State of the Plate Update

The covert crisis and social distancing drag and most churches are still seeing a marked drop in attendance and some had yet to open their doors. So what impact does that had on giving. You don't have to guess today host Rob West welcomes Brian Klute of the national Association of Evangelicals to give us the numbers.

Good and bad.

Then we open the phone lines for your calls and questions on anything at 800-525-7000 800-525-7000 times more state of the plate update.

That's nice right here on moneywise line Rob Pastor Brian is a noted speaker and author on church giving and currently serves as director of the NAEP's multiple year initiative to address the economic needs of pastors on that's right, Stephen.

That means Brian has his finger on the pulse of church giving and how the ongoing pandemic is affecting it. Brian, you were with us in May to talk about this were delighted to have you back a is great to be back with your new listers we were.

You have good news to report today, so hopefully they'll listen to be encouraged so delighted to hear it because things look pretty bleak. A few months ago. As far as church attendance and giving our concern. So I give us a praise report. Yeah well the good thing is the churches and pocketbooks have been reopening. Slowly but surely they have been reopening so we got good news to report. That's great.

Give us a sense of what the data is saying.

As you can. Now versus what we were seeing just a few months now. The we were able to survey back in August April over thousand churches, and then we followed up in here in August. We did another thousand churches all 50 states. Churches of all sizes across America and were seeing that there's really been flipped and things are beginning to really improve by way of finances for churches. Also churches are opening up much more than we would've expected. I will talk about some of those numbers in a moment, but it's been encouraging to see churches and pocketbooks reopening. That's great, and delighted to hear that Brian, one of the key factors determining church income is obviously the personal income of members. How has that changed since last April. Yeah that's actually been fairly steady. But what the big thing to point out a 75% of people have seen no change in their household income and 4% sought co-op and then 21% did see a decrease, so we are seeing in America that there's a growing number of people that churches need to be aware of in their congregation and in their community that are probably going to need some help in the days, weeks and months ahead.

Yes, well, that's a great opportunity for church members to be the hands and feet of Jesus and for church churches. C.

To be aware of that as well as they minister to the needs of the local body that Brian given what you just said about income and that's encouraging.

How has all of this affected giving specifically over the last few months. Yeah, what we saw in this in the spring in April.

Following told it was two thirds, 65% of churches saw giving go down in the room is really a pretty hard shock to the church world when they had a closer doors and many of them were not prepared for online giving in and how to even do services and that is kind of flipped during this time, so that in all. In April there were 65% churches are giving declines and now we see 36% percent have giving declines and 64% have now, either stabilized or their giving has increased. That's still a hard number that still means 1/3 of churches in America are struggling financially leave the scene there giving go down and there grappling with their facing challenges without and so there's still a lot of work to be done and a lot of encouragement to be given but you churches have been adjusting and that we also are seeing a lot of churches have now done online giving digital giving is becoming more regular part in the people just stepping up and be more faithful to their church as they realize those that have the enough resources or excess or extra are being even more faithful and more generous to the church which is really important yeah that so encouraging. Well we got had a break here when we come back.

I want to talk about this idea of churches having cash reserves obviously a season like this is highlighted the need for churches to follow the same biblical principles around reserves as the rest of us as God's people will also talk specifically about church attendance and how we can even come alongside her churches in a difficult time that a much more around the corner that's right joining us today is a special guest author, teacher and church giving expert Brian. They state of the plate.

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The work you are doing in the studies you are conducting out of the national Association of Evangelicals related to the state of the plate was discouraging. Just related to the number of churches that were really seeing a significant downturn in receipts of the number of people giving on a regular basis all brought on by the COBIT 19 pandemic and you share just before the break, some encouraging trends of a reversal of sorts, although some churches still struggling were certainly seeing a pickup in both generosity as well as the what churches are seeing coming in. Let's talk for a moment just about the need for reserves and we get this question often from church lay leaders and even pastors Brian wondering whether they should have reserves and where is that tension and balance between taking what comes into the church and getting it out in the form of ministry and keeping some reserves beyond restricted funds and maybe mortgage reserves that are required. How much would you counsel church to have on hand as they think about perhaps building that up in the days and months ahead.

Yeah, art our church look when I was a pastor for 10 years. We looked at always trying to have fought three months of reserve on hand just because things come up in this world and so that was kind of a practice, we instituted while I was a pastor and served us well I you. The Bible says the official fool spends all he has and so it's not wise to just spend everything but for many churches the challenges they're very limited.

The average church budget in America is $125,000 and so that doesn't go very far for giving in the pastor's salary and pay for the buildings in the programs and try to save so for many churches cell finances are a real struggle and not my goal in the work I do is to help pastors and church boards and leaders really come to grips with those things.

We have a lot of Lotta programs to help them with the in the NE financial health initiative yes well I know you've been a real blessing to so many churches literally around the country.

Brian obviously social distancing forced many church leaders to rethink their services made significant adjustments, obviously moving online in large numbers and how has that affected overall attendance will there's some exciting news, and that this spring overhead out role right right about half the churches in America that we surveyed saw 2 to 5 times people more people online than they ever saw in the service so there was more word going forth in ministry happening as people were stuck at home and looking for help in looking for help and really ever before in our lifetime.

So we saw a huge surge as churches grappled with this issue of providing online services and so that's a also. That's a good thing. I think that's can continue the future.

I just think this covert is know this. Maybe some people are not to be comfortable in larger groups, so churches are going to have to do both on-site and online and right now, 92% of churches are providing online services and that's encouraging and we are really surprise her. I was really surprised that nearly 9/10 churches have returned to a service in a live service they are doing services often social distancing people wearing mass. Usually when they come in and so forth and and so that was much higher than were hearing the news that 9/10 churches are back meeting, but in those meetings. It's usually half or less of your people are back with you.

Yes, so your church at 200. Normally you know there's less than 100 showing up your church with files and there's less than 500 showing up. And so you know it.

And so you need to really so churches need to be doing both on-site and online so just kind of where were so Brian, do you think that church budgets going forward will will have to allow some additional funds to maybe upgrade their technical approach to things that you know they they really had to grapple with that.

This whole year because you know they they needed to do that. But even with a nonprofit churches. They did get a women's groups men's groups Bible study group Sunday school classes all learn to get online even pastoral counseling. You know because you can go see people so that the learn to pick up the phone or do a video call in our church all the elders and staff called every single family to see how they are doing.

So there's things that are happening from a ministry perspective that were being forced into and a really good way because were forced to connect with our people to see how they're doing and the love them well. During these times we know we were called the shepherd the flock that God has given us and that's true for every everybody listening in their in their congregation and for elderly members of the church that really may not be comfortable with technology. I suppose the local church should really make an effort to contact those people by phone or even personal business to keep them up to speed and to let them know that you're still a major part of our church. We love you if you need some technical help, we can provide that, if not will find some other ways just to let you know that you're a member of the body and your valued right you absolutely, and not you what's been kind of fun is a lot of people that are older have learned to use technology to talk to their family felt so there people are more online than they've ever been. My wife reconnect with all right school friends Jen talked of in 30 years and now they have a monthly meeting so I it's a crazy world that is no question about it, Brian. I want to spend the remaining time together talking about this incredible campaign that you're doing with the any eco-bless your pastor that you know God's people need to step up in the months ahead in their giving, but also in their encouragement. COBIT has placed incredible stress as you well know on pastors also tell us about the bless your pastor campaign the bless your pastor campaign fits perfectly into October. Pastor appreciation month in the great news is we have a $250 gift card for people's pastor and what the people need to do is just go to bless your pastor.org.

Bless your pastor.org and we have a free Flyers call 50 ways to bless your pastor and so we asked churches to get that free flyer and distributed to their congregation by email or handed out whatever they want to do her mail and then we encourage an appreciation offering be taken and when churches give out that free 50 ways to bless your pastor and take up the offering and let us know. We will send their pastor $250 Amazon gift card and we have grant funds to do that so we would love to bless your pastor, especially with October Pastor appreciation month right in front of us so hopefully a lot of people will be able utilizes free materials@blessyourpastor.org I love that we got just about to 30 seconds left. Brian, this is really practical and helpful. This resource give us just a couple of the ideas from the 50 ways you can bless your folks have a sense of what you're providing yeah one of things you do is how to pray for your pastor. We have a list of things to pray for, we encourage you to do things like give a gift card or if your barber cut their hair of your mechanic take care of their car. If you got a vacation home.

Sharon, I just anything you can personally do to be an encouragement or blessing to your pastor and church staff. That's what the bless your.org materials provides for every Christian. And for every church to distribute yeah the status of a great opportunity for you to take that mountain home that you have been let your pastor well I'm more interested in having Brian coming to my house to cut my hair L something like that about bless your cohost is Unless your radio host. 1111 have Brian, thanks for being with us. Always a joy to have you my friend may great to be with you and your listeners and we just rest of the book@theblessyou.org free materials and love on the pastor October Pastor appreciation Bless your brand. It's always a pleasure to have you with us again. It's the state of the plate.info or bless your.org your calls next right here on moneywise line.

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It's a real honor and a pleasure to serve you moneywise live is a place where timeless wisdom meets today's financial choices and decision, and we say timeless wisdom. Obviously Rob were talking about God's timeless word, his wisdom, and it's amazing that the Bible has over 2000 verses that have to do with money and possessions. And that's choose from.

I let's begin by going to Tampa, Florida hello Mary, thanks for calling us today.

What's on your mind and thank you for taking my call you a living well in a living truck drawn up by my head and loved it. And now my fantasy so I need to have it revised. I have to letting daughter and I have grandchildren, I was wondering what price range year truck starting at okay yeah well let me just clarify couple of things number one we just encourage you this is the good direction you're headed. Because we do need to update wills and trusts over time as our situation changes. Certainly, yours has.

And so this is a great time to do it. I don't we don't provide any services here, financial services, or investment advisor, legal help, but we do recommend what's called the certified kingdom advisor designation for those looking for competent professionals in estate planning, which is what you need as well as financial planning, investments, insurance and tax and accounting, but it's a designation that professionals earn to build on a base of competency and really specialize in bringing God's word to bear in their financial advice. But each attorney, each financial advisor would determine their own fees.

So I think what I would do marry because you don't have access to. Don't know who the attorney was that drew it up initially. If that's not on the document itself. I would encourage you to find a competent, godly estate attorney for this you can make amendments to a living trust and have them notarized and then With a legal document, but I really would go see a competent professional who can really help you do that review it. Look at the laws of the state help you talk through your current family situation and of course give you a price and then if you agree ultimately proceed with making the amendments I visit with a couple maybe two or three estate planning attorneys and if you'd like to find one there in Tampa you can go to moneywise live.org just click on find a CK when you call, you could ask what that would cost and they would readily tell you what an amendment like that would cost as an alternate approach you could call your local church there in Tampa and just asked for a referral to a godly estate planning attorney, but I think that's the next direction I would go so you make sure it's done properly. It's in force and others no reason why you can ask what those costs are and make that one of your decision-making criteria as you decide to proceed with.

Does it make sense.

Mary okay okay. We appreciate your call today and I would encourage you to go ahead and get that done. God bless you and her Christmas time.

I already have this right now button emails to one of those today okay okay this is this is from Sammy says. Dear Rob, I've been employed with my company for 12 years. Is it okay to buy a life insurance policy through my employer's plan. The premium cost less than buying from other places are there any pros and cons that I should know about. Yeah. Well first of all, many employers offer free life insurance as a benefit. It's known as group life, as opposed individual life.

All you have to do is sign up. In some cases it's even automatic. Don't miss that.

If that's a benefit provided to you by your company take full advantage of it. Now why would you want to buy group life insurance through your employer, mainly because of convenience it's there. Maybe you haven't done it yet. Often times it is a good deal. And because it's group life. There's typically not a medical exam required so if you have a significant medical condition. It may be the most cost-effective insurance you can find. So what are the disadvantages. There probably are some yeah there are a first of all, most of us are not likely to stay at the same place throughout our career and you may not be able to convert it to an individual life policy. If you are the cost would likely go way up.

Secondly, your next off your next employer may not offer group life and thirdly, it's more expensive as you age.

So if you're in a buy. For instance, term insurance and by enough of it. So your properly covered.

You're gonna want to buy that as young as you can and probably for 20 or 30 years. Well, if you get into a group policy and then you leave that employer and now you're five years older 10 years older it's can be more expensive when you go out to buy new individual life policy. So how you some all this up. What I would just simply say take advantage of free group life insurance don't miss that number to compare the cost of supplemental group life insurance through your work with an individual life insurance policy could get on your own. If it's the same or even just slightly higher for the individual policy. I get that. Because that's going to transcend where you currently work in the number three get enough coverage. Term life insurance is cheap, relatively speaking, and I don't like seeing people underinsured because they don't have enough money to really provide what's needed in the event of their death. So get enough coverage right. We hope that helps you Sam and if you have an email question for Rob West you consented to questions@moneywise.org questions@moneywise.or thanks for being tuned in today. This is moneywise live. It's a real honor and blessing to have you with us and with that I will work and had to put a bow on it for this segment, all except for the moneywise in the magazine. We have a new email. You see, it's a quarterly publication. It contains special podcasts and articles and inspiring stories and you should check it out today your free subscription, you sign up for that.

When you visit our website moneywise.org moneywise.O are you listening to moneywise live with Rob West. Today's broadcast is recorded so we won't be taking any calls but we have some calls lined up. It's a great way to find how should we as Christians think about investing.

What if we could invest our money in a way that aligns with what we believe that Eventide we believe it is possible to love God and love our neighbor in the very practice of investing we design investments for performance and a better world so you can invest for the future with a sense of wholeness and purpose. We call this investing that makes the world rejoice. More information is available@investeventide.com Christian healthcare ministries enables believers to meet their healthcare costs affordably, biblically and compassionately. It's not insurance but a voluntary cost-sharing ministry based on the biblical example of Christians sharing each other's needs and members are defined under the law for not having health Christian healthcare ministries might be your health cost solution call 800-791-6225 or visit CH ministries.org space and the communications media and many mailings that week is founding 667. These commandments today are to be on your heart. Children found them when they wrote when you lay down that's Deuteronomy 6 6790 radium first of that week. Things are always happening in the radio God is at work in listeners all around the world. Monthly online newsletter uplift is changed in order to bring more listener stories more program updates and more listening resources be among the first to know about radios ongoing out check out the old new newsletter uplift subscribe right now my moody radio.org my moody radio gun. Here's a great deal more about our money than most of us imagine anything. Jesus says more about our use of money and possessions and about anything else, including both heaven and hell and managing God's money, author Randy Elmore and breaks it all down in a simple, easy to follow format that makes it the perfect reference tool if you're interested in gaining a solid biblical understanding of money, possessions and eternity managing God's money is available when you click the start button moneywise live.org is on John's job alone Kentucky detective charged in connection with the fatal shooting umbrella Taylor is pleaded not guilty.

Brett Hankinson's plea comes five days after a grand jury indicted him on three counts of wanton endangerment requiring into the home of Taylor's neighbors open California's wine country is on fire. Again, as strong winds are fanning the flames, prompting evacuation orders involving more than 50,000 people, cars coming on the third anniversary of deadly wildfires that erupted in 2017, including one of those fires that killed 22 people resident Robert expected to announce the shipment of millions of rapid coronavirus test states.

This week he plans to urge governors to use them to reopen schools Wall Street rally today Vidal game 410 points that as backup 203. The S&P 500 had 53. This is SR and use Matthew 2540 reminds us, and the king will answer them. Truly I say to you as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers did it on to me Sanders in Miami and how can we help you Sandra. I am very simple. My what I'm aware that you Sandra. It's a great question and in terms of a tithing on Social Security yet.

Let's back up, here's my approaches to giving in general.

First of all why do we get well you're a manager, just like I am. And we all are, of whatever God has entrusted to us and so we look at money through biblical lands and we say money is a tool to accomplish God's purposes. He gives us principles on how to manage it, and we should attach money to meaning and as we set goals for our life, we should look at how God wants us to use that in terms of providing them, which is clearly laid out in Scripture were to provide for families for first Timothy's very clear about that. God says we should enjoy what he's entrusted to us and so it's for enjoyment. We should also live with contentment.

All of those ideas are supported in Scripture and then he gives us principles as to how we should live. He doesn't tell us what our lifestyle should look like he doesn't say you should live on and spend 68.2% of your income healings that up to you to decide in and I would make that a matter of prayer and that should be reflected in your spending plan or your budget now where it is giving enter into that. Well I think clearly throughout the old and New Testament where affirmed.

In this idea that we should be generous, we should be givers because giving breaks the power of money in our lives. It calibrates our hearts to God's heart.

It's an act of worship.

It should be done without compulsion. That should be done cheerfully and we get to participate in God's activity through her giving. Now how do we get well. The Bible says that we see the principle of the tie which is the first 10% supporting the work of the local church the storehouse. We also see in the New Testament talk about giving proportionately as God has provided to us. And so I think systematic giving is a great place to start. In fact, I would apply the principle of the time the first fruits right off the top.

Now that's where we get to this question of okay should I tithe on Social Security because in a sense I've been paying into the Social Security system and once I reach retirement innocence getting back a portion of what I put in and so that's where some people would say really a party tied the money on that money. I take a little bit of a different approach. I would say whatever comes into your hand as God's provision.

However, it got to you and so I would say is a way to honor the Lord if you want to apply the principle the tie-dyed do that on everything that comes into your hand and then we use that as a starting point, not an ending point and we say, Lord, what would you have me to do as you're able and as he entrusts money to you.

I would look for ways to even get beyond that, even sacrificially now at the end of the day. This is not about legalism. This is not about checking a box. This is about a relationship with the living God, who is your creator and so I think I would be on my knees, saying, Lord, what would you have me to do that, I realized Sandra that was a long answer to a short question, so I would just suffice it to say it's it's between you and the Lord, but I would say forget apply the principle of the time the first 10% to the local church.

The storehouse for me. I would do that on Social Security, just like I would do that on disability or any other form of income including your wages right off the top and then see what God does with that but it all needs to be done in the context of a well-defined spending plan and it needs to be done prayerfully and because I that can I do not want to warrant given offspring, but Maddox started to hide because now very tight, but the way you put it, and trusting God with what you have yet meant that food for thought and prayer. I'm so glad you approached it that when I think that's exactly what it is. It's really about trusting God. Not are things we ultimately trust God. He is our provider, not the government, not our employer, not anybody in one of the ways we demonstrate that trust is through the obedience and giving holding everything loosely with an open hand. But obviously Sandra's Rob's mentioned in this situation. This is something that you and if you married your spouse should talk about pray about and do what you believe God is speaking to your heart about us that good grammar. Sorry about that but I think you get the gist of it and we wish you the best. Thank you for having an open heart about this Hollywood, Florida. David what you question today might call you about. Thank you, David, and a lot of the doubts regarding that typing might be a night work a couple more hours at a part-time job. I told him that he needed to get 10% of the typing and replied what all do I have to pay God not to repeat blessing and a little bit better want to quote Richter the Bible looking to be struggling right now where you go to church or not there is even that he made bracket now where you know you got a blog or drink. I would you explain the teenage euro about tithing and I heard you come up appointment with Andrea Tronic 220 miles away from the between Miami and is the electronic age that were living in tithing considered biblical if you do it on drawing and what you doing it with some people say all you should be doing it at the baby but you yeah well David is in the same way we were talking with the previous caller you know I think the important part here is to recognize this is not about a cosmic vending machine in the sky. This is a relationship with the living God who sent his son to die for you and for me and for your son and all of us to pay the penalty for our sins and he's our provider everything that we have comes from his hand.

Our next breath and that includes the resources that we have the Bible says even the power to make wealth comes from God himself.

And so as we recognize that it puts us in a completely different position.

Your son is not making money and hundred percent or 90% is his and is then required to give 10% back to God. Know 100% is gods, Psalm 24 one says the earth is the Lords and everything in it. It's all is and so God and trust that to us and part of being a faithful steward is recognizing the relationship we have to our money, our money is a tool to accomplish God's purposes in our lives and we should enjoy it. We should live with contentment and we should also use it to provide for ourselves and those that are dependent upon us, and here's what we find is the secret to really understanding this is by holding it loosely by being generous, you know, we can see money as an end and of itself that our self-worth equals our net worth, and that were not going to experience significance until we have a healthy bank account and that ultimately, success is defined by the number of zeros, but at the end of our portfolio. What we realizes none of that's true. We just have to look to those who have great wealth in Hollywood and in professional sports. Not all of them but sort certainly some service great examples that money does not fulfill us. God is the only thing that fulfills this. That's where our trust should be and as we give we realize the blessing that comes with the joy that comes from it that the ability to participate in God's activity. All of it comes through generosity. Then when we answer the question how to give. We give systematically and applying the principle of the tie the firstfruits back to the local church is starting is just that it's a beginning point on the Howard getting why is everything I just said David Stan will I will talk you out of here with something like this and this is buying a home is the largest most nerve-racking purchase. Most of us ever make. It doesn't help that you're entering a maze of unfamiliar words and confusing options that can lead you intimidated frustrated and afraid you been taken advantage of navigating the mortgage mates by Dale Vermillion helps you clear up the confusion on rack your nerves and make the best mortgage decisions possible with confidence navigating the mortgage maze available when you click the start button moneywise live.org hi. I'm very required. I'm here to help you understand the urgency and how much fun it is to share your faith in the eyes of a layman for the first time in human history. Every country in the world has lost faith in his leadership and is prepared to accept a single global leader. Meanwhile, the world economic forum with people like George Soros, Bill Gates and the Pope are calling for a global vaccine in a global reset or New World order to get your attention, nothing will. They God the Roger happy for any that takes place within New World order is close to happening how costless the rapture of the and that means time is running out your unsaved friends and loved ones into heaven before the rapture happens in their left behind. That is not an option if you knew the renters happening tomorrow.

Who would you call your name will you tell them without question, the clock is ticking. There's nothing more exciting than knowing God is using you to move people closer to join us in a nightmare.com connect with children. Here's can fail for gray matter. It's an incredible privilege to be a grandparent, let me say that again and send the incredible privilege to be a grandparent years ago. My late wife DNI recognize that our involvement as grandparents was one of the most important investments we can make in our family and because of its importance.

We have done all we could to stay committed and be involved whenever and wherever possible and sure it isn't always easy or fun. Still, it's an incredible privilege gift from God, and we have tried to make the most of it is that how you feel to.

I sure hope so because grandkids they do matter is engaged in loving grandparents.

We can have a tremendous impact on the future of families, most couples can't talk about yet.

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We previously included, think so much for being with us today and we hope will stick around and enjoy its moneywise live were really pleased as punch that you're out there today. Thank you so much for tuning in listening and telling others about us Spokane, Washington, Dolores, what you question for Rob charged me with good Christian follow all company okay so he's present just checking your door so he specifically said I want you to call Robin Steve and find out what they think is specific and his kin if I should never mind. I did tell me a little bit more about what you're trying to do. So you're borrowing some money for what purpose borrowing and borrowing money. I like to borrow $20,000 because I like to enlarge my house so I can move my sister because she is drug world for about 20 years and now she had all kinds of disability and she's been straight to the last about one year but she's got all the leftover thing going on.

Yes, it's a divorce here to be doing some home improvements to prepare for her moving in. Is that right, but I'm going to a larger room on back like little living room and bathroom vent and my two grandsons are going to build it but it cost me about $20,000 for materials very good in tell me about your cash flow Dolores in your ability to repay that loan. Once you take it you have some margin on a monthly basis that you can use the payback that I don't really want to use that you have a rather large account and you just get a good Christian group and we will just pay for it not be a problem for that. Okay I guess I'm wondering why borrow the money in the first place. If you have the ability just to pay for it out of your excess savings or investments because anything you borrow is obviously going to have an interest rate associated with it.

You take a home equity loan or line of credit that's going to cost you up somewhere around 5% or more time and your you may not even be earning that much on where some of that money is parked right now assuming you have some money available, and so it it seems to me that that the best option. Again, I don't know the totality of your financial situation, but the best option would just be the pay for this out of either your savings or your cash flow without taking a loan now one of the options as far as loans are concerned. Well you would mention a Christian company to borrow from and you know what you could look at in a Christian bank or institution is something like ECC you you could look at the thriving financial their credit union if you wanted to work with an organization that serve specifically Christians but I think at the end of the day. The key for you unless you have a conviction about working with the company is primarily focused on serving believers is to look for the first of all, do I need to borrow the money in. Does that make sense financially and an MI on the same page with my husband and are we in agreement because I think that's one of the keys before you get into debt and then to what type of loan. Should I get one of the terms meeting.

How is it going to be repaid and then what is the interest rate and you want to make sure all those lineup and so for me I would soak in the first question is do I need to borrow the money I would stop right there and just make sure that borrowing for this actually makes sense because it sounds like to me you will have the money. Is there a reason you wouldn't just pay for it not want to get done before the winter weather because she California and tell Kristin I love your sleep for years now. That's incredible okay now. If you are going to take a loan, then the question is what type of loan do you have a conviction, Dolores. You are your husband you want to work specifically with an institution that is because there are no suit, Christian companies right there Christians inside companies and then there's those companies who are either operated according to Christian values or companies where the owner or management are believers or their companies that are focused on serving Christians, do you have a conviction you want to use one of those, only well okay okay so then what I would do is I would probably call or look it up online thriving federal credit union.

The thriving finance thriving PHR IV ENT. Did you have a computer okay all right okay so I would check out thrive and you can find them@thriving.com and then mention one other to her. It's called ECC. You ECC you and that's expense for the evangelical Christian credit union.

I think either of those could serve you well and I would start there and talk to them about what the best options are for you to seek alone okay okay will very good. Why would check out both of those find out which one can serve you best and those are both the organizations focused on serving Christians and I'm confident they'll take good care of Dolores. We have to run, but thank you very much for calling me wish you guys the very best. You sound like a very very generous sister. Thanks Tampa Florida.

Karen you're on with Rob West I Karen you with us. Hello Karen Karen in Tampa are you there okay will more long thick you there. Karen I will be 13 or doing compromise not offer in compromise, but they have an online tool that I can use to see if I qualify for that but one of the questions that attacking is about my retirement account. I'm not sure what it means because it is retirement equity if it under income night conflict is retirement equity and my question is what is it could be looking at to enter yeah but just for the benefit of our listeners. An offer in compromise is an agreement between the taxpayer and the IRS that settles the taxpayers tax liability for less than the full amount. Think of it as a debt settlement except the. The lender is the press.

Now there's a form you're filling out to figure this out through their online tool, I suspect, and that's all it is. I probably call them to clarify, I suspect, with their wanting to know is what is your balance in retirement accounts. So think, 401(k), 403B, IRAs, 401(k)s and Roth IRAs.

They want to know how much do you have in retirement equity, so this is an at any assets that you have in your name that are inside retirement accounts and that's just one of those considerations they want to know as they offer in compromise that is considered to some extent because now I know I know I just wanted to make sure I am tired of being a realistic number okay yes very good now. All the best to you in that process and hopefully that'll get you paid off and on track to pay off your IRS dad and we can then move beyond that. Thanks for calling today.

Thank you. Karen quickly to Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio Fritz were going to have to do it. About 60 seconds here. Okay, okay. Thank you Michael. Question about savings account want to move my emergency fund into one and listening before a bunch. I've taken your advice and going to bank rate.com looked up the three online bank you recommend, but also will look maybe if you had more tips on other information to compare them to against each other, bank rate starting them and uses three factors for rating them.

Their capital banks quality of their assets in the bank's earnings when you had any comment on those information on how to compare bank to bank requested Fritz so I like online banking. I like the fact that you would be setting up an online savings account. That's where you're going to get you fully no fees and higher interest rates well above 2% of just reading an article today about the $70 billion that Americans are missing out on because they have savings stuck in savings accounts that are paying almost nothing in the way of interest so I like the direction you're headed. I would look at a couple of things. One is I think bank rate is a great place to go in their star rating system is very effective to evaluate the strength of the bank in those three criteria are great.

The only reason you want to look at that is because any online bank you be looking at needs to be FDIC insured, but the strength of the bank means you don't need to rely on the FDIC insurance which takes time. If the bank fails, so I would use that the rating system and then after that I'm looking at. No fees and I'm looking at the highest interest rate possible and that's where I usually come back to how I capital one 360 and Marcus, at least for right now they were out of time today Fritz thanks for your call my friend.

We wish you the best Fritz, thanks very much and thank you again SMH and for tuning in for listing after calling for being a part of the program moneywise live is a partnership between Moody radio and moneywise media and listeners arrive West times more for you and yours have a wonderful remainder of the day, then join us again next