What is a Cultural Christian?

You probably have friends or family members who go to church regularly. Who if you asked them would say. Of course I'm a Christian and yet you still wonder if they're saved Pastor Dean and Sarah says there's a reason for that to realize the God and the Jesus they heard about their entire lives is not the God and Jesus of the Bible. It's an American, vague imaginary friend kind of creation is a person that may be one enough of Jesus company" mere with Jesus enough of Jesus to be associated with, but not enough to be inconvenienced and when actually hear someone talk about what is the gospel.

They never forget for this is family life today. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson and Bob Lapine, Dean and Sarah says we live in a country that is full of what he calls unsaved Christians talk more about what that means today. Stay with us and welcome to family like today. Thanks for joining us so pastor Dave and I should I just reminder ministers here you go you pastor a church in Detroit driving. Yes, it is been doing you never call me pastor downtown success right now so I don't know where this might be going.

I want to know from Pastor Dave. If you think you have any unsaved Christians at your church. We just had this conversation this morning, Julie.

Oh yes I would say definitely. I'm guessing every church that is there some extent but yeah that's right.

Of course our listeners don't really talk about unsaved Christian was our church had a better preacher. They probably would have Christians but we deftly do what we are borrowing that phrase from Dean and Sarah, who wrote a book called the unsaved Christian talk more about that today.

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Place a sports team, other people and if you asked them if they are Christian, they would say yes. And the reason for being so actually has nothing to do with Jesus. It is because they are atheists that are Muslim or Jewish. They're not agnostics is, therefore, they are Christians. In fact they were going to fill out a survey that indicated Ashley indicate your religion of a wood they didn't in a moment they would check crystalline thinking twice about it has given out atheist and arduous, not Muslim, so that means are Christians if he asked them what makes you a Christian. The reasons they would give you for that.

They believe in God that they are good people and that be about it. Notice and that answer they said nothing about Jesus, but in the Scriptures. There's no such thing as a saving faith apart from faith in Jesus Christ and his gospel is as I called him unsaved Christians slow and and there were more of them 10 years ago than they are today because more and more people are saying I'm I'm not gonna be a hypocrite about this, none so no religious affiliation, but we still have a wide swath of people and not even take it.

Do not take it one step beyond what you describe, because I think probably for three or four years I was in unsaved Christian. This is a little bit of my story when I was in high school I grew up on to a mainline church. The faithful, not because of God but because of the choir and because that's what good kids did. So I went and sang in the choir room but was a good kid coming good and in terms of how how I was viewed in the community.

I started going to young life when I was in high school. That's where I first heard the gospel and I was attracted to what I was here and I was attracted to Jesus. I was attracted the people I was hanging out with. We were having fun. We were singing cool songs. The girls were cute. I mean it was it was a great environment to be in and I think somewhere along the line I thought to myself, yeah, I think.

I believe this, I think there's a God and and this is the tribe. I want to be affiliated with the college and a guy I knew from high school came up and today you were young life in high school I said yeah he said we've got a group here the weary leaders like we going to high schools and we lead clubs young life clubs for high school students. I thought that the fund to be a leader right so he says, come to the group.

So I went to the group and for three years I was a young life leader going in the high schools and I was doing the talks I was talking to people. Given the messages about Jesus. I was pointing people to their need for Christ. If you did come to me during that time I just said yeah I'm late.

I'm young your course of a Christian look when ideally I remember one night I went to a Mary and I had started dating and she wanted to go to see James Robison who is to a crusade in our city. At the end. That night he was given the invitation and I thought this is a guide is given an invitation to make say people really doubt whether there really saved. It was lovely strong.

You need to come forward and after the first way became back with the second wave and then 1/3 wave you need to come forward.

I remember sitting there thinking I'm not going forward. But God were good right I mean I need to pray this again. Do I really ever pray it but were good right and that was kind where I left and then we were at another eventful segment something that you need to write down the date that you prayed this prayer and… I think I played this before but and I did write a date down so I'll write a date down all the stuff so fast forward to a Bible study that I'm in.

This is the summer after my junior year in college and were going to this Bible study, and a guy comes up to me that the old Bible study says get together with you this week at some questions I'd like to ask you and my thought was I wonder what he needs me to explain to him that that should've been at the little tipoff that pride is still a huge issue in my life right but that wasn't the questions he had were not questions about my interpretation of Scripture. We sat down. He said I don't think you get it on the mean and this is interesting because his ties to what you write about your booking heat. He opened Romans three and he*Teresa Hunter read starting their verse nine there is none righteous, no not one. Nobody seeks after God.

It's this whole description of depravity.

They said that's about you. I would like what what are you saying he said no it's about me too, but it's about you Lisa and I don't think you understand sin the way the Bible describes sin well. From this perspective dead on who I'd seen sin is a few bad habits. I had mostly good guy with a few bad habits of Jesus had to die for those habits. I don't see how a lot works but that's God for that, you know, so I'm a mostly good guy with the few bad habits that I guess Jesus had to do something for but I'm kind of I'm I'm on the team because I decided to be on the team and and maybe I can bring some value to this whole Christian thing that's going on with this guy and one afternoon sits down and lays up an understanding of sin and then says and and and God is the one who intervenes God's alone. This is, I walked out of that place and I was weak in the knees and asked had you respond in that moment I was just kind of dumbfounded and didn't know what to do, but I walked out my thought okay God is what he said for real. I was going to go to the body.

He was hearing things about the sovereignty of God about the doctrine of election I'm going hunting know about all of this fact. I was going go to the Bible and start to starting Genesis and show no it's all about free will.

I know what you did and over time such surgery in the Bible. The Holy Spirit work on my heart. That's where look back go three years after meeting on life leader.

I think God finally saved me. You've heard stories like that right and left right basis to my story. Nadine laser story.

I was raised mainline Protestant said on some remnant great name I Protestant churches after their surly archer. But sadly, there are many who have gone the way of light is called gospel less preaching. I was a nice church with nice people and a great family atmosphere and if Leslie were sick or out of town. We're there every Sunday and again. If you asked if I was a Christian. I'm told you yes of course I've been offended if you suggested otherwise we pray before dinner guy I knew a few Bible stories sacrificing the 10 Commandments are large square you can reset. I will definitely recite the Lord's prayer in the doxology bike even to some, the apostles Greeks regretted every single week, but it read anyone actually tell me that I was a sinner who needed to be saved that only Jesus actually was the one who could provide that I'd I believe in Jesus I please. Born in a manger in Bethlehem was a good teacher. I believe he died on the cross and I knew that as a historical events. The significance of that for me and for others it is just a name very much so I went to a falsification athlete for treatment was 13 years old. Any mention of pretty girls and young life when I smell settlers because of the pretty girls invited me to go and I was in athletes and also course a Christian because again on Monday for estimate Jewish different Christian and I went to this retreat and the pastor of the retreat during the assembly time gave a classic gospel presentation and he read from Matthew chapter 7 verses 21 through 23, which really is the base Scripture for the entire book where Jesus says on that day, the day of judgment. Many will say to me Lord, Lord, did not prophesy in your name perform miracles in your name cast out demons in your name and I will tell them away from you evildoers. I never knew you see read that Texans that some of you are the people you talk about this passage and he gave me to come forward invitation and I went forward. I never see what is my entire life and I joke the only person ever come to faith in Christ and be angry about it, had joy but I seriously was thinking how it been in church my entire life and no one has ever told me this before and I had it when the coaches kneel down with me and and tell me what it meant to trust in Jesus repent of my sins have faith in his gospel and in the about that tech subsume importance is a logical one. Just take the I never knew you parked in Matthew chapter 7 and then preach a sermon on house about a relationship with Jesus, not a religion. Is that true, of course, it's true, but that's not the main primary purpose that part of the text what's happening that text is here are people appealing to themselves and to their actions for their righteousness and their pull into their own good deeds for why they should be in heaven and be with God and he did not atheists. These are religious leaders he's talking about. Again, they've perform miracles in his name, cast out demons in his name.

So Jesus is saying is your appeal must be to me not to yourselves, and that's a cultural Christian's Mrs. Holbrook about cultural Christianity will cultural Christians Mrs. they admire Jesus and why could Jesus have a vague belief in God, but they appealed themselves in their own goodness not actually to the work of Christ on their behalf. Yeah. And when you are coming out of seminary. You start the book with that conversation with your buddy Matt who really says tell a story about how year, you end up in an area where you can see a lot of this. Why would I call mistral insecurity Michelin security is like a spring break when all your friends are going with an orphanage in a formal country you're going to the beach so I feel bad about it of my buddy who my seminary next door neighbor was going to Northern California to be part of a church planting movements family across the country. I really admire that some other sexualized areas of the need for churches here.

I'm going back to my hometown of Tallahassee, Florida that is about 15 miles in the Georgia line in less than an hour from Alabama's against. Basically, I'm going to be for spring break is going to orphanage and verbal country.

That's how I felt. So I thought.

Also, someone out to come easy road and Odyssey known insecurity about certain things you try to say some spiritual sound better. As for the parking lot on this, same the Lord be with you and Godspeed. I know God speed me and and and he disguised that associate my we are doing what you're doing to cut me off you go. Stop it is like what he said were you're going is probably more difficult or I'm going to sit what in the world are you talking about one debate, which places were difficult because the enemies everywhere is everywhere difficult, but his reason was he said were outgoing and Northern California news with his words. There's no confusion over who is a Christian who is not. Either you are believing the gospel in following Jesus or you're not where you're going. Everyone thinks they're fine but there's so much confusion is no clear starting point for gospel conversation rumble in California.

The starting point is unbelief or disinterest where you're going yet to find a starting point. So soft at Xmas on us to get lost them to get saved. At that moment I was had this tabbouleh was come a moment in the parking lot off you have remained as my life at this moment where I said wow but there's a ministry to be done in the Bible Belt and cultural Christianity, but since then I realize extends everywhere because again most of your neighbors also have the exception of maybe a few small regions of the country. Most of your neighbors and coworkers are not atheists. They would claim to believe in God is the God of the Bible is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Probably not usually very vague and generic God we worship a God who's made himself know what he's revealed himself to us in the Scriptures is not that he's not generic.

He is told us who he is and we to make sure that we help people understand that. So I'm passionate about the sky ministry is often easier for us to have evangelistic conversations gospel conversations with people who, as you set a clear cut, the Northern California people who who would say I'm not a Christian and they're open to having a conversation but the lines are clear. You sit down with somebody to have a gospel conversation and the regular churchgoers. It's like they've tuned you out because they figure they already know what you're talking about the other difference, though, that cultural Christians see between themselves and so on.

The actors following Jesus is a distinct you're more into it but in a figure different than them, but they just think maybe you're just really religious. They might say that I go there just you know those socially religion there's really into their religion and that makes it really complicated little see an actual distinction say look at me saying that that were the example of what it means to be a Christian and also rub the judge of his a Christian who does not will make that clear is not our job.

But the Bible is the Bible makes clear what is a Christian.

What is not what saving faith looks like and I think most important things about understanding cultural Christianity. And I call unsafe Christians is a mistake was made is that we see it as a discipleship issue with is to get more serious about following Jesus into Skype repent of their sins… Let's go man with the flock and with get serious about this will be casual. Don't be lukewarm and I argue that's actually a false understanding this not a discipleship issue is an evangelism issue.

I believe cultural Christianity is a different religion altogether and what makes a complicated as is no category for when you check that box asked indicate your religion is in sight.

Cultural Christian.

It says nothing. Atheists, Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist, Christian together. None of those other things may have a generic belief in God went to church with Nana when they were five so you check Christian Bible Belt financing everywhere thing fact if there was that box the imagine unsafe Christian or cultural Christian, they would be offended definitely to be like there's no way that even remotely describes me so help help me. If I'm sitting down somebody talking to them how how can I identify will that there is a Christian is offensive, so I suggest that you might not be a Christian when he is going to be when your entire life again. I will be a broken record, but we can.

We don't believe that we are the judges on who is and is not the Scriptures are so I think it's really important to do is to ask good questions and I got to back up against the wall questions you want to do that either. What lovely people of peace, right of a piece is not the opposite of confrontation with me.

I'm the opposite of difficult conversations.

So what I try do is ask this a sign of oversimplifying it but the gateway in as simple as the rest of the can be complicated, so I'll just say hey I noticed that on your Facebook wall or you know on your social media account. Sometimes you'll you'll post things that sound you pretty religious can use when there were zero religious and we talk about football. We talk about politics in that we talk about working our kids. I realize I would never actually like how to talk about our faith. Tell me about… I assume basically say what you posted on the ice in the air Christian. Yeah, I will hereby buy what you say and together, not actually saying like really Christian things that might lose their orthodoxy will align with what is very vague, almost new age but has that faith elements up like were praying for you. Things like that sounds brave enough like God bless America, guys know that things like that when God you know to close the door opens a window as those type of things Casey God's definition of what America France are traveling mercies you think things like that so that also, so what. I realize we've never talked about that all you apologize comes like with everything else with her talk about faith before like sorry about that before Monday. It seems like it's important you basically post so talk about your story frozen to tell me how to get much time to catch up on time and want to know is of the asset cultural Christian about Jesus about their faith. You say things like, I will so important to me by mom spiritual person, they're not gonna talk about Christ that are truly not just those questions will be shot by the answers you're given actually do start talking is given some like some sort of new age confusion of like Oprah meets sort of Jesus meets. It really is and then minute that he gets his big open door for conversation and another thing that I've learned that's critical is those, conversations for someone to understand Christianity is the author need to understand what is not is very trendy to say to say let's not be know if what were against.

Let me know what were for. And I'm like no it's both versus people from both things Saul told me this is what it's not. This is not what Christianity is, in terms of being a good person I been to church before in one of the gateways to see in their eyes open is actually invite them to gospel preaching churches is not hostile towards churches had been in a long time there in different so you invite them to church is actually going to preach the gospel will talk about denominationally what talk about a certain theological tribe. I mean there is clear on who Jesus is and what is done in our need for him. You'll see their eyes open ago what's going on here, but I've never heard anything like this before. They really have any little the same exact time as you and church before vacation Bible schools kids.

They've only seen Christianity presented as God kind of as a moral therapist in the sky that has no accountability, no real effect. It does if there's your life, unless things go really poorly and you need to join Carrie Underwood. Next is to take the wheel or something like that only come a time that he matters with realize a God in the Jesus they heard about their entire lives is not the God and Jesus of the Bible. It's an American, vague imaginary friend kind of creation. So actually go to church with a hearing on three guys introducing us over and over again were the atheist locking the door in that we hope they come in the sometimes they do come as a person that maybe one enough of Jesus company air quotes in the air with Jesus enough of Jesus to be associated with, but not enough to be inconvenienced and when actually hear someone talk about what is the gospel.

They've never heard it before, but this is my story a little bit too although I think about going to church maybe it has that decreased her ankle at Christmas sometimes and he said that maybe once a year to my sister and I got a Bible and we started reading have never read the Bible had never heard the Bible even when I was in church Weaver reading the Gospels and I said to her, getting how do we get to having how do we know Jesus. So we need a pack with one another. Who ever found out first but tell the other says she was older sent him back home that is possible and she was bulimic she was anorexic.

We both had sexual abuse in our past, and so she came home. This one time after living out of state and she looked great and I thought something different about her and she said I found the answer for assess how to get to heaven, and she shared the entire gospel of sin of repentance of what the cross meant the blood of Jesus and I had surrendered my life to Jesus that I was not the same as eating. I had never heard the gospel in church and it's interesting so I started going to church to preach the gospel that I heard the gospel that I understood it, and then went to college get involved in a church there and also with courier keeps Crusade for Christ that Dave and I got married back in our hometown and so we had a conversation with this pastor before we got married there.

Forget we sit down in going to the premarital part and he just Sarah says we can do with your life and were like were going on staff or crew were going to share the gospel. Clearly Alexander, your word evangelist and we will lead people to the saving knowledge of Jesus Christ and never forget that he's probably 60 probably also we simply were talking about the word of God in Scripture and how it comes alive and how it's changed our lives.

They were 2219 on fire couldn't be more excited. Change world with the gospel and he looks at us and goes yeah you will believe that in a few years and then we said what is yeah give it give yourself 510 years, feel, believe half the stuff in the Bible you will believe a believer now and they all got your grow up in realize most etc. pastor this check you back to that Scriptures and he said he can't, he can't literately Dave and I was on fire here got married and he did various and wondered if it That's really is again want to be sensitive.

There are some remnants out there that is mainline cushioning today and it fuels cultural Christianity is a cliché that means nothing demands, nothing requires nothing really is dependent on Jesus route even argue that for a lot of mainline churches the cross and resurrection could have never happened and wouldn't change their faith. So, as augmented on that. I'm wondering if were talking to people who are gone from a cultural Christian if you're talking to somebody who is wondering if there cultural Christian how you have that conversation.

What would you say the person most would first estimate the belief what he really believed that Jesus like Izzy think that's rest to go first and only this deep theological conversation you noticed the question of who is Jesus actually is a deep theological conversation with a realize it or not. I know seven-year-old 72 to conversation with me, but he was Jesus word. Believe is an intellectual desk. I believe knowing intellectually that he said he was Jesus. He said he was God or is it a belief that spurs you on to movement sure in that first movement is that I need him right that I needed for my salvation onto my body, but for my salvation.

I was today a campus minister one time in the gospel presentation was a Jesus wants to be your friend, quote their death implications at least have use as a friend for sure but that is nowhere near even remotely kind of a gospel presentation right. Actually, the Bible says we were God's enemies before his likeness like a Roman sacraments. Five. We were enemies that we are reconciled while buddies and gets a small view of God.

Remember cultural Christian's a really small view of God's of the conversation. All of them understand that sin is not a random mistake was on. So God is my heart.

I'm sincere, or none of us are perfect, all things we like to say I think was the loss of our country and generally with some evangelicals is that our sin first and foremost is against God, but our sin is against God, like the holy God, the creator of the universe. And if that is true then then I need to ask what are the consequences of that God is any god at all. He must not let sin go unpunished. So what does that mean for you and I like to say that are the things we do what we talk about being a good person. How do more good deeds and bad deeds that really those kind of things have no basis for that belief that something to realize is that many cultural Christians, the things a blade is no basis for it, but we actually have a basis in us the word of God. But these people claim to be okay with the Bible not opposed to necessarily so caves the faith that you claim to have, is it consistent with the Bible says is a saving faith. Someone with a belief in what and what that what I believe actually leads to social somebody report that says that there could be that way. They're bad.

That's like going to Chick-fil-A and you know, getting four count nugget and extra large fry and faking it all cancels out to get a Diet Coke and that's exactly what I did cancel a slightly believe you like our good deeds gift letter that is likely know God can't let those doing a good deed by Americans. And if you've done God can't let our arson go unpunished. You and I love what you said earlier, if somebody asked you the question tell me about your faith story or Christianity in the first place you go is to you. There's your tipoff that you probably don't have the faith story that the Bible is talking about. If the first place, you instinctively go is to what you're doing what you believe what it's all about rather than to Jesus and what he did accomplish for you. You need to reconsider. In fact, I'd encourage listeners go to our website.

There's a link on our website do something that's called two ways to live that sets out the difference between someone who's actually walking with Jesus and somebody who's not walking with Jesus. Click on that and look at that and ask yourself the question which one looks like me which one is me and then get a copy of Dean and Sarah's book the unsaved Christian and read through these descriptions that deem that you got in your book that help us separate biblical Christianity from cultural Christianity. We get copies of the book the unsaved Christian available for you online in family life to.com or you can call one 800 FL today to get a copy.

Again, the website is family life to a.com. The book is called the unsaved Christian reaching cultural Christianity with the gospel. You can order online@familylifetoa.com or call 1-800-358-6329 order.

That's one 800 F as in family L as in life, and then the word today. Now, as we mentioned back at the beginning of today's program. We've got just a few days left in 2020 when that means a few days left for us to try to take advantage of the matching gift opportunity that has been made available to us here this year.

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Not tomorrow to talk more about some of the different ways that cultural Christianity is being lived out in our world. Dean and Sarah will be back with us again tomorrow can be here as well.

I don't think our engineer today. Keith Lynch along with our entire broadcast production team on behalf of our hosts Dave M.

Wilson and Bob Lapine see you back next time for another edition of family life today. Family life to a is a production of family life of Little Rock, Arkansas. A crew ministry help for today hope for tomorrow