemselvescannotbetrusted.IfyoulookatMark1322saysforfalseChrist'sandfalseprophetsshallrise,andshallshowsignsandwonders,toseduce,ifitwerepossibleeventheelectandpointoutacoupleofinstanceswherethishasoccurred.YoulookatthestoryofMosesandtheExodusyouknowthePharaoh'smagicianswereabletodoalotofthesamemiraclesinitiallythatMoseswasabletodothethrowdowntheirstaffsandtheybecamesnakes.Theywereabletoturnwaterintobloodandsowould'vebeenreallyeasytolookatthoseguysandsayallyouknowthegotGodontheirsideandthengoingwiththat,exactly,butIthinkit'sgotSatantoitsincehe'stransformedintoanangeloflightandsoitiscertainlypossiblethatthattherecouldbesignsandwonderstheycanbeabookthatcausestheburninginthebosom.Youknow,evenifitisn'tjustanemotionalfeeling.Itstilldoesn'tprovethatthechurchistrueandsoIjustIcouldn'tpossiblytaketheriskofbalancingmytestimonyonachurchormysalvationonthehighwireofsubjectivefeelingthatIgetfromtakingonachallengethatisjusttoomuchofariskforme.Youknow,itwouldhavetolineupwithwiththeScripturesandwouldhavetobelogicallyfeasibleaswelllikeformetheidea.LikewellIstilldidn'tsayanythingaboutstudytheScripturesandandtestedagainsttheBibleisjustnottherebecausewhatthey'retryingtodoistoseeyoujustforgetaboutallyourobjectionsforgetaboutthelogicandandthisistheonlythingthatmattersisthatIjustacceptthatatthispointverydifferently.Okay,soonecouldquestionhimandmaybemaybeit'stoomuchbecauseroadagainKellyPopenotalettertoSt.willprobablyaskyoureturn.Ifyou'retosaythatwellhowdoyouknowtheBibleistrue.Youknow,didn'tdidn'tdidn'tyouprayaboutit.Likehowdoyouknowit'strueinsteadofthecodeonanotherholybookandgottalkedaboutthisinoursecondinoursecondseriesonwhatwhatwhataboutScripture,butmaybejustaquickrebuttaltothat.HowwouldyouknowtheBibleistrue.Ifit'snotjustaboutprayingaboutit.Yeah,Imeanthisisabigdifference.Firstofall,betweentheevidenceyouknowthemanuscriptsthatwehavebetweentheBibleandthebookofMormonandisnotsomethingthatIjusthavetoprayabout,becauseitgottheDeadSeaScrollsandgotallthetextfortheKingJamesKingJamesBibleisGod'swhattheyhaveisnothingforthebookofMormon.JustaconvenientstorythatthatthenumberwhenItookitfromtheearth.IguessIkindoftalkaboutthethreewitnesseslikeitwasthisfoolproofevidencethatthebookofMormonisyouknowthisundefiledpuretextbutyouknoweventhattestimonydoesn'tsayleteverythingthatwaswritteninthatbookwastranslatedcorrectlyoryouknowsoitjustitjustdoesn'tcomparetotheBibleatallitsapplestoorangestoMakethatargumentwithme.Aquickremodelyeahthat'showIwouldsaytoitsitseemslikeyou'rebeinglazysinceareaskingustobelievethebookofMormonwithoutwithoutanyevidenceintheBiblesayingweregivingyouplentyofevidencetobelieveitis.There'slotsofgoodreasonstobelieveit,butthedaypeoplewillstillrejectitbecauseofwhatitteachesbecauseofthecontent.ThespiritualmessagethatcannotbesavedwithoutChrist.Sotherewasstillalwaysbepeoplerejectedevenwiththeevidence.ButGodisaskingustobelieveinsomethingwithoutanykindofsupportforit.It'sit'sarationalfaiththatwerecallingpeopletotoembracerightthenitgoesagainstwhattheBiblesaysso.Itmightbeadifferentstory.Youlimitthesummaryonit.IfitactuallydidalignwiththeBiblehundredpercentevenifitdidI'dprobablystillsaywhydoIneedthisbook.IfalignswiththeBible.Soeitherit'snotneededoritsfalseandanotheroneofthereasonsweholdtothesufficiencyofthewordofGod.Imean,IknowthatwhenaMormonwouldsayislikewillIbetthatyouknowifhisrevelationhadbeenwrittenyetandyoulivedbackthenyouwouldn'tacceptthebookofRevelation,becauseyouwouldbesayingwelltheneverythingelsewasn'tsufficientbeforerevelationsothat'sthat'skindofwhatweredealingwiththeiranditisatoughertoughargumentsoIdon'tknowifyouguyshavearebuttalforthatmeantheideathatifyou'reinthefirstcenturythathedidhaveacompleteBible.SohowcouldyousayScripturesufficient.AsIcountersignyetbecauseoftheapologistwillstateallthetime.Lastoneweknewlikewetalkedabouttherewerestillpeoplewiththegiftofprophecy.TheywerereceivingevenastheNewTestamentwasbeingwritten.Sotherewascontinuingsotherewaskindoftwosourcesofrevelation.IguessyoucouldsayduringthattimetherewastherevelationofGodtheHolySpiritinspiringtheinspiredauthorsofScripture,buttherewerestillprophetsinthechurchthatreceivedrevelationandPaultalksaboutthatalotinfirstCorinthians,whenhegivesthemdirectionsastohowthat'ssupposedtoworkandIshallhavetwoorthreethatspeak–speakoneatatimeandifyou'respeakingintonguesyoushouldhaveaninterpreterlikeanythingandthenyeahsothen,andevenlikeyousaidtherewerealotofpeopleitdidn'texceptRevelationthatTooktime.There'sareallygreatseriesbyDr.MichaelKruger.He'skindoftheexpertontheNewTestamentCanonisthere'susafreeseriesonlinereformedtheologicalseminary.IguessIcanleavethelinkinthedescriptionontheYouTubevideobuthebasicallytalksabouthowtherewasacoresetofNewTestamentbooksthatwereacceptedinallpre-muchimmediately,includingtheGospelsandthereweresomethatwereacceptedbysome,butnotbyall.SomeofthemwerecontestedandthenthereweresomethattookalittlebitlongertobeacceptedsothatthedevelopmentofthebittheNewTestamentCanonisabigtopictotalkaboutbuteventhenifyouhavefourGospels.Theyallprettymuchteachthesamestuff,especiallythesynopticGospelsMatthewMarkLukesociologyneeded.AllofthemtoknowthemessageofChrist.IfyouhadoneofthemyouwouldhavesufficientinformationtoknowChrististobelieveinChrist.Soevenwithouttheentiretyofeitherthe27booksoftheNewTestamentorthe39booksoftheOldTestamentorall66.Ifyouhaveallofthem.YoustillhavesufficientinformationtoknowChrististocometoChristforsalvation.Andthat'sthebeautyoftheGospelslikeyoudon'tneeda50stepprogramandallthesemillionsofordinancesandcommandmentshavetolivehavetobeattachedtothisonespecificorganization.YouknowthegospelfreefaithandrepentanceincrisishowwehowGodgivesusthegraceeternallife.Soit'saverysimplegospel,evenachildcanunderstanditwas.It'salsoanotheroneofthoseDublinerswordsrightbecausesaythatwhenthe35bookofCommandmentswaspublishedbythechurchthatnothesaintswholaterhadthebroaderdoctrineandcovenantsthatthereseemstohavethewholetruthstatedtodaybyPres.Nelson.Doesn'ttherestorationiscontainedinnotice.It'sadouble-edgedsword,willyouultimatelyhavetocomedowntoisisGodsovereignisGodactinginhistory,andifsoandifGodissovereign,thenthewaythatGodbroughtaboutthedevelopmentoftheNewTestamentCanonandtheclosingofthecanonisaccordingtoGod'swill.OtherwiseyouaredoingGodisnotsovereignoverhistoryandIdon'tofthelettersentwanttoarguethattheexcepttheCanonisfunnytoobecauseifyouthinkaboutit.TheNewTestamentcanonwasn'tfinished,itwasn'tyouknowwhyLeeuniversallyacceptedinitsentiretyuntilatleastthreeor400A.D.rightwellifthechurchisArtiebeenanapostasybytheendofthefirstcentury.WhyshouldtheytrusttheNewTestamentaswehaveittoday.Youknowitwasitwascanonizedbythegreatandvolatilecharts,sowhyshouldwewatch.TheyevenaccepttheCanonexceptforthefactthatIguessJosephSmithwastheirdoctrinecovenantssectionwhereJosephSmithprayedandsaidthattheBibleisthewordofGodlikeaseedyouhaveanarticlesoffaithalso.ButIguessIdohaveanindependentsourceofrevelationtoverifyloveanyway…AboutthatIhadyeahallallreallygoodthoughtsguyskindjumptothelastquestionhereistheoppositeofoneoftheotherquestionsthatweweaskedwhatpricewouldyougivemeherself.ItwasyourlastdayonthemissionandyouareabouttogohomewillstartwithMatthewonthisone.There'sastorythatIwantedtotellyouguystheotherdayIthoughtaboutSmithvillejustbrieflysharedheresoIhadthesamemissionpresidentfromentiremissionuntillikethelastmonthandthatwaswehadanewmissionpresidentsohewasbrand-newinthemission.Youknowwasstillgettinghisfeetwetdidn'treallyknowanyofthemissionariesisweirdbecauseIhadmylastinterviewwithhimandIwasinthesamecitywithtwosistermissionariesthatwerealsogoinghomethatsametransferandtomakeiteasier.HebasicallysaidhesaidhesetupthefinalinterviewsonthesamedayandmycompanionstayedinthatcityshotawallinBelgiumandIwentonthetrainwiththeothertwosisterstothemissionheadquarterstotalktothepresidentsoeverybodywasgivemeahardtimetherewaslikesixmissionariesinthesamebuildingsoallthemissionaries,orgivemeahardtimebelikeaenjoyyourdatewiththesisterslaterasitwassuchaweirdexperiencegoingonthattrainthetrainerarticles2sistersjustusthreeisreallyweirdbutsoyeah,IrememberthelastdaygoinghomeandbeingexcitedandscaredandyouknowwantingtostartcollegeandallthatotherstuffbutnotjustsaytomyselfheyyouknowgoingthroughwhatIknewwhatIwentthroughaftermymissionwasareallyhardtimeandsoftwaretotalktomyselfIjustsaylook,youyou'vedoneagreatthingwithyourmissionanddon'tworryaboutfeelinglikeyouhavetobethesamepersontomorrowasyouaretodaybecausethingsaregoingtodrasticallychangeyourlifeisgoingtochangeyouspenttwoyearsdoingwhatyoufeltwasrightinsurveyinganddoingmissionarywork,butthat'snothowit'sit'snotgoodtobethesamewayafterthatlifeisnotyou,nottobeyou.Youmightwanttobeamissionarylikeyouarenow,butstocktobethesame.Sojustgowithoutunderstandingthatthatunderstandingthatanddon'tworryaboutgettingmarriedimmediately.Don'tworryaboutyouknowthepressureofgettingmarriedisisareturnedmissionaryyouknowjusttostayfocusedontheirlifegoalsstillcollegeandthethingsthatyouwantedsetupforthefutureanddon'tgetdownonyourselfbecauseiceIbeatmyselfupeverydaywhenIgothome,youknow,IthoughtIhadsuchahardtime.IwasbeggingmyBishopforcalling.IfeltlikeGodisrejectingmeandIwaslikewhat'sgoingon.YouknowIjustfeltlikeItriedservetheLord.ThebestIcouldjustnothingwasgoingrightforme.Sojustlikejustacomfortformyselfandsayheyyouknowit'scanberoughbutitdoesn'tmeanyou'rebadmissionarydoesmeanyou'reyouknowyou'reaterriblepersonorletyouknowthatyoubroughtGod'swrathuponyouorsomethingisgoodtobeahardtimeadjustingtohomelifeandisgettingsicktimeandsoyoujustneededtobepatientandnotbeatyourselfupoversubsprobablywereoutsiderighthopeyoudon'tmind,jumpinthemiddleofthisoneandthatyouandbecauseyoualwaysfinishthestrongest,butIthinkaboutmyself.ItwasmylastdayonmymissionacoupleofthingsthatIwouldtellmyselfisfirstofall,likeKatieareabouttogotothedatingworlddon'tusethesametacticsthatyou'reusingasaMormonmissionary.That'screepy.ThenextthingIwouldsayisdon'tcyclemeyeahbutitworkedrightyoumarriedeverypersonyoudateddatedtwopeoplebecauseIcouldn't.Thesecondtheydon'texpecttobeacelebrityanymoreevenreallycareaboutthatmuchaftermonthandgoinghome.Youknowpeoplejustdarkentheyouthatwayanymore.Youknow,inthepolicyyouwillbealotofthingsthataregonnacomeupendedupworkingworkingfortheleadersofthelocalchurchandrealizethathewasaverydifferentmanintheworkplacethathewaswiththechurchsowillthingsIwouldtellmyselfistoexaminethefruitsofthefruitsmatter.Don'tjustsweepthemundertherugandIwasvery,muchyoublind.Thatislikeit'sallthedoctrineitdoesn'tmatterhowbadthepeoplearebutthetruthisthatenoughfruitdoesindicatethatsomethingiswrong.YouknowagoodtreecannotproducefruitasIwouldsaythatsomethingthatyouneedtolookathimandlastofall,IwouldsaythatIwouldgivemyselftothesolutionandIwouldn'ttellmyselfaboutimputedrighteousness.Idon'tthinkbutIthinkImightgivemyselftheproblemandsayyouknowyouyoureallystartedtolearnaboutdoctrineandlearnaboutdebatingwithwithevangelicalsandthereisthisisthisoneproblemthatisgoingtobeyourwife'schallengeandyouneedtolearnhowtocomeupwithananswerforthatistheimpossiblegospelargument,andI'mprobablyjusttellmyselfwhatthatisandandjustleavemyselfwiththatbecauseIknowthatthatwouldbethecatalysteventuallyformeleavingthechurchandinfindingmoretruths.Learningaboutyourforensicrighteousnessanddoubleimputationsothat'swhatIwouldtellmyselfsothequestionfrommymissionwasoneofthehardestthingsaredone.Ireallycametolovethecultureofmycompanionstheregimenofbeingamissionarydayinanddayout,inandoutoftheapartment.Goingtoappointmentsknockingondoors,talkingtopeopleonthestreetreallycometoloveitandsomakingthetransitionbacktonormallifewastoughandwejusttalkedaboutthesummerfocussomeadviceonwhatIwouldsaytoyourselfforanymissionaryfromLatterDaySaints.Goingfromyourmission.IwouldsaythatyouspenttwoyearstryingtoteachpeoplethatthechurchsavesparticularchurchsavesandIwouldsaythatthechurchsavestalkedaboutearlier.TherearepeoplesittinginthepewsofeverycongregationinanOrthodoxChristiandenominationswerethosethatarenowoutsideoftheologicalorthodoxy.Therearepeoplesittingineverychurchthatyoumaypassdrivingdowntheroadwhoarenotsavedhavenotbeenbornagain.TheNewTestamentisveryclearthattheexperienceofbeingbornagainisanexperiencewiththesunhavingbeendrawntohimbythefatherandifyoulookthroughthepagesofthetest.EveryexperiencethatIwillhousewiththesunisbythedrawingofthefatherson.It'snotachurchandI'mnotarguingthatchurchpartofthelocalchurchengagedthelocalchurchisnotimportantjustsomechangesthatisalsoveryimportantpartofthechurchisnotwhatseemsyouandisamissionaryinterest,tohearhislifeteachingpeoplethatitisandIwillchallengeyoutoyourmindandinyourstudychallengethepremisefindallrightthat'sawraprecentlysentthemwiththespecialguestJordanrequiresafull-timeChristianmissionarytoLatterDaySaints.PeopletryChristmasrecentlyfromUtahwillbereleasingourconversationwithJordanisabonusepisodeonWednesday, September30.Wanttojoinusfireflies.Wethankyoufortuningintothisepisodeoftheouterbrightnesspodcast.We'dlovetohearfromyou.PleasevisittheouterbrightnesspodcastpageonFacebook.Feelfreetosendusamessagetherewithcommentsorquestionsbyclickingsendamessageatthetopofthepage.Wewouldappreciateitifyougivethepagealike.WealsohaveanouterbrightnessgrouponFacebookwhereyoucanjoinandinteractwithusandothers.Aswediscussedthepodcastspastepisodesandsuggestionsforfutureetc.youcanalsosendusanemailatouterbrightness@gmail.com Hope to hear from you soon. You can subscribe to the outer brightness podcast on Apple podcasts cast box Google podcasts pocket cast pod be specified in stitcher. Also you can check out our new YouTube channel. If you like it T-shirts to lay hands on that subscribe button and confirm it if you like what you hear. Please give us a rating and review wherever you listen and help spread the word. You can also connect with Michael Pollan just from water to wine.work blogs and sometimes upon that as well. Music for the outer brightness podcast is graciously provided by the talented Breanna Flournoy and by Adams Road. Learn more about Adams Road. By visiting their ministry page at Adams Road. Ministry.com I will is my my