Facing Economic Uncertainty

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Equal housing lender not licensed in Alaska, Hawaii, Georgia, Massachusetts, North Dakota, South Dakota and Utah 57 reads cast all your anxiety on him because he cares for you. God's word is filled with verses to bring certain times.

He always does his part, but we have to as well. However, of West.

That's especially true in times of economic uncertainty.

We can't stand idly by when there are things we should do to prepare teacher and author Ron blue is here to talk about that today that it's all your calls at 800-525-7000 you could call 24 seven. 800-525-7000. This is moneywise live biblical wisdom for your financial well or guest Ron blue is cofounder kingdom advisors and is often called the father of Christian financial planning Ron great to have you back on the program absolutely a lot of folks Ron might not know this but your heavily involved in training the financial professionals who become certified kingdom advisors see KA's that we talk about here often on the program and as a part of that you've developed a series of video talks called transferable concepts that you don't need to be a professional to understand and benefit from.

So perhaps you can begin today by telling us just what exactly is a transferable concept in one of the present material in such a way that it's memorable lights. In a nutshell, that people can get their hands around. It's something that they can repeat and live by. So it's highly transferable.

For example, I might say giving breaks the power of money that's a transferable concept. It's a truth that will never change and easily repeatable and easy to remember. And there are many, many transferable concepts in the financial in God's word relative to finances one of those today, and it involves economic uncertainty, which the last time I checked, is still going so Ron, what we need to know about economic uncertainty. Well Rob on the advantages of being my agent and my 80th year seven through eight decades, and often when I have spoken I gone back and reviewed my life over the those eight decades in 10 year increments and what I found is that in every increment there was economic uncertainty. I was born in World War II there were a lot of economic uncertainty in terms 70 right after 2008 when we had the market crash and turn 60, right after 9/11, so there's always economic uncertainty. I night that's another transferable concept, and that is that economic uncertainty is certain. So what are the key principles that should drive our thinking and behavior during economic uncertainty experience yesterday Rob where I was talking to a lady who is 66 years old nearing retirement, and she had been a widow for 10 years and she wanted to know she was doing okay and I said what tell me about your situation and she said that when her husband died. She didn't know what to do except to live within her income. She knew she couldn't overspend. She began saving. She began putting money under retirement plan. She ended up over time educating herself and she bought her a rental home and that was providing about $1250 a month income to retire in four years of age 70 and she said how my doing and I said what you're living within your income. You have no debt. You were giving she had told me that giving generously and said you have savings you get liquidity in Asia.

By the way, what's the value of that rental home and she said about 650,000 you know that your probably in the top 1% of Americans. All she had done was follow just a few basic money management principles that come out of God's word and she's ended up exactly work out with and tender to you and that is financially secure is powerful because it really illustrates this idea. That is God's part in our part and we need to be found faithful with what passes through our hands, as you point out, Ron.

Biblical principles are simple. We just need to follow them over a long long time. Ron always a joy to have you with us. My friend, thank you, thank you, Ron blues, but I guess today's the author of many books on biblical financial principles and you can find them wherever you buy your books here because her next. 800-525-7000. This is moneywise live biblical wisdom for your financial peace of mind thankful to have you along with us today and moneywise live on your host Rob West. This is the program we apply God's truth. Your financial decisions and choices help you navigate your role as a steward of God's resources. We do that with the Bible is our guide.

2350 versus the deal with money and possessions we mind those Scriptures apply the principles we see from God's word to what you're dealing with today, whether it's saving or investing. Perhaps it's giving her debt repayment. Whatever's on your mind.

We'd love to hear from you. We do have slides open.

Here's the number 800-525-7000. That's 800-525-7000 you know we started today by talking about economic uncertainty, our good friend Ron blue reminded us that economic uncertainty is certain we can count on it and as we do that we recognize that no we have have to recognize the difference between what we can control and what we can't control.

You know, as we go through life.

There's God's part in our part and I think that applies to yearly economic uncertainty around us as well.

Yeah, we can't control the US gross domestic product, or the stock market or the tax code, or the interest rates. But what we can control is what passes through our hands. Are we being found faithful with what God hasn't entrusted to us. However, little or however much beginning with the idea that we recognize it all belongs to him and were stewards that we should give careful attention to how we manage his resources and that we should look to God's word for those instructions.

You know, I think we can boil effective godly money management down to really five simple ideas we can build on these at least one is we should spend less than we are number two. We should avoid the use of debt to the best of our ability and overtime move toward being debt-free.

Thirdly, we should have some margin or liquidity in our lives meaning were living on less and therefore that surplus is allowing us to accomplish our goals. Thinking beyond the today toward the future so spend less than you earn. Avoid the use of debt have some margin or liquidity number four. Set long-term goals because we have a longer perspective were to make a better decision today and then five would be to give generously because giving breaks the power of money when we give. It requires us to hold what God has given us loosely and I believe it calibrates our hearts to his if we apply those five simple ideas.

Whether were acting on behalf of the nation, or just your individual finances. I believe it put you in a position to experience God's best. Now that doesn't mean it's always good to be you know where you're in a surplus situation, you will have difficult and desperate times we through this journey, the Christian life. We will see different seasons, but we trust in the Lord. We live with contentment for what he's provided right now and if we find ourselves in real need we have to rely on the others around us. The body of Christ to step in and provide some assistance along the way. That's I think the big idea and what's neat about it is it's incredibly practical and relevant to our lives today are, let's get to the volunteers that number 800-525-7000. Joanne is in Chicago, listening to W MBI Joanne, how can I help you I dares so I am 59 1/2, so my kingdom advisor had called and said I could transfer monies from my 401(k) over to them so that they could I guess.

Take care, that money better than maybe what's happening with my 401(k) but then somebody told me every time they move that money you're going to keep getting hit with C so if you give that money you need to let them know that they shouldn't trade with anything that he liked the reason I'm going to them is because I should trust in that they're going to do whatever is best, even if their speed they have to make money for what they do and I shouldn't be concerned about. Yes. Well, I would agree with your thoughts there in the latter half of that question the process of selling out of the investments that you hold in your 401(k) should not generate any fees you're paying an embedded management fee inside those mutual funds that were made available in that 401(k) and liquidating those positions to go to cash so that it could be then rolled out to an IRA that shouldn't really generate much in the way the additional cost. Now once it's redeployed on the other side in an in another environment with the custodian of that kingdom advisor then euro the fees associated with how that advisor manages money would then come into play as a client. I would want to know how they get paid but it's probably through a percentage of the assets under management. The charged to take discretion in and make the decisions with your goals and objectives in mind, and it could be if they're using mutual funds. It could be a management fee that's built into the fund or it could be just a straight percentage that's applied there may be some transaction cost but yeah you're right mean whatever is being charged. Obviously the returns have to warrant that fee that you're paying and you know they realize that they need to provide the returns on a net basis beyond what they're charging so that you see an appropriate rate of return in the good news is that after you spent a lifetime amassing this wealth you're now entrusting it into the care of a professional money manager who can give careful attention without emotion to the investments that are selected and I think that's a great place to be the primary reason joined that there probably recommending that you get it out of the 401(k) is because you can do that without tax consequence and your opening up the investment universe as soon as you do that you'll keep in mind in a 401(k) you're limited to just those few investment selections made available to you through the 401(k) that keeps it simple, but it soon as it gets to an individual retirement account managed by an advisor. Now, any stock, bond, mutual fund exchange traded fund, a bond, you name it is now available which obviously allows them to tailor the portfolio a little more finally to the needs, goals and objectives that you have so I don't think you're making a poor decision at all, and to the extent you there pieces of this that you don't understand.

I wouldn't hesitate to ask lots of questions about both how they're getting compensated as well as the strategy they're going to deploy on your behalf. Does that all make sense though not working so I'm still contributing to 401(k) but I'm just moving a big lump sum over yeah yeah and I think that's fine. Obviously, you know, as a part of this, you probably want to make sure that they give just a once over to the investment you're selecting inside the 401(k) they wouldn't have direct management oversight but could advise you to the extent you're looking for that on which investments to select and then you'll continue to fund that portfolio.

At some point when you separate from the company you probably roll the balance of it out into that individual retirement account close the 401(k) and then you know the management will continue all right.

Thank you so much okay Joanne Lord bless you and thank you for calling today on to Indianapolis. The Mitchell how can I help you, and I college my first credit card actually just looking at that.

Actually, not 21 yet so I know that there a lot about limitations on how you can buy per credit. I received income recently but my main question is, is very distinct manager getting a credit card from the bank right with what you have, like checking or savings account. You know, there's really not any necessary benefit to staying with your bank and I think the first thing Mitchell is your starting out. I love that you're asking this question is I want to make sure you're living on a budget, you have a clear plan for how you're taking the money that you saved and what you're earning by working in you have a plan for how you're going to spend that and control the flow of money. I think the key is that when we introduce credit cards into the mix.

Without that spending plan really gives you the potential to take that credit that's available to you and say well think I want to do this or that.

That's perhaps beyond what I have right now but I'll pay that back next month and then you can to get into the cycle of building up that they'll keep increasing the credit limit as long as you're paying the minimum payment and before too long. Now you're stuck in the cycle of credit card debt, paying high interest.

I don't want that. But if you can handle it responsibly and only use it for budgeted items and pay it off in full. The end of every month. It will do you a great service in that you'll begin to establish credit showing a responsible repayment history that will then increase your credit score so when you're ready to get that first apartment or some day by house or a car if you do need to seek some credit that fits well within your budget.

You will be able to do that because you establish credit as to where to go. I think the primary thing is I'd be with a top-tier bank so the type of credit that you have and who you do business with is important. I would want to make sure you don't have any annual fees.

That's really going to be key, but apart from that, you know, it doesn't really matter which one of those top banks and lending institutions. You go with couple website you can check out would be nerd wallet.com or credit cards.com to evaluate the various credit cards that are out there see which ones don't have those annual fees, to the extent you're looking for some rewards in cash that is so careful.

Establish your budget and proceed cautiously. Mitchell thanks for calling today would like your thinking about these days is a more moneywise just around the corner. 805 five 7000 on Rob West thanks for joining us today on moneywise live biblical wisdom for your financial decisions. Goals to get slides open today would love to hear from you. 800-525-7000. That's 800-525-7000 you were talking in the last segment about having a financial advisor. Manage your assets or resources.

Often we talk here about the certified kingdom advisor designation. If you'd like to find an advisor whose met high standards and training, ethics and integrity, and competency is also been especially trained to bring biblically wise financial advice to bear that you can find the CK a in your local area just had to our website moneywise live.org and click find a CK can search by city, state or ZIP Code. I would interview two or three if you're looking for a financial advisor and you want to align your values and then pick the one that's the best for you and head back to the phones today. Judy is in Springfield, Missouri Judy, how can I help you all are right now that we are wondering my retired here at which he had an IRA, previous job we also have each other. Simple IRA that work is all about outbreak point into a Roth IRA.

We understand we can get caught about 12 to do that in might take recovery time. I don't know that white Gaelic that going at retirement. What you have in the combined IRAs. The synapse and the simples's roughly what you think you have three separate account, probably shot around or under 30 okay I you said this money would be added to your taxable income for the year that you make the conversions of the question is really going to come down to would you benefit by paying today's tax rates for this money and then having it grow tax free from here during retirement or would you be better off just to leave it where it is on a tax-deferred basis and then when you take it down the road you'd pay future tax rates. Now the consideration number one is while you're still your husband is still working. Arguably, your taxes are a bit higher because feel his income that he's earning obviously which is taxable is that of the.

The base and then you'd be adding incremental income on top of that, and so arguably you could be paying some more. Now what we don't know though is what can happen with tax rates. I would imagine they're not going any lower than they are now in their probably heading higher depending on what happens politically in the future, but in the retirement season of life. You have less taxable income because he's not working you're not working and so you arguably you'd be in a lower bracket even if the overall rate structure was higher up the other kind of disadvantage of doing this now Judy is that you're the real benefit of the Roth is to have lots of compounding years of this money, you can grow over time on a tax-free basis, but as you enter retirement you're going to get a bit more conservative, typically in your investment strategy so there be less returns that you'd enjoy that tax-free growth on so you know, unless there's a real compelling reason that you have yet to move it to the Roth like you want to miss out on the required minimum distribution down the road and just leave it in the accounts which you can with the Roth. I don't know that there's enough reason while he still working to go ahead and realize that additional income. Just because I think you will end up paying a bit more in the way of tax but tell me your thoughts and if there was a specific reason you were wanting to do this that I did mention retirement ER last year for contribution, we might hot, about 12 and if we were to play with it which would take some time to recover that if we look at 95 years three Or not relegating after that. Right now, or farming out five years are not happy to catch that for five years. We don't get in trouble by taking it out at some point in having to it. At that point we are debt-free at that point we own our home. We own our vehicle that we can fall back. Sure the key though is that you pay the tax. At some point. So the question is do you want to take it pay the tax.

Now that when you converted to the Roth or do you want to wait and pay the tax.

Later, when you pull it out of a tax-deferred account like the set up for the simple, but in either case, you're going to pay the tax question is are you to be in a higher tax bracket now or later, and will the tax rates be higher now or later so I don't see enough compelling reason to make this conversion especially in the year that your husband is still working and obviously this year is something I probably check with your CPA just to run an analysis on that and if you really want to get it into the Roth of the tax-free growth. I probably at least wait until 2021, because he will ask that question and see what your CPA says if you want to do it next year.

We preach, moneywise live just around the corner. Don't go anywhere.

Thanks for joining us today for moneywise live with this lines up here is the number 200-525-7000 back to the phones in Chicago, Illinois, is Sharon MBI hi Sharon, how can I help hi question, you open up a 529 account for my granddaughter and I had to take the fun out of my checking account okay after tactic and this year we're starting to use the 5000 want to know delete that report that one might tactic yeah what what happens is the 529 plans when there used to pay for qualified educational expenses. There's no euro taxable with withdrawal to report on your federal income tax return. However, the plan administrator who ever is the custodian for the account would issue tax form 1090 9Q and 1090 8T and basically they'll list the amount of the distribution and how much was used to pay for those qualified expenses. It's up to you if you're the plan owner and is that the case are you listed as the account owner okay and that it would be up to you based on those forms that you would get to calculate the taxable portion, if any, but if there again if it was all used for qualified educational expenses. Then there is no tax to report and you would be you'd have the documentation but that there would be no tax due. So I think that's the key is to know how these funds are being used and then you'll receive those forms of the plan administrator do you do your own taxes or to use a tax preparer. All taxes okay very good so you'll just know that it tax time based on the year. The distributions occur, you'll get one of those two forms and they will list those distributions and how they were used to you know if there the funds are being used solely for qualified educational expenses. Yet you know yesterday and it went directly to University okay great all right so that's the case, then now there won't be any tax due for tuition's fees, and no other related expenses for an eligible student added to a university institution so you should be just fine and you you won't have to think about the tax portion of this because that's the benefit of it and so grateful that you've done this for your grandkids and know that was a huge blessing and it sounds like being put to good use of Sharon. We appreciate your call today.

WM BW Rome, Georgia hi Don, how can I help you yes thank you for taking my call. I have a small IRA that I was having a money market but then there was a seminar in town couple years ago that was credible.

I researched it and make sure that it was credible, had a track record and it's not an annuity but it's a German insurance company pretty thick one that allowed you to put your money into it and you are able to get the game to the market up to 6%. You are able to pick at least six different markets but they kept it at 6% but you would never lose any money.

If the market get down. You may have heard of that was previously sure and so and I have to take my my regular distribution of the month because I'm I'm, you know, 73 so but but I was wondering in the markets gained quite a bit here I want.

At one point I had in the Vanguard fund that mimic the S&P which I look back course hindsight hundred percent and there were big games there for a while in the S&P but I missed out on all those because I was afraid to lose a whole lot and I took it out, but in money market. So my question is, was wondering whether or not you know it would be good to take it out. There is a penalty though, and that put it back in the market rather than just try to inch along with those you know if you percentage points that I'm getting now, even though it's kind of say what I just wouldn't sure yeah you know there's a number of dynamics at play here.

Number one would be obviously tax consequences. Number two would be any surrender charges and then three just the overall returns and the commensurate risk associated with that right now you have a base under you were. You can't lose money. The downside is that you you're giving up some of the upside potential of the what you could make by being in know something that it is perhaps a little bit more growth oriented. You tied to US investments. Although I think international will perform pretty well in the in the next couple years, but being able to capture 100% of that upside which are not. You know in this product and that's one of the ways that they can give you the protection on the downside, I think is key.

So it's not something I could tell you definitively to do or not to do because of those variables so I think you need to start by just understanding number one. Are you willing to take a little bit more risk for the potential of a greater return by getting out from under this product, which kinda provides that floor and then secondly, what are those surrender charges. What are the tax consequences and then I think make your decision but if you'd not been happy with the returns and then clearly the move to bring it back and redeploy it it all into a more traditional investment strategy and in the risk you take on the risk associated with that is fine.

I just know you know what you're getting into. In terms of the charges in the taxes but I think directionally, I like that idea. I would just get some counsel before you make that decision and Don.

We appreciate your call today on to Dayton, Tennessee Anita, thank you for your call. How can help you. And lastly talking to 160 K in early retirement and highlight certain things how much I can earn and still not be the dollar for every two dollars make the thing down and from them but I did not fit into the caller, or in general when it was really that really, attention unit said that based on like whatever my average wages or salary is for the last year that that can replay pain years I have earned like, and, Social Security statement, and of all the 30 years or whatever work that the 15 highest years, but that average whites could replace the that I hear that correctly your close. Let me let me break it down for you. So until you reach full retirement age and you have to look at your benefits thing to see when it is for you, probably 66 or 67 Social Security will subtract from your benefit check if you exceed a certain amount of earned income for the year for 2021.

It happens to be 18,960's and nearly 19,000's of anything over that they're gonna reduce your benefits one dollar for every two dollars you earn over the limit.

Now you'll be reimbursed for that reduction later after full retirement age, but you will take that reduction in the near term.

Once you reach full retirement age, there's no limit on the amount of money you can earn and still receive your full benefits, and to the second party request. Your benefits are based on your highest 35 years of earnings, not 1535 so you're leaving later earnings years where arguably you're making more than maybe some early 35 years. Those will replace the lower earnings years which would allow you to earn more because your average 35 years is higher so you actually do yourself a benefit by continuing work and again any of reduction will be reimbursed down. Hope that helps. Anita thanks for listening. We appreciate your kind remarks more moneywise live just to moneywise live. So glad you're here with us in just a moment will go back to the phones. But first, it's Monday, which means good friend Bob Dall stopped by Bob is chief investment officer across market. Global investments where investments and values intersect. You can learn more cross Mark global.com and Bob the bulldozer out to the headline I saw was S&P 500 doubles from its pandemic.

Bottom fast is bull market rally since World War II was a correctly financing: low you hold your money start to believe there are ardent arm.

In history where we can see you double your money in: 18 months of this been absolutely amazing as economic recovery has been as well yeah and more records today. I think we had to want another record high for the Dow in the S&P yeah down the S&P up with the NASDAQ down if I will let you know throw cold water on this.

You know it's it's inches its way into one. One day it's one average that goes up the other day. If the other, average, or tomorrow night. That might be up in the Dow down week work week. We've been kind of sidewise with a modest bias for the averages, but the average stock actually peak in June and since then it's been meandering lower so the market regrets the advance decline line however you want to look at it is not as healthy as the overall picture looks slim. I know you're always looking at both love the macro perspectives and then obviously at the individual stock levels from a macro perspective one of the things that are most interesting to you as you evaluate the market and the economy this week so the Delta variant more more companies are talking about it getting more more delayed returns to the office and that's not great for the economy starting to see economists take their third quarter GDP estimates down somewhat to build healthy numbers. That's a positive point the other. We talked about this many times on Mondays, Rob, is it is inflation. Producer price index came out last week since we last talk was up 1% for the month of July ahead of the 0.6 expected.

So we've got this inflation that is problematic and you know what one of our headlines for weekly commentary was had and it has inflation peaked and will answer the question.

Probably not come off some but were going to be stuck in this somewhat higher range which markets are not paying a whole lot of attention to fixed income rates.

As you know, 10 year treasuries. They still 125-ish and the P/E ratio on the stock market still near near hot high levels so maybe inflation is picking I'd like to be wrong on my assessment that is not peeking but that's when gonna watch very carefully and clearly, if we thought it was transitory because we were waiting for supply chains to open and pent-up demand to be satisfied. Going back to your first point, which is some companies delaying returns to the office due to the Delta variant that may extend some of these supply-chain constraints on absolutely right which which aggravates the length of time were going to be stuck with a higher inflation rate than were comfortable with the longer it stays.

Rob, the more places it creeps into. For example, wages, wage rates have moved up year over year to a 4% level. You can't turn around and make it to tomorrow morning to know these things are are are are are sticky so I think we've got a fib. It's got its hands full as to when to begin the tapering process that is the "I am the amount of first fixed income they're buying every month and eventually you know year or 18 months from now begin to raise interest rates locates Bob your conclusion today, just as you summarize where use ECS right now. I'll start with. There is no alternative to equity equity 13 argument cash over a really low return bonds not very interesting and so people back into I guess alone some stocks. I hope that holds Chris will will shake the trees. We have some sort of pullback but we we think that that would economy and earnings as good as they are. It's hard to see big downside in the market sloppiness for sure got big big downside unlike and big upside. I'm likely more a trading range. You gotta know what you know, excellence, and hire a professional to do it would be my perspectives. Bob always appreciate you stopping by folks check out Bob Bob Dole's Dall's deliberations that cross Mark global.com where investments and values intersect and I rely on that commentary both in written form as well as here in the program weekly and you should too. Bob, great to have you my friend talking actually. I look forward to it. Back to the phones today. Evanston, Illinois Colleen, thank you for your patience. I can help you. Good afternoon my mind give me my 95-year-old mom has had a long-term care insurance policy in place for decades and premiums keep going up 900 quarter and every time I handle her finances.

I went and there which it doesn't make sense to continue paying so much for long-term care for an individual mid-nineties. Yeah, yeah. It's a great question.

I can understand the concern you know she's obviously had this for a long long time because a 75-year-old female applicant would pay about $7200 a year for 162,000 where the coverage and you know she's 95 and paying 3500, so those premiums are extremely low for her age and yet if she doesn't need it. She doesn't need it. I think the question would be, you know, would she had some point because the numbers are pretty staggering to me in a nursing home facility in a private room nationally is can run on average about $8800 a month. You know, assisted-living 4300, and so those numbers can add up and I guess the question is do you know what is she have in the way of assets to cover that if she were to need that kind of care for, let's say you know 2 to 3 years which would be typical or does she have enough to cover that and therefore you could drop this policy and just continue to boost her savings so I guess that would be the key. You know I'd tend to opt more towards hanging with it because you know it's pretty reasonable, given how long you been with it and you lose all of that benefit that you been paying for all these years.

As soon as you drop it and I would also want to know, what she has in the way of assets if she needs that type of care which again could be very costly. So tell me about that side of the Kelly about 400,000 and she gets Social Security.

My dad charity up until year and 1/2 ago when they had to employ a full-time 24 seven caregiver in order to keep her in her home because her desire. She was basically living entirely off Social Security and dividend so we never had to draw down from her investments not changed since we have a 24 seven caregiver in in-home.

She has no other debt. Their condos paid off. Yes, I'm wondering with that amount of assets and given her age is a hard life. Yes, well it's really just kind of no do you want the peace of mind to know that you know for that $300 a month if she were to need some care that you went well beyond where she was now because she wasn't just medically feasible for her to stay in her home and she needed and more intense nursing home care that there would be something that could step in and offset that and I think given the assets that she has, it seems like an in a pretty reasonable amount to give you that added peace of mind that that would be covered, so I'd probably tend to stick with it, but Doug and I think at the end of the day you make a good case for you know why she could depend upon her assets she's made it to age 95 and to this point. She's not needed that kind of assistance, and when she has with 24 seven care you been able to cover it just out of her current cash flow so I think it really just comes down to a piece of mind issue whether you know that extra expense per month is worth not having to wonder whether you know more costly care would be out of reach or erode her assets entirely something I think you could go either way I'd pray through it to before you make that decision if you were me I Colleen I'd probably stick with it. We appreciate your call today very much to Huntsville, Alabama Mike, thank you for calling listening to W MB W how can I help will turn 60 in October this year planning on start date. In January, evening and help will allow one on the car and one medical and don't have very little insight into not in the 401(k) rate.

I like that wondering would it be better security money is put it in the bank and continue to work probably. But back in writing like semiretired. About a year but would it be bad to put the money toward the long, long sword the money in the bank. Yeah, probably, focus on paying off the load. You can absolutely take 66 your full retirement age may be a bit more than that.

So I would if possible and sounds like you have this ability. Delay the application for those benefits until you reach full retirement age, but once you do take that money you can continue to work with no benefit reduction after full retirement age, and then you can take that money and start applying it to the loan so that you can then get rid of those before you have to stop working completely debt-free, which would give you a lot of flexibility so appreciate your call today. Mike all the best to you in this exciting next chapter of your life as you seek with let's get to do it for us today and moneywise live we apply biblical wisdom to your financial decisions wasn't thinking my team today Dan Anderson Amy Rios Jim Henry T also training today is a good friend Melody Mentzer over like she was long. Thank you for your moneywise live as a partnership between Moody radio and moneywise media come back and join us tomorrow