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March 16, 2022 10:00 pm
In intentional fatherhood--how do we handle the ways we're weak? Author Jon Tyson offers tactics and hope to deal with inevitable wounds and weaknesses.
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They did research and NYU asking the question winded helicopter parenting begin and what was the consequences of 1990 was the year began, and within a decade, the rates of depression and anxiety increase by 80% in one all is because kids no longer knew that I have noticed is like mom did everything family life today where we want to help you pursue relationships that matter mouth and Wilson and Dave Wilson. You can find his way we live today.com or on our family life, family life, so couch with PJ I will think he was nine.
You are there. They were watching TV. Probably football, probably we still do anyway.
Somehow we get this discussion about mistakes in dad mistakes and I say to him I go CJ. Did you know that the Bible actually says that the mistakes that a dad makes will go down into his sons and the sons and daughters could possibly make famous fictional sins of the father is at your buddies that because of that. Did that scare them. I just never. He just looked at me, you know, again I might been eight or nine he just looks at me. I go CJ what you think it oh I did use the word sink is. I then quoted Exodus 20 because it's in the think member will realize in the think manager is that important a godsend. Be careful as a day because it's going to go in your legacy and I remember saying the word sin CJ nine years on their forget this moment just looks at me.
I could see everything goes dead Donelson. I guess I'm a lot like knives I like. Of course, so don't look as if you're going to go do it.
I'm doing but he got it you got it now is 35 and its crazy to see that my sons have taken things from me. Good and bad. Some things they never knew I struggle with their struggle with asking as a dad, father, and his demand is that scare you all the power we have, to influence our sons and daughters yeah is scary. I mean it's awesome that God gave us this power and mom 72.
I think that we as mom feel that and we watch. I remember saying to you. Do you understand the power you carry because I watch three little boys watching you constantly asked me they were watching you. You've got so much power over them.
It's amazing that it's also scary for the wife because I can tend to be critical like you should do this and that but I was almost jealous of the power you carried over our son.
The scary thing is you want to have a vision for your son being a better man than you are. And we get John Tyson back with us today. Who's not only a dad because you know this from a dad's heard from a pastor's heart, and as an author who wrote about this. Welcome back from Mike today. It's good to be back and enjoying a continuing on this conversation, but also as you're sitting over there I saw you smiling a bunch what we think about this whole conversation about the power of a dad. The sins of others. Just think of it like how if I missed my son to his life and what he struggles in life. That's mine.
That's from the bus from his mother that's in the culture.
Suspecting those things most of us from his mother cell goes only ever us. It's always the think about this you wrote about this in your book, intentional father, practical guide to raise sons of courage and character.
If you missed yesterday. I'm just on the listen and get the book. This book is going to change your life as a dad, but something you said yesterday. I want that I want to follow up on this concept called the father wound that we have sort of a wound from our dad's is it universal. Even if you're the best dad in the world is a census somehow you're knocking to be enough for your son. I think you're addressing two things under both truth. One thing is like a father always feel inadequate and in some measure yes yeah if you realize the sacred power as you mentioned that we have been parenting your last with shaping the lives we releasing destinies with saying throwaway phrases that will in the wound will release the kid into the 50s in the future amendments extraordinary sacred power that we have to trust we given the downside of that is, it will be inevitable that we we heard our kids will be inevitable. Psychologist tell us wound up and into categories saw the lack of protection or lack of knowledge which means parents don't stop. Things happen to us, the Hamas or parents failed to give us the emotional nourishment in connection that we need and if you trace brokenness down to the roots of childhood. You'll often find it's in those two things is lucky like I didn't feel loved enough, affirmed enough blessed all parents didn't put boundaries up in the front springs the home of the world way to Wellesley and so I think in some sense we are doing both of those things in some small measure and to be honest with you I think for sons.
A lot of times it is like my father was not nurturing enough was affirmed enough wasn't blessed wasn't cared for wasn't encouraged he was absent.
He was emotionally distant. He was critical he was distracted. That seems to be the number one wounding that icy and strange enough with daughters often. It's actually often the opposite small like there was not enough protection.
The boundaries went from enough but is a big generic postural observations both in both categories better themselves true in some sense were always wounding it with the best intent, but normally we ought to do it into categories don't much like we should, we do protect what should one of the reasons I asked is, obviously, I felt that with an absent father, but then you know as a young father and reason sons. I had a plan and I start talking to rites of passage in some senses. They grew into man.
I was like a pretty good job. You know I did do pretty good lawyers of the year.
I never thought I did a great job and I was like man I did so much better.
My dad did you know there can be men and they're going to thank me someday.
Then they they became men and they sit down to go dad some things he did to hurt me like what you know those adult adult conversations relating to every dad and mom's going to have its own point with your dog is maybe not, but in some sense I was like, really. You felt, heard, and let down in some way, and of course I should've expected that while I'm in the thing to do things you had health enough relationship. I feel like I can bring that to say it says a lot about you that they would come and feel safe and that they could say it is one of the do it with and not me.
Maybe having yeah I know my my son talks to my wife Christie ways he doesn't talk in the older they get when they when the kids get older they get into it though probably realize Dustin probably did better than were aware of the overall Mike by sons been unbelievably appreciative in a firm firm ability asking this because I've never asked a fellow pastor whose a dad this question because two of my three sons said I was more intimate in my sermons with the congregation.
Then they felt I was with them as their son sleep. They said they'd be sitting there, even as teenagers sometimes I be sharing something with a thousand people this very vulnerable and weakness in the struggle or solve a new attorney showing go, you know that I do know that look at that he is baring his soul to people that he doesn't even know and won't do that or hasn't done that in the family room. I never knew this winter teenagers but now that their 30-year-old man they set me down and said dad you know that was hurtful. I had no idea this John II came another mouses adult men.
I was like you're a thousand percent right. There was no defense of this is like is like who have you experienced say that as of father has passed you, you have to ask myself… I'm in.
I think I've got the benefit you're probably a decade older than me.
Hey you rub it in our site with all.
I think I'm better than a decade, I'm 44 okay so how do you two decades ago.
So there you go.
I think I am glad you thought I was younger, though that's a compliment. I actually inherited. I think the wisdom of your generation of fatherhood because I think stuff like that take up on. Yeah, I think it was on as the apostles conferences and talks to dads about ministering family dynamics was always you know don't share stuff with the Congress and they haven't shipped the family.
Looking is almost not fair is apostate. You go to come up with a compelling way Is maligning for content right to go back having children of the Texas in error about Tennessee okay what about my early 20s looking for. First off those people there every week so that you got a big pond and use of in some capacity but definitely got those family boundaries also permission before you share yeah yeah make sure you shut it with your family and I think again that may be something that I received is a blessing from an older generation things I picked up in your book go and you tell me if I'm accurate on this is.
I is I assess even that hurt for my sons in my mind it was courage. It was easier to be intimate with a thousand is really not you appear to be but you're still hold a lot back. As a pastor, but it takes curries to look a 15-year-old. The eye and go somewhere intimately. You know our conversation, but when I was reading your book, it felt like you have done that with Nate. I think I was very in touch with.
This is very in touch with the world is a confusing place if you are young man your body is filled with chemicals. It's pushing you out what you got erotic energy you then you surrounded by kids in binge watching porn on the phones.
This is very confusing place to try to test yourself with all the menu looking for sense of identity and belonging, and it's like the ferry confusing is to navigate and so I knew that from my own experience I would've projected confidence on this affiant… What talk to me this is weird. Yeah, my heart ached for and I think I just remembered my heart aches for this and I'm not going to go for my son surface behavior monograph is hot.
I think there is a universal longing in the mile hop to experiences just like push through and said hi. I don't know if this is helpful or not but I will share this with you as our are in a very clue when I was your age I try not to prescribe nitro empathized, and I would never say something like, well, look at your first girlfriend. He 15. Don't worry about it like public try to experiences have agreed that he was experiencing at this point in his life.
This is the biggest emotional event of his life. I need to respond and entering like it is and I think that just maybe was God's grace obey because I'm a super introspective person I was trying to get in touch with all spent a lot of time actually. But if this is a best practice. I didn't put in the book was like one of the recited out always ask myself when I was 14.
What was I experiencing I go back who was I'm dating anybody who might teaches what was I feeling what was attempted by what was I confused. Where was I insecure when I try Mike emotionally reentered and want to talk to my son. I think it had a tone of like humility and concern. Rob something like your confidence in projection and you know maybe that's one of things open the doors was like really trying to remember that emotionally not just intellectually, then enter Rin emotionally. The state I felt was a day earlier episode.
We talked about the five kinds of father's irresponsible father the ignorant father. The inconsistent father, the involved father. All the eyes and the intentional father is where we ended and like even you sharing that story.
If like you wanted to connect with your son's heart you want him to know you.
You guys want a relationship and that's that intentional father and you really gone to LeBlanc's. I love that you can only talk about it that you give us instructions of how you've done this with your son and it started. How did you decide like a Kate starting at 13.
Why then, if you study anthropology. You basically will is almost every society that's existed except Al's light mold society has had a conscious agreed-upon pathway formation for young men.
So this is going. James Hollis is a union psychologist is done look at Tice. Basically, a midlife specialist. He talks about the two adult codes and it's like it's been popularized to the thousand levels half time crisis falling upwards. He stood like the psychological from behind and he said the first adulthood is prepared at around age 13. Because that's what a boys base expressing puberty and then these electronic deal with these conflicting new energies.
This is all societies have a six step process to guide these energies into productive manhood.
Step number one was severing from a childhood environment, often by force, which means the kids were pulled out and had to realize you are entering into a liminal space childhood as I was like. Like the naïve kid has to die somehow so that was subconsciously removed, sometimes by four.
Secondly, there was like a death of childhood that in some societies like we do. Baptism yeah I would do like a death of childhood ceremony, sometimes putting them in confidence, then I would do a basically a series of formational frameworks around three areas number one the religion of the community. This is what it means to believe in our God is our people. Number two.
The history of the people. This is what it means to be one of us in the number three. He is the roles you have to be good at to contribute to the society that you were born into. That would go on for some time. Then I would enter into a thing called the ordeal and the ordeal was with. I was sent out on their own to figure out with all those things I've learned actually what did they possess them. So doubtfully strident aboriginals Michael East-West about this book and in his book becomes a crisis. Aboriginal young men was sent out into the outback for up to six months.
Everything in the outback is trying to kill you for some of you often. Every creature you see I get 13 later in teenage years have thoughts and fittings initiation, but liked was the end of it towards adulthood.
Do you have what it takes is questions being asked of them if they pass that they would be welcomed back blessed by and recognized by the community of men and ended be integrated back into society, to serve as a functional member of the tribe because they didn't pass it. They were dead so that this is an important point, which I mentioned there was actually a lot of pushback originally does a thing and there were among those was called a directional dinner. So in the cost of this book is beautiful Scotus severing dinner and this the amount of pushback I get is universal to set what are you talking about mother's report on like obviously the fact that they inflicted this wound shows their employment staff and such basically says you elect the primary role of formation just from the mother to the father for conscious period of time where you even said your wife cried yes. Is all this is awful.
Our members are clearly run into the room from the bed so I asked my son will went hiking across Spain. I don't think I started doing this with him to turn this into a thing I did this with him because I love my son I was like I could figure this out. I got so much feedback over the course of time. People like I should turn this into a thing so when I was doing. That aside, I want to check with you. Hey this going to be a lot about your life. My son gets the profits from this book not made some kind for schools of stock is open to value is so I said hey, this liked quite a lot of controversy around the severing dinner. You stopped walking across Spain. He stops because what you talking about that is like the paper feel like it was too barbaric and he said that was so helpful for me psychologically is like it was so helpful for me. I needed to know I was being pushed over into the community of men. He said I needed that. Like line in the sand. He's like you cannot take that as my son, you cannot take that out that young men were made this talk about what what was the walk across something we hereby later walking I came later severing. I mean it's it's basically they did research and NYU asking the question. When did helicopter parenting begin and what was the consequences of a helicopter parent is like get it is the overinvolved parent who just does everything for the kid writing a resume you you hit all of those things you name it. 1990 was the year began and within a decade, the rates of depression and anxiety increase by 80% in one all that's because kids no longer knew if they have what it took was like mom did everything for them now to talk about Buddha's appearance just like clear the wife offerings like that literally get rid of all the obstacles for the kids call the college professor if the means of the child sort of thing. There like 80% increase in anxiety, depression like that is like a such a social logical shift and I think it's because young people needed shots to test themselves and grow and express and I think this something that happens. So there's not some sort of luck Oedipus complex or whatever, where a young boy has to be severed from the influence of his mother and handed to his father that now that my wife and my son have an incredible relationship and they did the entire time, but she would say to him. Your father has to help you with this. He can give you things I cannot give you I have not been what you're going through. So I pushed back your father, and her goal was to like help cement that relationship connected to this, the whole idea was like the difference between a boy and a man is like a series of shifts that have to happen to see this change work and she knew that like she had a hop of comfort and so she would always like it's okay going to be okay, rather than you to suck it up man. Life is hard.
You have to push through this so she didn't want that to be a dominating influence. She wanted him to have to lean into the pain of the development. So yes, she took him out for dinner and said I'm heading you of your father, for a period of conscious malformation blessed him wrote a letter to him read it over and through tears gave him some gifts that I trust you. This is now a journey you could attack with your father will be here to support you but you and him are going to go to this Jenny manhood when you say to the single mom or maybe even a blended family whereas it's a different dad or stop a single mom.
My mom was a single mom. The best case scenario, I believe there is some sacred role that her biological father has to his children. That is like this is that it comes living in the world and culture that we dilute the minority of times now I think statistically actually down from one biological to family what is that mean what is, what it means you need to be intentional and not passive. The beauty of being a Christian is you have a church community that surrounds this book is written to be done in a cohort of them are talking about fatherhood directly, but the goal is like rely on the Christian community. If you're a mom in 1/2 decent church.
This can be dads with a passion for mentoring. It was said, let me step in the let me help you in a huge reason I'm committed to like Trenton normalize this only normalizes and every church in America. This is like this is how we raise our kids how we raise young men. So then she doesn't feel the pressure on her own. The ideal scenario is is like a council of dots is a tribe of mental is a community of men and again with the breakdown of the social fabric. Social capital is basically gone in America's hiding behind a screen's Christians have a distinct advantage because you have this web of relationships you can rely on a drawer and so said to me the ideal scenario is and I deftly relied on this new scenario is parent relationship student ministry involvement and alignment church vision of participation in summing on campus ministry connected to it. If you get those things lined up with mentors that come along that could supplement what you can't do. That's the key. So, till the months you not do what you can. Your son will be eternally grateful and then bring in people for those areas you feel like you know you need a specialist or whatever and Google web Council of dads, Buddha, tribe, and to me that's the beauty of the local church at settling into that which is exactly what my mom did. Yes he did and I didn't even know it. Some ways she went every coach I had behind my back and said hey you know David and I'm father would you be that man is a amazing what I say loving. I have no idea, and she was intentional. That way, intentional mother, and then seek.
He also was the mama said oh you want to guitar go mow some yarns and shelves and driveways. You get one of the no hovering. There is no helicopter was like he had become a man, and this is what men do so. I mean, honestly, was powerful and thinking of Dell at our church is a dad that has all of his kids are grown that he works with middle school bullying, and then he stays with them i.e. six boys all the way through high school grandma.
I love and he is on these jobs because he works for a motor company and yet he has the side jobs is like redoing homes and renovations and he always has one of those boys with hand teaching and that's economies and yeah Bill Butler shout out the bill because the he parented his own kids parties of dad to so many. And I think in some ways God called us as men.
I know me as a mentor now guys, do that.
Further, this is a transformational principle from then then often struggle with catharsis is always looking up feeling inferior. Looking around, feeling competitive. And unlike look down and raise up the cost of those people below you. You are the person that they want to. So when you deploy your energy down to such as fathers is not intuitive for us sometimes to bring our kids alongside of us as were doing life day in and day out, but as Damien Wilson been talking with John Tyson about being in intentional father. It helps us to see that doing life alongside of your kids are rather your kids doing life alongside you is probably one of the best ways to invest in them and be in tension with them and make sure they don't carry the same kind of wounds that we have from when we were kids.
John Tyson is written a book called the intentional father if you head over to family life today.com and make a donation of any amount we are going to send you a copy of his book as a thank you for being a part of aiding the ministry of family life today. Again, you can go to our website. Family life today.com request your copy there we can give us a call, make a donation at 1-800-358-6329 it's one 800 F as in family L as in life, and then the word today. Now what John Tyson is been talking about today's been encouraging for you helpful for you or your family. We love you share today's podcast family member or friend. Why are there.
It was a really great scroll down and rate and review it now tomorrow to be back again with John Tyson.
He's got me talking about what it means to be wise with your time and your energy with your kids about how significant it can be when work taking time for our children. That's coming up tomorrow. We hope you can join us again on behalf of David and Wilson. I'm shall be added back next time for another edition of family life today. Family life today is of family life accrue helping you pursue the relationships that matter most