An Honest Talk About Racism in America

So can we have a candid, honest and Christlike conversation about race issues in America today stage for the line of fire with your host activist, author, international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown your voice of moral cultural and spiritual revolution Michael Brown is the director of the coalition of conscience and president of fire school of Ministry get into the line of fire valves like always 866-34-TRUTH that's 866-34-TRUTH your Jim is Dr. Michael Brown hard friends today is going to be a very special variant perhaps very intense broadcast on where we will be candid on with another. My ears are wide open.

My heart is wide open. I'm eager to hear from you. I'm eager to engage with you my heart also overflowing with things to share with you so phone lines are open but I want to be very specific only today will be taking calls that relate to the subject matter.

In other words, his retirement race race relations in America. Questions about systemic racism, things like that. That's what will be taking calls on and specifically given an invitation on Twitter.

Some of been calling me a racist.

Lately a Klansman. That's why got hit with yesterday, among other things, if that's your view. I would love for you to give me one example one concrete factual example of racism in my life just just want just want right phone lines are open 866-34-TRUTH 866-3487 80 for a little while give you more of an idea of what will be taking calls on today.

But this is just to say many days after recovery key things you want to talk about.

We open the phones for general Bible theology. We won't be doing that today right before we get into our race discussion. Please do pray for Israel.

Israel took out a major terrorist last night. As a result of which bombs have been dropping on Israel just got off the phone earlier today with friends in Israel.

They are having to deliver food supplies to those in need because the normal grocery deliveries were shut off schools shut down its time of real tension right now.

The terrorist organizations must launch attacks on Israel, then claim some kind of victory.

In doing so is just part of the way this process works. Obviously there could be a lot of pain and suffering on both sides and you have innocent Palestinians, people who are not terrorists or just try to live their lives, but they will be caught in crossfire, so please pray right. Please pray for Israel right now for God's grace God's peace in the midst of what is happening and for God's best for the Palestinians as well. One thing.

Second thing 48 years ago today while yet while as in wow of 48 years ago today for the first time in my life. I believed that Jesus died for my sins and rose from the dead.

I gone back to church after going in August earlier to pull my best friends out. I went back to another service at the end of the service to give an altar call no recollection of what the pastor spoke that night gave an altar call my friend nudged me you have this be a good time to respond. I thought you all these old people hear their prayer for me to be saved is like they think of the worst of sinners. I was I was a bad Senate Bill Hill though get a kick out of it. If I go up there so I was just meant it as a lark mean anything by it but as it went up to the pastor asked me to do. Pray quote the sinners prayer to pray pray words I for the first time.

As I said, I believe Jesus died for my sins, rose from the Dennison. I do believe this.

I do believe no my friends been sharing the gospel with me endlessly for months we've been talking back and forth for months and people been praying for me for months. I did believe it but was willing to repent. That was a moment to live for God. So the words I said after that I didn't mean and so I stayed up there and pray that everyone come up and pray they did that after every service and I said God you know when I go home and I'm getting high and I'm smoking PCPs also is Angel dust and shooting cocaine.

If you don't want me to do it.

Don't have any effect. I went home and I I did large quantities enough that would get probably five people high of not more, and nothing happened. My heart started to pound for second and everything stopped in a realist who sums going on here than five-week battle.

Five weeks in church one day shooting heroin.

The next in church one day getting high all day next back-and-forth until December 17 71 because grace said, Lord, on the report Anita LaMonica and that was the day of surrender. But this 48 years ago today.

The first time ever believed in Jesus.

All right, when you tackle now very sensitive and very difficult subject, but with candor. Many of you have been listening to me on radio for 11+ years. Now some of you have followed our ministry for decades in writing and sermon different forms. So with many we have a relationship.

We know each other.

We shared hearts together. You've heard my heart.

I've heard your heart many others. You don't know me at all and this is all brand-new and you don't know what to make of me, so allow me just to share a little bit of my own personal background and history. In fact, what about the shuttle. Think ever shared on radio before but my father came to that was born in America, but his parents came over from Russia right so they were Jews who immigrated from Russia. This was a time of persecution and difficulty for Jews in Russia. They came over to America. My grandfather on my father's side was a painter, but because of conditions back than unhealthy conditions. He died in his 40s cancer related to paint you never met him of my grandmother on my father's side knew her at the end of her life. They came from Russia.

My mother, so both parents Jewish. My mother was born in England. Her mother died when she was just a little girl just a few years old. The father abandoned the family so she came over to America as an orphan and was raised by other family members such as my mom and dad coming here. My dad basically became responsible's bread wherever in the family about 1011 years old had an older brother younger brother letter responsibly fell on them, but somehow my dad became that the key breadwinner in the family at an early age and then ultimately worked his way through college, worked his way through law school, became a lawyer and then became the senior lawyer in the New York Supreme Court, and my dad was very very liberal.

His politics then if he was alive today he be a liberal Democrat and he was as open and tolerance is in today's terms as you could be so the first organ teacher. My sister and I have my sister's 3 1/2 years old and the me the first organ teacher that we have as an openly gay man, so I was barely set the six, seven years old my sister about 10 and he would come over to her house to give organ lessons and then he and his partner would come any time and they would stay for dinner. Without that was my first organ teacher right so are our upbringing was anything but quote homophobic our second organ teacher was a black man married to a white woman so so this is now were talking early mid 60s right even though this was in New York. Even though things record more enlightened they are never my dad telling me how utterly wrong it was that they both lost friends on both sides of the family that the people turned against them because of an interracial marriage and my dad just talk about how absolutely wrong that was right.

So that's what I grew up with. I did not grow up in a home where where there was a stitch of racism right in and my dad again was a liberal Democrat that's that's the first thing that I got saved when Jesus change my life. That's all that mattered to me and I wasn't saved an environment where we even talked a lot about social issues, abortion was nothing that we talked about gay activism was not a subject that we we talked about, you know, just a lot of things going on around. We can talk about an end race race issues just there was unlike a social justice consciousness.

We got saber preaching Jesus, the next church. I was part of the very much. Have a social conscience. I remember not only did we sponsor refugees and bring them into our home from Southeast Asia, but then the next wave of refugees was from Ethiopia. Ethiopia. So first Asian refugees came in and base.

If we had a bad if we had a couch, we took them into our home, some for periods of years right that they they live with us all right. And then same thing with Ethiopian refugee so Asian refugees, the refugees from Africa. At this point lighthouses were filled. So we started getting apartments in and in them were we had classes in our church teaching English as a second language, and we were also strongly pro-life.

So is the environment that we were in and then what we can do to help the poor in our own community all right. Then it was absolutely an interracial church but not only that, I remember bringing in. We had John Perkins come in famous for.

As a black leader with a strong message of social justice and and I remember he came in and he said it.

I can't get mad at this church know he's because normally there'd be something he'd see just that was wrong. That was bothering him and it would give them, that, holy chip on his shoulder but he couldn't do that with us right so and and and then after that, I've just been involved in international ministry your folks that I work with closely in other parts of the world and at and men of God that that to become friends of say Reinhard ponte ministry in Africa these many years and and now is is an older man here in the states. He, his ministry was initially based in South Africa, and they constantly fought apartheid. He thought it was an evil system. He wore he would have ministers conferences and have Blacks and whites together and staying in the same places with the same accommodations and ultimately he moved his ministry out of South Africa because of a part of the apartheid system and just hurting the work he was doing because he was absolutely against it in the post or ego.

In more recent years become friends with James Robison James when he would do his and his gospel rallies in the South thought, segregation, and he and and there's some famous classic stories about him fighting segregation and making sure that Blacks and whites found equality in Jesus, so this is just been part of my background and heritage, and ensure all of us have blind spots yes yes absolutely help me with my blind spots as I help you with yours but but this is just in my upbringing and and my background and I'm I am just as thrilled and excited to see the work of God in Africa with our grads there or to work with your friends in India and as I am to to work with with friends in Korea or to work with friends in England or to work with friends in America and and for me when when Barack Obama Sen. Obama was running for president I wanted to vote for him. I wanted to have the privilege of voting for first black president.

I wanted to have the privilege of sending a message to the nation. Yes we continue to move forward as a nation. I wanted to have the privilege of doing that, but I could not because of his policies because of his viewpoints because of his stances on issues that were close to me and in the same way if say Dr. Ben Carson had been running for for president if if he actually got the Republican nomination and it was Ben Carson against 10,000 liberal white candidates Ben Carson to get my vote in a heartbeat. Ultimately, race, skin color is not the issue for me the issue is where we stand on moral and cultural and spiritual issues. That is the issue and now you tackle some controversies or 8866-34-TRUTH to weigh-in think about blind spot.

You think I'm not seeing things to think I'm explaining that's what recently whites planing will then come and set the record straight six, the line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown in the line of fire now going to 866-34-TRUTH your exam is Dr. Michael Brown. Let us dig into this subject. Let me just tell you what recently happened. Someone forwarded a tweet to me from the black Bishop. I didn't know who he was. Turns out one site I dug into finding out more about him that I realize that 10 years ago we published a book with testimonies of people coming out of homosexuality so and I actually got in on Kindle at the okay, got it because that's who he is but otherwise it even though I note knew his name or anything, but had a big twitter following seem to have a significant role in the African-American community and and fighting for civil rights and fighting against injustice and things like this so some assembly at the tweet and it's been like, tens of thousands of times on twitter and edits of this Mr. Talbert swan calling a black POTUS married 25 years to one wife with two children, no mistresses, affairs and scandals the antichrist but the white POTUS married thrice five kids by three women stresses affairs and scandals God's anointed preacher religions white supremacy, not Christianity. So I took issue with that particular responded to the tweet thoughtful.

I can see that that I sent to separate tweet just in case.

Those can respond and we say let me know if you want to interact or go on your show as a soy.

I'm sure you can come on my show and then I wrote an article responded. You can read the article is called a religion of white supremacy? It's on stream.org and I interact with the Bishop said, I do it respectfully agreed graciously.

I see you for sure there are some professing Christians were white supremacist who hated Obama because he is black and love trunk is is white and kisses patriotic, no question about it.

They don't care about anything else in his life. That's all they see us and conversely, there are some Christians who claim to be Christians were black supremacist and they hate trunk is is white loved about his black note racial bigotry goes both ways. Right will we all have blind spots and racial bigotry goes both ways, but in point of fact, I would gladly vote for Obama. The reason I opposed him was his militant pro-abortion stand.

What I believed and proved to be true that he was pro-same-sex marriage of the concerns I had. That's why couldn't vote for him in order for trump with a lot of reservations because of his baggage because it was passed because of lots of other things.

But is the stance of his other issues. Skin. Skin color had 00 to do with it. So if you are going to end every white evangelical that I know that I'm friends with that I work with. Their perspectives were the same. Okay, so the call that white supremacy run Christianity. That's a bigoted statement so anyway I guess after a day or two. Bishop Swan saw the article and and just last night there was kind of a twitter friends enemy from him.

I mean it just got crazy on twitter with a bunch of people coming at me. I got called the Klansman I got called a racist. I got called the other things with profanity and things like that and Bishop Swan and I went back and forth. I just want you to see how things develop. Okay, I just want you to see so he was upset with me for what I posted and I said Sir is a white, this is my initial a tweet to him. See if you wanted to engagement service white evangelical Christian. I strongly differ with some of your recent tweets accusing us of following the religion of white supremacy. Would you like your interact in my radio show your show or via Twitter so you can see that was my invitation. Nothing harsh angry about. I understand he didn't see it, no problem, but I did send it to his twitter account so he says you never tried to engage me in dialogue.

You wrote your article and posted to social media. Now that respondent you want honest, candid conversation and that's one of his want honest, candid conversation and sorrow. The article and I said but why engage in a twitter battle. I've invited you on my radio Internet shows national exposure, I can join you and yours.

Seven honest can conversation why not I have zero high and you honestly have no fear of speaking your mind and then one again. He denied it so so here's a copy of that tweet or isolate the supply should try to call his office are fine. I'm just let him know I'm writing an article and he's making public statements.

So, just like I make public statements on radio.

You can post all you want your differences would be great. Go ahead. Well let's let's keep going it, it starts to get worse. He's upset with me for not reaching out otherwise. A successor had no personal contact information for you. So I tweeted a response to your statement and waited that I tweet you separately inviting dialogue then waited 24 hours to post my article even there I was seeking to be fair, not inflammatory. Go back and check all right.

And now the responses begin to come in and as were going back and forth when he says that he sees things through the eyes of the oppressed and I see things the eyes of the oppressor. I begin to share some of my own background right and and what are the responses I get.

This is white privilege at its finest. I found out now that whatever I say is white splinting in another context, it's man splinting was I'm guilty because I'm white I'm guilty because I'm a male that's that is what's happening here.

All right, let's let's keep going in the progression and look at some more of these tweets. So here's what happens next. He's he's starting to unload liar. This is what this is what Bishop Swan is posting liar.

You never reach out to a black Bishop. You want an article white explaining my indictment of white evangelicals who embrace a white supremacist POTUS princesses. This will rub against you offer gracious dolly know you came for me and only respondent when I checked you on your foolery right. So, liar guilty fully.

Now you'll see in all of my interaction. Read my article every tweet still acting respectfully. I'm still single and let's dialogue.

Let's talk. Let's interact and try to build a bridge which talk okay. Here is his response to me your gaslight your lying ass lighting hypocrite Planetree crowd was your complete desire which is why he wrote an article about me and posted on social media in the first place. If you want to dialogue and to build bridges you would've reached out for conversation to begin with hate my art. First, I did reach out a reach out. The only way that I knew because he's right there on social media so I reached out to him via social media list of what number to my article is also where building, bridge read it's nonaccusatory inflammatory pieces sending a tweet with no confirmation that I've ever read. It is not reaching out fact your cowardly is this a Bishop okay cowardly gas lighting obtuse racist white evangelical who supports an unrepentant, racist, xenophobic, sexual predator because he defends your faith and I suggest you falsely accuse me your tweets tonight fact reached out you before I wrote my article you did not respond fact article is fair and factual fact of offered you dialogue again engage in name-calling and race baiting tragic and sad, and then I said in response certainty tweet like this with all the name-calling. All right, the accuser of the brethren stuff your partner with the evil one speaking ugly laws about to serve the Lord in me. Shame on you and may the Lord grant you repentance. I will no longer try to engage.

You cannot be taken seriously. So this is why just a little stronger and severe immuno lie about the slander he publicly Sir, how can I possibly engage art. So let's let's just keep going. Here are some of Bishop Swan's views. This is from 2018. The Jews you see in Israel today are descendents from European Jews that settled there after World War II in France, Great Britain and America got together and push Palestinians off the land to help create mom and Israel. They are not the Jews of the Bible, so he also embraces that narrative that we are not directly connected to the Jews of the Bible all right and and how about this just again so we get some of the positions of the Bishop white women are happy with white supremacy. 53% voted for Trump 63% voted for Roy Moore, 53% ready for Rhonda Santos, 59% voted for Ted Cruz, 76% for the right camp. They supported bigotry, racism, misogyny, pedophilia, and sexual abuse pure trash. So if your white woman and you voted for Sen. Cruz you support white supremacy and your pure trash and you support pedophilia.

By the way, those who voted for Roy Moore voted for him because they thought he was falsely accused. That's the issue they thought he was being falsely accused. So here I I'm explaining again reiterating what happened. I reached out via Twitter is tweet was vicious my article interact graciously over and over tonight asked him for dialogue and he replied with name-calling and false accusations.

It was after constant lies about me that I accused him of slender truth.

So here are some of the responses I get some the ones we can print you are not the Christ flee going to bring it work. Go dialogue in prayer get a holy Bible. There's your dolly.

We don't want to talk. You're a ZZZ go leave us alone you Beelzebub. So now I'm now I'm the devil for confronting races. Now I'm the devil for seeking to build a bridge of dialogue. Now I'm the devil for writing a gracious and fair article saying that if I support Trump because he's helping to appoint conservative justices, pro-life constitutional justices to the courts and helping stand for religious liberty stand with Israel fight global tar terrorism pushback against radical LGBT extremism that that brand makes me a white supremacist own and expose that lie in Jesus name. Do I believe it's harder for a black man in America today than white men. Yes. Do I believe the still systemic racism in America yes and I have a dear friend.

The black brother who sometimes on a daily basis sends me news headlines, pointing to these very things he said hey Mike, don't forget this. This is going on at the same time.

When I see racism and bigotry from any side. I will address it and I will expose it and for doing that.

Here is another tweet that came my way you're going straight to hell. There's nothing honest or Christian about friends. This is what it's come to this is what it's come to know Pres. Trump's administration just reverse something that the Obama administration past. If you were an adoption agency getting federal funding, then you had to be willing to place kids in same-sex homes of the ways you lose your funding person. Trump is reverse that and said note you can have your religious convictions and still get federal money is one reason I voted for him and not for Obama, reverse the call reverse the colors in my stand would be 100% exactly the same. Can we get past this book if you talk to me in your black I'm I can call it black, explaining, and if you're female. Micah called female splint.

Let's just talk right.

Let's talk past get past the racial accusations and the skin color. Let's have a heart-to-heart conversation shall be my blind spots. I'll show you yours and let's role as followers of Jesus and help a messed up world who's in, who's in with your calls and the line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown voice of moral cultural and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown.

Thanks so much during this today on the line at 4866 I am advocating standing together, black, white, Asian, Hispanic, Jew and Gentile in Jesus standing together and as one work. What's with them is Camille working as one, to heal racial divides to to heal the wounds of our country to learn from each other to address sin where ever it is. Let's about sin okay to address sin wherever it is repent of sin would involves us personally and to do the right thing.

I'm asking for partners to continue to do that.

As I've partnered with others, black, Hispanic, Asian wife over the years, Mrs. Leslie no longer the phones 866-34-TRUTH you think I'm wrong. The best answers wrong you think I'm blind.

Please call and enlighten us right it's it's one thing if you said I think your anti-gay because we have done so much work to expose the wrong agenda of radical gay activism because we say you cannot follow Jesus and practice homosexuality.

At the same time, I understand you'd say I'm anti-Palestinian again wrongly, but I'm anti-Palestinian because of stood strongly with Israel but I mean come on bottom line you coming racist play ICU a means those who have unclear pure white, black, green, yellow, calling me racism but implying it's coming from any particular quarter. But this last thing why started on radio. It was during the primaries of the presidential elections out so don't go all the way back to the 2008 elections August 1, 2007 that time and I I didn't know how much I was going to get involved in political issues. How much I was just going to do Bible theology.

Those kinds of things Israel issues and I made a comment one day critical of Sen. McCain right. I made it the comments critical. Sen. McCain Republican likely candidate right and then a few days later I made a comment critical of Sen. Obama and then a woman call Hadley black woman. She said what you have to bring a brace all the time what you mean she's all you do is bash and Obama said actually first. That's not true that I I criticized Sen. McCain one day and then another day. I criticized Sen. Obama. This is because of differences with some of their stances. I said, and +1 Sen. Obama when Barack Obama was running for Senate against Alan Keyes of the black night. I preferred Alan Keyes.

I liked Alan Keyes. He was also black. Since I don't get what you're saying so that I realize okay the just as I have blind spots and see things a certain way, which is why have been on my face so much over decades and listening to daily criticism and input from my wife, Nancy, and having friends and see things differently that always challenge me so I can grow and be more Christlike the same way others have their biases in the wrong perceptions and and that I was going to try to straighten that out.

Sisal: do this is getting people's trust of a period of years, and I remember with the George Zimmerman shooting trave on Martin.

We have a lot of discussion about it in and learned a lot from each other and and I had black listeners come up to me at meetings.

I was preaching in churches are doing meetings. They said I know you will white son about my voice sound bites don't know how you make that determination but I guess the positions I was taking. They had never seen a date that isn't that sweet every we just hug his father's eyes is as sweet no because it is not about skin color.

It's about the hard spot the heart and where skin color is an issue. The people then we have to expose that after dress on. I'm here to address it with you all right 866-34-TRUTH let's go to Indiana hope. Thanks for holding your first up today on the line of fire. Dr. Brown not finally meet thank I want your video, collect my money. Thank you, my question is if you ever heard of it term called white fertility the book by Robin D'Angelo and talked about why white people are great. Talk about me.

I might want to get your thought on that and so how would you tell one of color black woman at night begin to engage with talking about right. Yeah yeah so so hope.

Note number one, I've heard the term and it was thrown at me yesterday. So glad getting bombarded by a ton of of followers of bishops wanted by Bishop Swan himself, your love and name-calling's and I'm there just trying engage.

I decided to spend a few hours on Twitter instead of my writing projects just to engage. So as I'm engaging like a flood of people hating on me. I'm accused of white fragility of flavors white fragility. I wouldn't be here engaging yes the term is out there and I'm sure in some cases there is truth to it it. In other words it's it's too threatening to think that there wrong things in our history or that we built on certain wrong foundations or that there might be in some parts of America ideas that a black person was still less human than a white person you know that so sometimes you just any fence can expose a flaw or is can be critical if you're insecure then you can respond negatively when you're secure. It's like we are bringing on please. Absolutely. So I've heard the term but like anything else it gets misused terribly misused and now it now becomes weapon eyes just like you get anything I'm saying now is White's mining and for fun on Twitter earlier Soka repent to be white.

Now what would you tell me what to do not repent to being a male. What I do know that officer was being sarcastic but what you have to do to have honest conversation is is always and I don't care which side of the equation you're coming from is to ask someone how things look to them and in other words, I will. I would ask some… Let's see one have a dialogue with a white friend that just is oblivious to what it's like to be a black female in America, completely oblivious to write and and they have no clue that are said to be a a black 17-year-old male right that the likelihood of that kid being racially profiled all right or were being pulled over in a certain air if he was in the wrong driving through the wrong neighborhood getting pulled over wouldn't happen to like they're completely oblivious to this right so I always try to start with asking questions like if I'm sitting on the plane next to someone that's obviously gay or lesbian. I'll introduce myself, tell them what I believe and say hey please tell me your story and then I will only fear their perspective along to see things through their eyes and so first that's help me even if it ends there.

I become more sensitive right that someone number two may be the last. From my perspective and I could share it with them and and I might ask a series of questions. So if I was engaging a white friend hope of if I were you I would ask like how you feel about like you about white supremacy reward thing trumps racist or I try to engage them find out where they're coming from and then Satan will ask you think there's a full racially quality to think that that may be a white woman that you might have these initial black woman asked some questions and then if you can develop any type of friendship or relationship they're going to ask you questions and that's when you get to explain things.

So for example, as we talked through a lot of the race issues in the past trave on Martin George Zimmerman and in the shooting of my namesake Michael Brown a few years ago of a lot of callers called in African-American callers, a Dr. Brown I love you of this in future for years and think of a racist bone in your body, but you're not aware of what many of us have lived through and gone through and so on. Those calls help to enlighten me to some because I'd never been racially profiled, you know, so I learned from a lot of the callers to give me a broader perspective of things are not as good as many of us may think in America to discuss unpractical helpful help you. You think that that could be workable. That was really, really, really good. I don't think that your bag or anything like that. And you're right, like white fragility of the way it works. Definitely run toward especially what is been issued spiritually in our country. I really appreciate all the work you do.

Keep it up.

Got really proud of you. Love you all. Hope you are. You are very sweet and relist together we are and we need each other. He asked the bottom that's the crazy thing we need each other believers right now there's a concerted attack from the world coming against us. And we need each other so hope you're very gracious thank you and may the Lord, you should place all right. I think it 866-34-TRUTH.

Let's go to Christopher in Texas walking to the line of fire. Hello background hey I will call you directly or or your document. I got your new suit.

Thank you sir on what you call a black primitive always follow through in our I don't see how anyone could come out with the things that they came up when accusing you of confusing couple comments about a Christian, yes you want one thing, what have you been accused of supply conservative, have you been told you're not black and I you betrayed your community. All of it is on your yet so if that can be said of a black man falsely right then the same people choosing you falsely can imagine what the data say about me, a 64-year-old Dragnet RV are not required. I'm actually because I believe you know, in my opinion. I just believe it. Are huge are brainwashing and are not believe that those people who are influenced by the liberal left to the extreme, typically a fit with these things on a day-to-day basis through Yahoo. The media comedy pictures everywhere you like.

Oversaturated with this idea so it kind of not surprising to me but at the same time that we should be aware that those who are web control over these outlets in all its parts are who determines what was being shown on TV and played through the music United is everywhere so it's kind of hard to get away from the idea that you're fighting again, you're pretty much guarding a hive mind mentality right extra popular mentality and I'm afraid it probably wouldn't get any better, but his heart Warren was not really aware that we can truth actively to actually see our neutral standpoint, just the second week we got a break about your questions.

On the other side of the break, but my own perspective just on the political level is that Pres. Obama really proud played into divisive race issues as part of his social agenda was negative on that Pres. Trump has been a tremendously divisive figure that is further exacerbated to division so to me. We've kind of had to straight administrations that have polarized us even more. But as believers, here's the deal. As believers we have to get past that listen to each other from each other. Okay Christopher will come right back to David California.

After that, taking it's the line of fire with your host activist, author, international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown voice of more cultural and spiritual revolution get into the line of fire now by calling 86643 here again is Dr. Michael Brown thanks friends for joining us on the line of fire) Christopher in Texas yester so you had a couple questions on lawyers want to highlight American troops trouble on their that we are black person I was treated and want take up too much of your time to open up a can of worms.

What we are to do whatever black people believed it would be your old ideas from so many different outlets. Really our owners you're exposed to the right people. It's hard to turn the not really engage was going on typically overall. It's hard to really feel her true unit. I mean, not the thankful knee per se because are admittedly paying to enter stuff on a day-to-day basis might work being targeted by the media. Old ideas to Bob media are median like music, art and culture. Even at my job even at churches like churches that predominantly black you have to leaders that begin again what your talk. So do not. I really do know that it's hard for black people nowadays to really speed up when your brain oversaturated with this devilish mentality you to see right that that's not really their units down on the moment yeah well I just say this out. I was just trying to find this online is talking a book that I got by black executive Tom Burrell. He was in an PR work came out but I got into thousand 10 called brainwashed challenging the myths of black inferiority and just brainwashing from another angle. I remember Sir when I first started talking about issues and then got hit with charges of you while you being racist or to race all the time and I was just talking issues a black caller name Rachel Coleman.

She said that she was old enough to remember the speeches of Martin Luther King Jr. and that she said this is a spiritual battle that has to be fought spiritually, even in the church are a seat so she tried an experiment.

She she went to two friends of hers by Christians committed believers right and and she went through a list of social issues and asked where they stood on those and they stood on the conservative side of all of those but Winchester. There were voting for. They were voting for liberal candidates. So then she came right to a letter that said that we had actually produced a copy of of Sen. Obama encouraging LGBT activists.

It was Democratic club in San Francisco. She read the letter to them and this is not a disputed document she read the letter to her friends and they were upset with it. We could never support anyone like that. She said that Sen. Obama this is no it's campy. It's forged so she said it takes spiritual now look every one of us can have a stronghold run.

Aware of and that's where we help each other but the fact is there are strongholds and reasoning and friendly discussion presenting facts, it doesn't work that that's what scares me. I was talking to Nancy today. I said it's it's it's frightening to me that you can present facts or for example, Bishop Swan saying Donald Trump said Nazis are very fine people. Chris is a complete myth a total myth and and and what it happened in in Virginia with with fish. With that, the fatality therewith. All right the protesters he'd said there were fine people on both sides use time of those that were protesting against the statute of the Confederate statue being taken down and there were men and then someone said something about already.

Does Nonno know the white supremacist the neo-Nazis the same press conference. They are to be completely condemn completely condemn them at the same press conference that had a subsequent press conference said it again, but at that same press conference, he clarified, that's not always talking about some of these people so to this day it's misquoted and when you present are here, here, watch this watch doesn't matter. And that's what frightens me. And by the way I'm not pointing finger with color because there there are blinded whites and blinded Blacks and blinded Jews and by the Gentiles. And so we gotta get on our faces and say God opened my eyes open my I just want truth wherever it leads. However unsettling it may come you live through its her and and you know when you hear waterboarding speaker Thomas Sowell speak Candace Owen speaker.

Others speak in their articulating things they just get written off because they're on the wrong side of the social issue, since when did skin color become a social issue known him saying that I thought the issues were the issue, so let's keep listening to each other learn from each other and really praying the truth will triumph because there's just a lot of confusion and and it's when you get on intranets or contracting if it scare you one last example I ice I decided to try to engage, even if cemented 20 Twitter followers try to engage or ask a question or try to get a response so I I saw a tweet came in this morning and was a woman. The second thing, something that another man had said and I saw her name and should a PhD. I thought all let me get you. Phil PhD and I said I just want clarification on this previous tweet did you mean by they, and she responds immediately, what US the person scented your you're asking me because I'm a woman and I said your tweets though I saw and what the world you talking like usual.

She is will this is the way you treat black women. I thought all my and she believes this I thought oh my God this is this is scary and but again I want to say this plainly, I have it just so happens I been interacting with a black Bishop were trying to about these issues, but I am absolutely categorically recognizing their problems on every side, there is blindness on every side, and his blindness on the right and on the left and Republican and Democrat in black-and-white. Everything in between.

So this would humble ourselves pay Christopher stand strong. Sometimes it can be lonely, but you're on the side truths are your regular are godless 866-34-TRUTH. Let's go to David in California. Thank you for calling I Brent Beck and Michael sure thing LOL thank you very much for addressing it.

And October.Her listeners interactive. It's really amazing. I appreciate it though. I did have a question to collector I argue earlier in the day at say that you believe in the thematic rate as an object.

About how you understand that term you leopard a lot with a different things about the thematic rate that all men are the man actually recently by the name of Larry Elder is a conservative black male was making a good argument. I mean, in my opinion that the wide system quote unquote and America is not actively working against black people to oppress them or keep them down and without being that I do believe that racism is an issue and asked my wife and I have the conversation about Time Machine. Really amazing that being able to articulate social and cultural issues been really challenging the challenge of me on my bias opinion felt like it really been an incredible absolute profit in our marriage but I'm just.

Without that, yes, I think the term I use the systemic racism which would be a similar concept systematic yet so systemic racism so something in the system itself and as for Larry Elder.

He's great great insight.

Another excellent cultural commentator that that I learned from is as well, but in. In short, I recognize that there is reverse racism today. I recognize that the in other words, I was just told of the situation with the number one qualified candidate in the University to get a job in the secular market being number one top qualified candidate by far was passed over twice, because he was a white male. He was in the person of color, and it wasn't female. I know this firsthand II heard from the man's father and what it took for the professor to make calls to get him a job and that they knew they knew 100% white hat so that does exist, but I believe that for whatever reason, there is still against someone can correct me on on the data but as far as I understand that in many situations in America today. If you put a a rich white person in front of a jury versus a poor black person that the rich white person is going to have a much better chance of getting a favorable verdict than the poor black person and again you know someone's gonna have to look at statistics and sense I've researched it some. I know Heather McDonald in her book on on on the war on police want cops goes through data and says that actually it's black cops who shoot black suspects more than white. Otherwise, it equals out and it, and I understand that data that I've seen others with other data, but from what I can tell, average prison sentences things like that how courts might view people who has a leg up in the system there.

There do seem to be any qualities that remain that can disfavor black Americans. And so in in certain settings. I believe that remains an and in other settings of, for example, I know that you looking at crime rates and that police are not racially profiling there there crime profiling. In other words, that crime in our community tends to come from gangs who consist of Hispanics age 16 to 22 males and so we see them in the system.

You know, in a community where there they don't live were targeting not because of race or ethnicity, but sometimes things can go further than that and that does seem to be the case to a certain extent. And that's what I mean by it. So I just want to see equality, right, that's what we want we want to see equality, justice, righteousness. So, let's pursue it were my perspective needs to be adjusted yours anymore.

So let's adjusted but let's agree we go summer skin color goes, or ethnicity.

As followers of Jesus.

Let's work together for truth for justice. Let's work together for equality and for Jesus to be solved and for the healing of the wounds in our nation