Seeing Suffering Through God's Eyes (Part 2 of 2)

Today on Focus on the Family will be returning to a very powerful story about mitigating grief and loss and how God wants to reveal himself to you during those moments. Here's a comment from Pastor Levi Lesko that illustrates that truth Paul in Ephesians prayed that God would give us the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the eyes of our understanding would be enlightened and I believe that if the Holy Spirit of God brings light flooding into our eyes. All of a sudden we will see with the new spiritual supernatural vision that like Paul would enable us to look at incredibly difficult things, like he did. And you say their small they don't last very long. The not even worthy to be compared to the glory that shall be revealed in us, then I'm not staring at what I'm going through on staring at what God is going to produce in my difficulties. What can't be seen with the naked eye. Thanks for joining us today for Focus on the Family your hostess focus Pres. and Dr. Jim Daly and Don John Fuller generally had an amazing conversation last time with Levi and his wife Jenny, who described the incredible pain and sorrow that they experience after their five-year-old daughter Linea suffered an asthma attack and died unexpectedly in their arms and men. It was emotional and I just can't imagine a greater agony than that and were so grateful that Levi and Jenny have been willing to share their story with us, and reveal how God is been at work in their faith. And then in their family and this is really powerful. I do recommend you get a CD copy to share with somebody listen to is your driving somewhere. If you have a CD player in your car. You can also download the audio or watch us on YouTube was a very moving first part of the broadcast were back again today with the Lesko's we mentioned last time that Levi and Jenny copastor fresh life church. They have locations in Montana, Wyoming, Oregon and Utah, all the good spot if they are yeah and they've each written a book that captures the story and the lessons they've learned.

The weighted learn more about who God is.

Levi's book is through the eyes of a lion facing impossible pain finding incredible power and Jenny's book is called the fight to flourish, engaging in the struggle to cultivate the life you were born to live in. We have details about those books on a website, give us a call or check the show notes for the links Levi Jenny welcome back so pretty and I appreciate it.

See you when we speak about suffering and loss and were really picking up from yesterday.

So what is going to plow ahead and again if you missed it. Get a copy of that get the download, but first of all as a pastor, Levi. It's hard to fill seats when you're giving sermons on suffering is not really what draws people in, may be, but you know it's been said that if you can learn how to minister hurting people you'll never be without an audience because there in the world is full of hurting broken people well said well said and you urge people to have eyes of faith in you point to the Old Testament story. I think in second Kings six, which describes how a huge army had surrounded the prophet Elisha fill the stories and I love the way a talented communicator and pastor like you can connect those stories to how they apply to real life is only people struggle with us or how does that apply to me today.

It's a bizarre story because you have a presumably get hazy and then Elisha we know is the man and hit. The situation is his whole army was coming to kill Elisha because he would always tell the king of Israel what the enemies armies were doing was like having a drone. You know, so that the king said, look killed a guy like the drone out so he sends an army.

They circled the city, where he's in and they the servant. Daisy probably goes out to get the newspaper and he looks up and sees full army around them and he's freaking out so he can backs into the house and dies a real big in Elisha's drinking a coffee and go as I was going on he goes were surrounded were dad. You know the red laser beams all over their casting out guns and using my imagination here I course, but then Elisha is not worried. All he was is no big deal is more on our side than on their side observance like wait a minute, he looks and just two of them want to math is really easy, and he looks at their casino maybe 30,000 army in the Army and he goes pastor you. It's getting that in the ministry because your math is terrible. Sign out more on our side on their side and and then Elisha realizes he was only looking at the human and so he says God I pray you would open his eyes that he may see why when he looks again the same armies there, but now behind and there's a bigger army a different Army and angelic army and I love the store because it doesn't say that the angel showed up when he opened his eyes, just that he became able to see what was already there but the thing that had them surrounded.

Was it self surrounded by God. I mean, that's one of things we suffer from in the church today right.

We only look at what's in front of us. What we can see, taste and smell, and I hope for myself and I can only speak for me. Sometimes I'm shortsighted that way. Not realizing God's army is right there in that so critically puts it into perspective.

You know to see not just what's there, but what God says is that's how Paul said we don't lose heart.

When we face troubles, but we look at what's being produced in us the exceeding weight of glory.

So again that's putting that lens of faith on not using what's there to see what God says is there. I understand you love space, I love it as well. Astronomy is always been something even when I was a boy I was fascinated by the sky. Just thinking of you know, billions of light-years and try to comprehend what infinity how you measure that averages those wonderful thoughts. At eight, nine and 10 what how can that even be you like to talk about the Hubble telescope.

How do you use that as a spiritual metaphor is a great story because the years 1990 and Hubble has just been launched and they spent 1,000,000,000 1/2 dollars on it. A lot of people thought it wasn't worth the money.

But they said no. If we can get this thing out there about the atmosphere, it can see the heavens and broadcast back to earth. What seeing unobstructed will have a greater understanding of our solar system and universe and so they get this thing launched and they fired up and everyone sitting at NASA in the first image loads its blurry second image blurry. Third, all the images are blurry. It's worthless. It's very good at a lot of things. He just can't see very far because they miss calibrated the primary optical component making Hubble basically nearsighted Hubble needed glasses, guys. So what they did was they loaded up the same lens but with the same problem backwards and they loaded up on space shuttle endeavor they caught Hubble no mind. He was moving 17,000 miles an hour, 366 miles above the earth, and they put the basically put a contact lens in front of it and when they fired it up fresh all the images became crisp, and until James Webb telescope is launched, presumably in the next 12 months or so. Hubble has been and remains the gold standard in telescopes that have ever reported images back of of the deep space field etc. etc. the stories cool because it shows us this. When Hubble was looking at the universe and sending blurry images back the images it was seeing were in 3D.

They were beautiful. They were crisp.

The problem was the lens and the lens. It was looking through and I think for a lot of us when we look at our lives and we look at the pain that we face.

We see blurry and it's not that that things were looking at our are the problem. It's how were seeing them. That is one of the interests that I have to do is just looking at first century church ancient Rome what they were doing in the Roman Empire. It's kind of intriguing and it brings out all of humanity's characteristics.

I think lust and greed and then within that than the birth of Christ in our faith thing is born right at me and it's all there in ancient Rome used Levi Sure the idea of bread and circus and how that applies to us today to help me fill in the gap yes beautiful you know Jen and I both love this idea of how the Roman emperors basically stole control total control. They did so by anesthetizing the people with creature comforts. So long as they had bread to eat and pageantry going on good editorial games. The people didn't realize that their freedoms were being taken away from them as so long as they had the bread and circuses to give them free food and they get them entertainment and those things distracted them, and meanwhile the glorious idea of the freedom of the Roman Empire. Which of the Senate and everyone had a voice. It was basically taken away from them and the Emperor became the sole dictator in the enemy wants to do a similar thing he wants us to focus on bread and circuses entertainment and just what's happening on tick-tock. Meanwhile, heat the thief of our souls is taking away the freedom that Jesus set us free for you, I mean that's powerful. You gotta stop and think about that but one of the you know the similarity there is the gladiators and the sports figures of that time being lifted up to be something more than human right. I think were doing that again today were athletes are so vaulted in this culture there.

The superstars and there's a lot of similarity between then and now was just the lust of the flesh. Thus, the eyes and the pride of life, and I think it's so easy to live, focus only on the here and now and again, like the Hubble lens that lends looking adjusted this world that when something hard happens. Hard to imagine how there can never be a brighter tomorrow and so it's learning to see through those things to eternity, you know, we like to say that we don't look at the grave where Lynn is buried in the tombstone as rest in peace. It's raised in power is what RIP stands for in our home because were not looking just this life looking at eternal life is good. Let's go there for a moment terms of the difficult topic of of suffering and seeing it as a gift from God. I yesterday said the same thing. It's hard for the modern church to grab that because I thought the exchange was I trusting Christ in my life gets pretty easy and I get blessings and not not diminishing any of that because that's part of the Christian life to but we've got to embrace the other side of this that suffering in Christ.

He said you will suffer night for my name.

I just think of James when he says consider it pure joy when you fall into various trials, knowing that it produces many lists all these things and I think that that is just again likely. I thought that lends a faith or we just have to see that when he got there suffering, it's actually producing an ASP or surfactants producing enough endurance. It's producing Annette's justice stronger faith and trust in the Lord and I think that and as we go through these things. It's so hard and yet there's a beauty and I think sometimes we just want to have on the good and the blessing and that Mikey sat there is the last thing for the believer in areas strength for the believer.

There is beautiful abundant life for the believer, but that also is blended with pain and sorrow and suffering because liquid our Savior into her. He's the one he suffered, and the goal of our lives is to become more and more like Jesus.

So it's that blending of the beauty and the blessing with the brittleness in that and the reality that every blessing you mentioned and more. God wants for us is just all the blessings you want.

On the other side of the trials and none of us want to face that a searcher know another hard truth.

Are you sure is that God and any when I say this, we as Christians man.

We tiptoe around the so carefully, but will often say that God allows suffering right.

He doesn't cause it and we have to begin disclaiming all of it such a weird kind of vocabulary that we do. Satan is often the one who's messing with our lives. It says he's like a lion or wolf seeking to destroy us.

That's powerful imagery of what the enemy of our soul is attempting to do, but he can't do anything without God's permission. It's such a conundrum and a lot of nonbelievers struggle with this idea of God is so good then why do these things happen so how do we accept or even understand that reality within the context of loss that you guys of suffer the loss of your child with anybody has a right to shake a fist. It would be you and couples like you that it had that paramount loss of a child dying yet. You know I think what you mention is important that the theological dance and I think semantics it can be like a luscious you're missing words here, but I really do think it is important we understand and have something is to fall back into as a safety net in these hard times for me it gives me great comfort to know God didn't cause my daughter's death that he did want to happen and that's why he's told us back in Genesis 3.

Not to eat the fruit that would cause death into this world, but as the enemy does work. God does have to allow Job tells us that clearly he had to ask God's permission to touch a hair on Job said did ask to sift Simon Peter is wheat so I believe that the enemy is the one who brings death and God has to allow, but he only ever does so to further his purposes, so that whatever the devil asks for will boomerang back around and this, you see this it that God sent Jesus, but ruthless men took him and killed him that Joseph's brothers took and laid hands on them and that I was wrong. That's sinful, but God sent him ahead to Egypt so it's it's an important understanding to delineate between what the enemy wants to accomplish through trials like the death of my daughter and what God wants to accomplish the written units in those moments I'm thinking of Job he didn't just him.

He couldn't leap with joy that there was a trial he was when he let Elizabeth Joe is living in real time.

Yeah, he was playing was bad and he was thinking this through, and processing.

This, but how did it turn out at the end but I want to hear you saying though Levi and Jenny's permission granted to feel and to wonder if it takes a while to get there to understand. But God's got this link that's big enough to handle our questions and I doubt anger and are jealous like he can handle. It's I think so often when rang the pain and were doubting and were in the struggle of I trust you got that I don't think so often we run away from the very God who has all the answers and you is the only comfort that we can have a runaway for handlebars Mitterrand to him because he's big enough to handle all of and he have to email he says I don't have to polish our prayers to God. You have to come to him with it all together we can come to hang on Max he can come to him with mascara running and our faith coming out and that him that I have a friend whose daughter died in a car accident and I told him because he kept coming in you and doing like that he didn't really understand.

I said could you just please be relieved from the responsibility of need to protect God from how you really feel he supposed to care you.

Don't worry about and care him tell how mad you are, you know it look like I said, hurting with hope still hurts and it hurts like hell, even when you know they went to heaven and that's a really important distinction to make that what the picture of faith looks like is like someone says over little calving is great, but you can be really like Job was really a mess, but he was pictured as this person of faith and perseverance in this context. Do you have a statement of the book about cuing the Eagle and I love it shirt with well you know when when you would hundred Jesus, I would often on my way home from work on myself at the side of her grave in one of those times.

I was really having a little moment and in that moment, I found myself on my knees and I was quoting the words of David, and I said my flesh is failing God but your my strength, my flesh is my heart is weak, but you never will fail and right then I looked up in the sky and saw a bald eagle circling the great and I just thought about Isaiah 40 you know those who wait on God will renew their strength to mount up like an eagle, and in some of the book. I use it as a picture of like whenever you're running out of energy or strength. Just ask God for new strength is not bad to route a guess if you can go to a gas station get new gas and soak you the Eagle call out to God in your trial and he'll give you new power circuit was a really great stuff from Levi and Jenny Lesko will be mentioned to book his is through the eyes of a lion facing impossible pain finding incredible power. Jenny's book is the fight to flourish, engaging in the struggle to cultivate the life you were born to live in. We have both of those books here, the links are in the show notes or call one 800 K in the word family leave. I understand you not much of a camper, you did live in Montana is one of the best cabling as I hope you realize that second Corinthians 5 says, you know, our earthly bodies are compared to tense and will eventually be replaced. That's the camping connection, but would describe what you're getting at. Well just call if I'm not much for 10 camper is you can't think we like that, the clamping ironically we talk yesterday about living in Montana and didn't make a lot of sense. By as we've lived there. We've grown to love where we live and become a fisherman can't pandemic one of the perks up and we look at our bodies like a tent. Paul said the tent gets taken down. That's what bought the death, is for the Christian, it's just leaving the tent to go to the heavenly home and so we look not at how many days has it been since when you died back to 2012. We look forward every day to how many days closer we are to her right.

Every day we wake up one day closer to being reunited because that's the day our tent gets taken down like hers and we get to go home to be with Jesus in our true heaven that our heavenly home. There was a day where I member my journal entries I would write down how many days it had been since you seen her last and said that was was a real thing for a while and then there was a kind of them line in the sand where we realize like yes all these days have happened and we hate that we haven't seen her in how many thousands of days but then he realized that every day that passes were actually close and not getting further from us were getting closer meals at Meadows that is a great way to think of that you know that you're drawing closer where she is already she's not in the grave, she Jesus was were going. That's encouraging.

Actually, that's a great way to think of it that we got time for just couple more insights and again I love the way you connect all the dots in the use, nature and science to look at God's handiwork and how it describes him right, I totally believe, and in part, you encourage believers to see through the eyes of a lion, so I love the lion analogies but what are you getting at here while Jenny and I both had the really difficult. Yes, of saying yes to cornea transplant surgery when when you went home to be with Jesus. They asked us to be harvest organs and we gave that tearful consent is a difficult yes, but an amazing organization called site life.

They facilitate more cornea transplant for blind people in the world and any other organization, and we partnered with them to say yes and her two corneas went to blind people and that both receive the gift of sight and it was very rewarding for us to hear about that and I later connect the dots. As Jenny said earlier in the broadcast last episode, Lenny means lion and so what we realized was they see these two people to the eyes of our linear lion and lions have tremendous site they can see. Further, they can see in the dark better and I believe that because as Jesus people. We are called to be as bold as lions that we can in this life face impossible pain but find incredible power seeing life. Jesus's eyes. This really profound.

There a lot of takeaways here. Jim things I'd love to ask you about is the importance of community you were leaving a community of faith and plugged in my observation about what's happened since covert is there's a lot of folks out there who aren't plugged in. They live no interest but I think it's really crucial and you brought this up in the book that you've got a come to prepare the way, not just so that when dark times, and stress comes in struggles, you have a support community, but I believe also seek and pour into those who are experiencing difficulty, surely, but more about the importance of building community now so that when the day comes, it's so important. I mean we we can't do life alone. We can't go through heart ache alone. We need people and I left what you said about not just that we can receive comfort that so that we can give comfort as well. And that's the body of Christ. That's what it looks like 10 to love each other to serve each other and to be there for each other and we need that and I think that cell often think maybe because we can listen to a message and a podcast which is amazing.

I think that's so mean that we can listen to church online but there's just no substitute for actually gathering with the church and obviously there so many complications of being with people and coveted and everything but I think that it's so important for us to gather and even if you are online to be a part of church intact be a part of small group online and said be and underneath someone's leadership. I think that is just a tequila lions of the only social. They always are, and prides, and it's the power of the pride and I think that what Jenny saying is so important for people to know that when you're welding community.

You don't realize it, but your training for the trial you're not yet in and how did that look for you and your family in the communities that you were really they rallied around us. They give a space to hurt. They knew our group we yahoo in your life that loves Jesus knows your garage code.

That's the question now is there to help you knows we know where the dishes are who can cook and and and that's what you're doing and for us it was that and more archers community is not a place for you. You have to have it all together and so we were broken. We are a mess and they we hurt with our people and they hurt with us to and together we grieved through it. You know that I think that's one of the great desperation's of our day is the lack of community were lonely and it's worse for your health and smoking two packs of cigarettes a day. Researchers have found to be socially disconnected in a meaningful way. We were created by God, who is it within himself community father-son Holy Spirit in his image. There always be parts of us that are going to be inaccessible.

If we don't have that dance of joy of love of relationship in our lives.

That's so true.

It says right there in Scripture were created in his image and he created us for relationship is not amazing let us make them in our image right were looking for and we can find any rhyming if you're part of a jam or yoga studio or Hunter group like you're gonna find it somewhere but it's not can have that eternal like leaning weight absolutely.

Or, you know, let me ask both of you because it you express such great desire and even the story of the night your daughter died to go back into the hospital to invite the hospital staff to come to the Christmas service. The other jaws had been hanging down it be interesting to hear what the conversation was when you left the hospital. We met many of those people afterwards and what they said to each other like and you believe that weight impact it made on them. I think I think that's the thing I'm trying to tell people you listen to this, you've lost a child. You lost a spouse are going through divorce going through chemo you're hurting. I just want to encourage you that there's in time by the spirits power.

That's gonna become a superpower for you. That's the power of the Beatitudes. Blessed are the poor in spirit. Blessed are those who are this is God preparing you to become a spiritual heavyweight. You could summarize it any better and that is what the last two days has been about and I just again I thank you for your vulnerability or open this your heart, your love for the Lord and then your ability to connect with everything happening around us that he could see God's creation and see God, right, it's not complicated. I love the way you weave it altogether and again you speaking from that pain point of losing your daughter and going through the fire and coming out and trusting God believing in God. Some people taken a turn the other direction and it's the rationalization that they have for not believing in God and man. If you're in that spot. I want to challenge you to rethink that because God is only for you is not against you, that there is someone against you, and I just hope your eyes can be opened to that reality and I think more importantly, Levi said it well right there. If you are hurting, get in touch with us focuses here for you. Course we got there, great books and they're available to refocus.

If you can afford and we want to give them to you. Just call us and let us know if you can participate in ministry with us, make a donation and choose a book and will send it to you as our way of saying thank you and you can do that and also connect with one of our counselors see if there is not a community already that you can leaning on or if they're not able to give you everything you need. Our number here is 800 K 800-232-6459 or check the link in the episode coming up tomorrow.

Why doing everything for your kids is the wrong to prepare them for adulthood and well-meaning you now being families that are buying into this message from society that says you have got to prepare the path for your can and not the kid for the path on behalf of Jim Daly and the entire team.

Thanks for joining us today for Focus on the Family I'm John Fuller inviting you back once more help you and your family thrive in Christ