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Learn more@edwardjones.com morning. I'm Jane Pauley and this is Sunday morning, the first Sunday morning of fall. The change of season reminds us that were approaching the sixth anniversary this December on the Sandy Hook elementary school shooting the emotional wounds of that massacre are far from healed and made all the worse by a bizarre and ongoing battle between fact and fiction Tony to copal reports.

Our cover story should use Asian ascetics completely fake with doctors in my view manufacture for years, Alex Jones, America's premier peddler of conspiracy theories has suggested that the shooting at Sandy Hook elementary never actually happened. The official story of Sandy Hook has more holes in it. That's what she can take a big chunk out of your faith in humanity. If you let it head on Sunday morning how some families of the victims are fighting back Murphy's back working brown that is a TV knew us both from the past reported for our times is like how it will show us you show that found itself in the center of the culture wars nine prime time TV has Murphy Brown mocking the importance of father's 20 years later, the shows called Murphy in the morning, they're not firing Brown again ready to do it all over again is Matt Lauer, Charlie Rose and Bill O'Reilly ring any bells to get back up. I couldn't wait for you in the morning on Sunday morning only what the Tyson looks behind the headlines in the Brett Cavanaugh Supreme Court confirmation flight reader braver talks with legendary Hollywood super agent Michael Ovitz and more coming up when our Sunday morning podcast continues. I am temperament considered access. Right now you can download subscribing your program. The first podcast Mexico's we talk about the collision of politics, business and technology things like election hacking for the battle over three printed guns for the Washington DC blowback against big tech platforms like Facebook and listen and subscribe to ask you is pro rata. Now three podcast radio.com for ever you get your show to get smarter, faster. We begin this morning with the battle of fact versus fiction battle pitting parents morning the shooting deaths of their children at Sandy Hook elementary school against purveyors of the most mean-spirited and outlandish of mats. Our cover story is from Tony to copal a bit of a cold that morning he woke up with sniffles. What was he looking forward to that month woke very special event for Jesse.

It was December 2012 when a 20-year-old man walked in the Sandy Hook elementary school in Newtown, Connecticut.

An open fire were just little babies. There were no morning baby, I had no self defense or knew what self defense was Neil Heslin, son Jesse and David Wheeler son Benny were both just six years old. Those are the facts of the story and every day since the people of Newtown, especially all 26 families who lost a child or loved one have slowly tried to move forward but Neil Heslin and David Wheeler are part of a small band of Sandy Hook.

Families feel they have no choice but to look back to stare down and outlandish myth, and the people who spread it.

Sandy use a synthetic completely fake with doctors in my view manufacture for years, the online provocateur Alex Jones and others like him have argued that the shootings at Sandy Hook elementary never actually happened. The official story of Sandy Hook has more holes in it. That's what she's that they were stage with paid actors, including Neil Heslin and David Wheeler themselves, along with dozens of others, residents, law enforcement, even journalists all actors took me about a year will Sandy Hook to come to grips with the fact of the whole thing. And as for the children die well fiction, argues they never leave in the first place. For me personally it has in my more vulnerable moments felt like a complete denial of my life and my more vulnerable moments.

It has felt like salt and it can take a big chunk out of your face in humanity. If you let it. Which is why earlier this year. Both fathers along with other Sandy Hook families filed suit against Alex Jones may feel is mainly responsible for spreading these bogus stories morning famously said 30 years ago many times repeatedly on your entitled to their own opinions but not your own facts was kind of joking back then and we come to this place where many many many millions of people feel absolutely entitled to their own facts. Kurt Anderson is the author of a history of delusional thinking in America when you create a story like Sandy Hook. He says all sorts of wild ideas took hold after the freewheeling 60s. You know, I can think what I want to know what you say is true is my truth and then exploded with the rise of the Internet is a good reason to question those hundreds and thousands and then tens of thousands and hundreds of thousand more people set up websites put out legitimate looking arguments for these things. But Anderson says the Sandy Hook deniers as they're called, are a special breed motivated things by fears that a mass shooting of young children might spur stricter gun laws.

If you had to point to a single reason why Sandy hope in particular has become a focus of conspiracy theorist. What's the reason is because if 26 people had been killed by a guy running them down with a car it wouldn't taken off the way this one did David Wheeler suspects Anderson may be right. I don't remember exactly when this particular piece of mail came but it was a simple envelope with the piece of ruled notebook paper and it only had almonds piece of paper was to transcribe the text of the Second Amendment. That's all they did still at first both fathers say they tried to laugh off the fake claims even one suggesting Wheeler had not one but two roles in the massacre playing both the grieving father and an FBI agent. Have you seen the picture of you split screen with the congratulations you found two middle-aged jolly white Fairfield County, Connecticut remarkable. Drop them off at school. Then last year Neil Heslin went on television to directly address the Sandy Hook deniers.

I wash my son I buried my son. I held my son with a bullet hole through his head that is not possible. After which the harassment only got worse. We look at all sides but I mean it's as phony as a three dollar bill to hear Hassan tell it. That's because Alex Jones is falsehoods shared with an audience in the millions got even more personal. And that became dangerous. I've had many death threats, and a people today would you should be the ones with bullet hole in your head. Jesse's mom actually picked at Heslin says the lawsuit emphasizes his interest in ringing in what's now become despair, made worse by the deniers labeling him a liar son of fake. Do you regret giving the interview that led to the most recent round of denials you regret saying you held your son with a pothole and disapproved and are part of my story partner Jesse's legacy of his story, his Shakespearean David Wheeler says his lawsuit was prompted by his belief that Alex Jones is profiting from the lies and fabrications. I thought this can I have to do so we have to do something as a society collectively we have to do something. What about people like and there's always another well if if there is another like him and try to do the same thing using the same tactics that have to go away to we need to make sure that everyone understands that this is not there are limits. This is a very tough case for Alex Jones because the claims he has been making are so particularly because what he has said is so appalling. Floyd Abrams is a respected First Amendment lawyer famed for defending publication of the Pentagon papers during the Vietnam era. Abrams says Alex Jones may have gone well beyond the protections of free speech and he thinks the consequences could be severe. This is the sort of case in which a jury could say we have to award vast amounts of money to punish him and to tell other people that saying such things is simply unacceptable. Do you think the outcome of these cases could put Alex Jones and info wars at a business. Whatever money they have and whatever the level of insurance they this is deeply threatening case to persisting in their business. We asked Alex Jones's legal team to comment on the story we got no response. Children.but since these lawsuits were filed. Jones seems to have changed his views on saying you should examine.

Still, his rhetoric has gotten him kicked off every major social media platform, Apple has stopped offering his show, and most recently PayPal, which handles transactions for Jones's online store has said no more.

As for the Sandy Hook families there still trying to heal to go forward. Guided by the memory of those they lost and something else says David Wheeler, the lasting lesson in all of this is that we are really only here for one reason we are here to take care of each other and that is the legacy of before there were podcasts there was television. Remember see what's new under the sun every Sunday morning now page from our Sunday morning September 23, 1869, 149 years ago today David saw the birth in Ireland Mary Mallon remembered today as typhoid Mary made it to New York in the 1880s, where she built a career as a cook to the wealthy. In 1906, a family should cook for on Long Island's posh Gold Coast contracted typhoid fever and disease more commonly found in crowded slums and investigation determined that Mallon was the carrier of the disease able to pass it on to others by handling while exhibiting no symptoms herself sensationally labeled by the press as typhoid Mary Mallon was quarantined, released and quarantined again living out her days at an island hospital where she died in 1938 the age of 69 gone for 80 years. Typhoid Mary is hardly forgotten her reputation as a pariah forever invoked in our popular culture as in this exchange on The Big Bang Theory typhoid Mary said clearly her friends buckled public health experts still debate the affects of how their profession treated Mary Mallon, but there's no doubting the long shadow. She continues to cast typhoid Mary told you Christine blasé Ford has agreed to testify this week about her allegation of assault by Supreme Court nominee Brett Cavanaugh, Tyson, or takes us behind the headlines were and focus right now, doing everything that we can make Dr. for comfortable for Senate Judiciary committee chairman Republican Charles Grassley this past week is been all about optics stage manage Brett Cavanaugh's confirmation vote passed before November's midterm elections, but at the same time to look like the embodiment of sensitivity toward Christine blasé Ford collect Grassley's I know the entire Judiciary committees problem people are asking how we could have let your statement slip past us.

How could we have had the committee vote without airing this matter.

Grassley is one of three senators still on the committee who were there in 1991 the spectacle of 14 white men confronting law professor Anita Hill over allegations of sexual harassment against then Supreme Court nominee now justice Clarence Thomas Prof. Hill, you said that you took it to mean that Judge Thomas wanted to have sex with you but in fact he never did ask you to have sex correct Nelly did not ask me to have sex. He did continually pressure me to go out with him continually millions of women voters with long memories were offended US-born woman had no idea how to handle this and I have to say I don't think they took it very seriously. Nina Totenberg legal affairs correspondent for NPR broke the Anita Hill story and discovering the replay.

This is an election year. After all, neither the Republicans nor the Democrats want to look insensitive, but it is a very political proceeding.

A great deal of what we see on camera will be and has been role-playing in the New York Times last week. Hill wrote that the Senate Judiciary Committee appears to have learned little from the Thomas hearing, much less the more recent me to movement. So in this week's hearing be fair to either blasé Ford or Judge Cavanaugh confirmation hearings. I never fail. It's the nature of the beast. It's raw politics like this White House afraid.

Afraid we don't want this to be a three ring circus.

The men in this country shopping step do the right thing. You watch the fight you watch the topics, but here's what I want in the very near Judge Cavanaugh will be on the Supreme Court political body, but it hasn't always been a weapon in the wars of polarization and that's what were saying John Meacham is a Pulitzer prize-winning biographer, and author of the syllable of America essential thing to remember here is that ever since 1962, which was the school prayer decision, the Supreme Court has been at the center of the conservative agenda for power. This was clearly advanced as well by Roe versus Wade.

You didn't have these kind of confirmation battles you have them now because every seat is seen as a chess piece in the struggle for power. Republicans remember the defeat of Reagan nominee Robert Bork in 1987 campaign so ugly that work became a verb meaning to kill someone politically, it is a precious constitutional right to nominate a Supreme Court justice as the sentence crosses all right check on the president and withhold its consent. Democrats were Sen. Mitch McConnell refused for nearly 10 months to hold hearings on nominee Marek Garland running out the clock on the Obama presidency. Ideally, the Senate should be an umpire in American life. The constitutional structure was set up so that they would be the saucer in which the milk cool right now. The Senate isn't doing that. So where does that leave this week's he said she said and the vote on Judge Cavanaugh's nomination that will surely follow all these interests with an investment in the outcome are more interested in pressing ahead to Russia. Vote then they are in finding out the truth and I think that that's one of the reasons a moment like this is going to create even more division in a country that a lot of us thought couldn't be much more divided. Coming soon mode obituaries a podcast on matters of death and life from Mo Rocca for many years the biggest and often most feared power player in Hollywood is Michael Ovitz change the way the business of show business is done. He has many a story to tell and he's telling them to read and braver.

I had a goal from day one, which was to win and I wanted us to win at all costs 71-year-old leader of creative artists agency known as CAA. He was once the most powerful talent agent in Hollywood sample of the roster when you were running: one Robert Redford Dustin Hoffman Bob De Niro, Barbra Streisand, Meryl Streep, we handle directors like Steven Spielberg and Ron Howard Stanley Kubrick Marty Scorsese Sean Connery was a career some sworn off the role of James Bond, never say never again drive this is prouder of coaxing Connery into playing police officer Jimmy Malone 19 untouchables people and what used to be the old plan without a toupee is an older, more eminence grades type of character than he was. Needless to say, Burlington, Connery one Oscar is its details in his new memoir.

He was raised in the San Fernando Valley, the son of a liquor salesman 68. He graduated from UCLA married his college sweetheart and apply for a job at William Morris commented Hollywood talent agency said your higher Ovitz started in the mailroom and soon got his first promotion I got to be the assistant to the president was put in a position that gave me an amazing overview of the company. 75 Ovitz decamped with a few other agents have found their own firm CAA. They were broke, but wanted to make a splash and you actually at one time took out a loan and bought five Jaguars five principal partners perception Hollywood in those days was 99% of the law and people notice that we are drunk drivers of what those guys must be doing really good soon became the leader of CAA also developing a reputation as a tough guy riding hard bargains and coaching cranes like name directors to collect directly from other agents you have almost a military How you push details forward and also how you were willing to destroy but I think that maybe a bit of an overstatement. I think we are willing to destroy anything and everybody. I do think that we were willing to take on a lot of casualties and we did leave a lot of bodies and are puff.

It was Ovitz who spearheaded David Letterman's move from NBC to CBS.

Michael Ovitz please come and it's wonderful. The story told in HBO's film the late treat Williams events. Frankly, we have worked out a career plan for David and it includes securing everything for Dave.

He wants everything.

Ovitz and his partners that CAA would also revolutionize the movie industry.

I frequently demanding that studios use their clients, writers, directors, actors deal in a particular film Rainman in 19 Barry Levinson directed Dustin and stars as not just man going to have to get out was discovered in an asylum by younger brother played my crash at one time or another that doesn't mean I'm not safe Qantas people industry thought that was a bad idea was one of the many articles were written about us.

We were stupid that Tom Cruise couldn't be Dustin Hoffman's brother would never work. Rainman Academy Dir. Dr. I think my agent Michael would have my hand down. Now think that after 20 years.

Michael Ovitz is cutthroat way executives riding roughshod over his partners had taken him as he writes from being the most powerful man in Hollywood to the most feared most hated 1995. He decided to quit being an agent and become number two at Disney, Michael Eisner, a close friend who also had a ruthless reputation.

It didn't work from day one I tried, but failed. It was one of the biggest failures of my life. Ovitz then started a new business to manage talent and develop digital content, but went back to failed you made headlines because you told Pharaoh whether you'd been done in by Hollywood's game.

Now all still a debate today whether I said but I'll do it. I guess I said it. I think that I filled Norma's pressure coming from the lot of people in the business was a giant mistake and something that never should've been said. As you get older you live and learn. Today Ovitz has an advising Selleck and Valley companies and new life. He and his wife and gone their separate ways now lives with Tamara Mellon cofounded Jimmy Choo shoes today when Michael Ovitz looks back is with both pride and regret.

I felt we were very kind to the people that were on our team that on our side. I feel we work time. The people that were on the other side of the line that we drew our anyway. Yes, we push them out of what and we did it we did it with a lot of skill. It's Sunday morning on CBS and here again is Jane Hawley, Candace Bergen on the late Robert Pascarella in the very first episode of Murphy Brown from 1988 now 30 years later Murphy's back I new version of the hit comedy premieres Thursday night here on CBS.

Lee Callan takes a look back and look forward 30 million people tuned in to see me every week took her final bow. Sorry Jim this many journalists wished he could be really like you to do the interview, but if not, the big J good long run tendencies cast and crew working there fake newsroom. Slowly, very real, and finally ended in 1998.

Most go over most DVD box set or reruns on tape election night 2016 will all see exactly go her way was just grief. Frankly, for Murphy's back hosting fee just called season is approaching so get your shots black winter coats and Bader Ginsburg stay away from drafts please this some level clear activism well. Yes, we haven't really articulated that we consider ourselves the resistance, but I think that's a subtext certainly created writers, so if Hillary had one because probably I don't think so. I don't think so. We didn't feel like we should go back and revisit unless there was a real reason to do it as well, got us pretty close.

You now, but when you look at what's going on on the front page of the newspaper every day. That's what put us over the top.

It really wouldn't work. Of course the rest of Murphy's gang same.

What a perfect time for Murphy Brown, a reporter, and Frank and Corky reporters to come back and start covering some of the madness hours jewelry to Bhutto. Faith Ford and Crenshaw two years on the view was of a strange thing to come to re-inhabit a character really within 20 years I was like sort of concerned about that because my character was based on being young and in over his head and I thought you know if I'm sort of freaking out at my age now is that to be awkward now just a rot and it works fine.

The two babies being old Washington looks just like the original really miss Phil. He always gave the best advice difference. Now that was you want to talk was part of this job is George downtown and to be re-created to solve this the first time. What was that like what tears came to my eyes because it's almost tickled to the set that we had when we started 30 years ago I walked in with faith. Candace was already crying on the set I was just I wasn't expecting at home again.

You don't go home again, but we came home again home again in such different fissures in the 90s showed up with everything from alcoholism to cancer and I like my best line in English Murphy Brown will be even more topical journalists are the only real firewall between power-hungry politicians and the people they were elected to serve someone once Yahoo storylines already ration sexual-harassment hello shows called Murphy in the morning, they're not firing Matt Lauer Charlie Rosen Bill O'Reilly ring any bells were expecting certain amount of backlash.

But we used to get it in the old days to back in 1992.

Murphy became a single mom, which brought this famous rebuke babies and responsibly is simply wrong. From then VP Dan Quayle prime time TV has Murphy Brown mocking the importance of fathers by bearing a child alone and calling just another lifestyle choice new cast members remember that backlash from America's heartland, including place Murphy's son now grown actually hadn't seen any of the original series. Now I never knew about it but I haven't seen any evidence document look older until after the first episode was really smart move because it's intimidating a good what may be most intimidating.

However, is the idea of the current White House reacting and terrified him to focus character plays an immigrant constant fear of being known as the tweet greater social media.

However better off not know what the White House might say why do you message to America's delete days to go before the premier you might expect nerves to be little line because the expectations are so high maybe and possibly had to bring the last three episodes of the show can be flexible enough to respond to news of the day. He invited me to his house afterward and I assume that there will be other people at their word and something happened every show night as I start getting all weepy and faith comes and she's looking for someone you get repeat the show was so important to so many of us when we were doing it and you really connect on a level that's deeper is perhaps the rest of the cast fact left side, just like he did used to be 60 Jane Pauley thank you for listening and please join us again next Sunday morning. This is intelligence matters with former director of the CIA. Michael Morel bridge Colby is cofounder and principal of the Marathon initiative project focused on developing strategies to prepare the United States for your sustained great power competition states put her mind to something, we can usually figure it out what people are saying and what we can know analytically and purely as our strategic situation or situations not being matched up with follow. Intelligence matters were ever you get your podcasts