It's All About the Messiah

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network stage for the line of fire with your host activist all the international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown your voice of moral cultural and spiritual revolution Michael Brown was the director of the coalition of conscience and president of fire school of ministry get into the line of fire valves like always 866-34-TRUTH that's 866-34-TRUTH your Jim is Dr. Michael Brown is election day. Certain states in America.

The biggest stakes right now. Virginia, the gubernatorial race. The biggest focus.

There will talk about that today we'll talk about that gobbling tomorrow we get the results in a can reflect on the meaning of this for Virginia and for the nation. Today we focus on Scripture on messianic prophecy. Welcome to the broadcast. This is Michael Brown to some to call if you have any question at all of any aspect of messianic prophecy, 866-34-TRUTH. It's 866-348-7884 anything having to do with New Testament interpretation of the messianic prophecies text within the Hebrew Bible questions you've had objections you heard from rabbis will take your calls 866-34-TRUTH then at the bottom of the hour will be joined by J Warner Wallace to talk about his new book person of interest, so as a Jewish believer in Jesus early on I found out about the messianic prophecies I came to faith. Before I knew about them. In other words, I wasn't one where someone set me down with the Hebrew Bible or an Old Testament Christian translation and shall be prophecies about Jesus and fulfillment, and I was convinced by that. And that's what led me to see God and in my case, God convicted me of sin of leading a rebellious drug filled life, then save me and then as a believer I began to learn about the messianic prophecies but no sooner did I learn about them that I was challenged by the rabbis fact, I can honestly say because the rabbis that I dealt with were much more versed in this it in these prophecies that I was at the beginning that II read the reputations of the prophecies before I read the prophecies in some cases known him, saying, and that I have these little tracks that someone gave me a euro from a Jewish outreach organization or some Christian outreach to the Jews and and I agreed the tracks and okay and here's how to present messianic prophecy natural to rabbis out he was wrong here. This is wrong there, that's being misinterpreted so I determine after fall. The truce rep. Whatever direction goats gonna fall the truths of Scripture. I know question at that time that the Old Testament was the word of God. I didn't doubt that. I believe in the calling of the Jewish people by God therefore said okay I have to go wherever the truth leads the more studied the more prayed, the more I dug in, the more I learn the original languages that the more my mind was strengthened to agrees my heart.

In other words, I knew that Jesus died for my sins. I knew that he rose from the dead. I knew it in my heart. It was real in my life. Yeshua had radically and dramatically changed me.

But what if there is some other explanation. What if I had some type of false spiritual experience. What if some of it was emotionalism that I didn't think that was true for a second but I had lots of questions in my mind and it's God's desire that we love him with all of our heart, soul, mind and strength.

It's not God's desire that we just love him in an intellectual way all you can make an intellectual case for the existence of God. I can use an ontological argument or cosmological argument, and therefore, God must be real and therefore is real. I should fear him.

Let only go so far the city to bring you into a saving knowledge of the truth.

The second bring into an encounter with God and his love the 2nd° into a revelation of the cross.

On the other hand, it's not just a matter Felix with feeling in the heart and and and he touched me and sometimes my hair, my arm stands since on and I just must be the Holy Spirit most wonderful of the Holy Spirit touches you and it's wonderful. If you have different experiences but goes beyond that love God with all of our heart and mind oversaw all of our strength and we have to renew our minds to the truth. But that doesn't mean shut off or critical thinking means renew our mind to think rightly renew our mind to think biblically renew our mind to think truths fully. So if all I had was the Hebrew Bible. I could make my case for Jesus being the Messiah. I could make a decisive case, of course, God has to open hearts and minds, but I believe I can make a decisive case for why Jesus Yeshua has to be our Messiah and I could also make a case for the complex unity of God that the God who is hidden also reveals himself, the God who is untouchable makes himself touchable in a manner of speaking, that's another subject.

Let's take a look in Luke 24, beginning in verse 13. This is after the resurrection of Jesus. 2413. That same day two of them said to the disciples going to a village called Emmaus, about 7 miles from Jerusalem.

They were talking with each other by everything that it happened, as they talked and discussed these things with each other, Jesus himself came up and walk with them but they were kept from recognizing him. He asked them what are you discussing together as you walk along the street still faces downcast. One of them. Then Cleophas asked him you the only one visiting Jerusalem who does not know the things that have happened there in these days. What things thing ever everybody. Jerusalem knows what's going on were downcast. What things issue as all you gotta love this about Jesus of Nazareth, they reply, he was a prophet powerful in word and deed before God and all the people the chief priests and our rulers handed him over to be sentenced to death.

They crucified him, but we had hoped that he was the one who was going to redeem Israel. And what is more, it is the third day since all this took place. In addition, some of our women amazed us went to the tomb early this morning but but didn't find his body. The came and told us that they see the vision of angels. Who said he was alive. Some of our companions went to the tomb and found it just as the woman said, but they did not see Jesus. He said to them how foolish you are, and how slow to believe all that the prophets have spoken did not the Messiah have to suffer these things and then enter his glory, beginning with Moses and the prophets. He explained to them what was said in all the Scriptures concerning himself as the approachability which they were going. Jesus continued on as if he were going farther father but they urged him strongly stay with us for his early evening.

There is almost over so we went to stay with them was at the table with them, he took bread, gave thanks broken. He began to give it to them. Then their eyes were open. One remarkable the Accomplices and they recognized him, and he disappeared from their sight. They asked each other or not our hearts burning with us within us while he talked with us on the road and opened the Scriptures to us got up and returned it wants to truce them. There they found the 11 those with them assembled together and saying it is true the Lord is risen, has appeared to Simon than the two told what happened on the way, how Jesus was recognized by them when he broke bread that stop there and think for a moment Jesus is saying these Jewish disciples usually are really slowed to you not getting this it here it is written in the word. Here it is laid out the word.

What a marvelous conversation. It would have been to sit in on as he opened up the Scriptures, beginning with Moses and the prophets at an end goes through the Hebrew Bible and shows how it predicted his coming. He predicted his death and he predicted his resurrection, and obviously God and the disciples that were there no details of we share in our shared now we go back to Luke 24. Later in the chapter and MBC that Jesus now is meeting with his 11 disciples was going to Luke chapter 24 and will begin around verse 43.

Luke 2443 and and it says this he took and ate and their presence and said to them, this is what I told you so. Verse 44 is rumored to start. This is what I told you while I was still with you because he kept saying the Scriptures had to be fulfilled. The Scriptures had to be filled in any would say he had to be crucified he would rise in the on the third day in a complaint to the every saying must be fulfilled that is written about me in the law of Moses, the prophets in the Psalms.

This reflects the threefold division of Scripture that we have in the Hebrew Bible to the stake hotel knocked her on the VM to fame to raw law of Moses knew became the prophets, which in the Hebrew Bible is Joshua Judges 1st and second Samuel, first and second Kings, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, and the 12 Minor Prophets. Everything else is the last section could tubing which means the writings which is probably summarized here as Psalms being the largest body of of literature in the last section of the Hebrew Bible, we have it organized in a different ancient Jewish form with the Torah than the historical books and poetry wisdom than prophets, but look at this.

Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the law of Moses, the prophets, the Psalms, then he opened their minds so they can understand Scriptures. He told them this is what is written knows this is found in the Hebrew Bible, the Messiah will suffer and rise from the dead on the third day in repentance for the forgiveness of sins will be preached in his name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. And you are witnesses of these things and send you what my father's promised stay in the city until you been clothed with power from on high, but let me take you one more passage of Scripture. In John chapter 1, so it will go to John chapter 1 and here you've got Philip Nathaniel there talking verse 44th Philip like Andrew and Peter was from the town. The bedside, Philip found Nathaniel and told him we have found the one Moses wrote about the law and about whom the prophets also wrote Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph, so this is the consistent testimony look at one more passage and in acts. The third chapter someone more passage will go to this is the consistent testimony that God, through Moses, the prophets through the writings of the Old Testament that God prophesied the death and resurrection of the Messiah and I would even argue the timeframe in which we come before the second Temple was destroyed to look at Peter's message here in acts chapter 3 to his Jewish audience in Jerusalem after the Messiah has ascended to heaven. Verse 24. Indeed, beginning with Samuel all the prophets who have spoken have foretold these days that he's ready quoted from Moses in Deuteronomy of the prophet God would raise up and you are heirs of the prophets, and of the covenant God made with your photos is it Abraham through your offspring all peoples on earth will be blessed when God raised up his servant center first to you to bless you by turning each of you from your wicked ways. Notice he sees as the prophets beginning with Samuel have spoken of these days and is ready quoted how Moses spoke of the coming of the Messiah. This is the consistent testimony of the entire New Testament Bible by Christian Slater as the Old Testament prophesies coming of Jesus died for sins to rise from his written so we will file the line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown get into the minor fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH here again is Dr. Michael Brown for truth in bottom of the hour will be joined by J. Warner Wallace will talk about his new book person of interest important announcement ready this Friday gobbling Dr. Mark Spengler will be joining us again to answer your health related questions.

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So one thing that I discovered in studying messianic prophecy is that they were there were different levels of messianic prophecy. There are some that would be very overt, very clear, very definite speaking of a future messianic King who will rule and reign on the earth, so a passage like Isaiah 11 yes it does have an ancient historical context that Judah, having been decimated by Assyria at and being just like a stump that out of that of the stump of Jesse would come forth the Messiah was a historical context, but it's clearly speaking of a future time. That is not yet happened under the rule and reign of the Messiah. That's why Jews and Christians alike agree that Isaiah 11 is a messianic prophecy or Isaiah 21 through four, even though doesn't mention Messiah. There because it speaks of this time of universal peace and knowledge of God on the earth is recognized by Jews and Christians alike as a messianic prophecy. There are some that are that direct and that overt there are others that you may have to dig a little bit more to determine that it's actually messianic. For example, we know that David was a priestly king that David perform certain priestly functions that other kings after him could not perform. The word was given to him/the Messiah in Psalm 110, there would be a priest forever after the order of milky ascetic course milky ascetic himself being a priest and a king of shall blame in Genesis the 14th chapter so we have those references and then we see clearly that there were priestly aspects of the Messiah's work, which have to do with making atonement for sin which have to do with suffering on behalf of the people and we see the Messiah depicted as a priestly king and Zechariah the sixth chapter quite explicitly. In fact, and from there we understand that there is a stream of prophecy has to do, not just with the Messiah's ruling and reigning but the Messiah, serving as a priestly king making atonement for sins suffering on our behalf taking our place is the great intercessor and that's when we open up Scriptures in Isaiah 42, 49, 50, 52, 13 253 12, which point to this Messiah being the light of the world, the light of the nations one to set the captives free, beginning with the Jewish captives but one who will be rejected. One who will be beaten.

One who will be killed, one who will rise.

So as we dig deeper, we see that these are messianic prophecies as well.

Then there are there are others that would be by way of application and illusion. In other words, we see that the death of the high priest would release the unintentional man slayer from the city of refuge.

She would then have to spend the rest of his life that he go back to family and ancestral lands in numbers 35, so this is not a prophecy about the death of the Messiah, but there's a principle that's learned from in terms of the atoning power the death of the high priest and the Messiah is our great high priest as our priestly Messiah.

So you have trues like that there other things that that have to do with what the Messiah will do and when these things will take place, so Daniel 924 to 27 lists a number of things that must take place before the second Temple was destroyed and none of those fully came to pass.

During the days of the Maccabees and their revolt against Antiochus epiphanies that they did not sees me come to pass at the juncture, but they did come to pass before the second Temple was destroyed, the Messiah died for our sins and purchased our everlasting redemption and made lasting atonement. Those things came to pass, so there were there were various levels at which we look at things.

Or for example parallels typology. As it happened to Moses. So what happens to the Messiah so just as there is the attempt to kill Moses as a baby boy this the attempt to kill the Messiah as a baby boy. Both of them will be delivers as it happened to David so what happens to the Messiah. For example, betrayed by a close friend who wants to destroy him. As it happens to Israel. So what happens to the Messiah, just as Israel went into Egypt in infancy and God calls his child, his son, Israel out of Egypt, so also Messiah in his infancy goes into Egypt and Messiah calls and God calls his Messiah, his son out of Egypt so that there are parallels that are there. There is typology as it happened, in one case so happens in another. There also messianic prophecies that are messianic because they were promises given to the house of David that never reach their fulfillment in the lives of any Davidic king. So, some have argued that Isaiah 9 was originally addressed to Hezekiah.

Speaking of his of his mighty thin God's power upon him and how he would rule in righteousness. There's even a Talmudic statement that God would have made him the Messiah, but in any case, what was spoken there as you read it. Isaiah 9, six and seven in English five and six in Hebrew with identical versus just number differently. You you see that what was written there never came to pass regarding Hezekiah's was a promise given that is yet to be fulfilled in the messianic King. So many prophecies like that the same at Isaiah 714, I would argue that it was spoken in a specific context about a birth at that time we can argue strongly was a birth to someone in the house of David, so he a a a birth to the to the king and and one of his harem girls or wives, etc. and and yet everything spoken there does not find its fulfillment. It ties in them with the prophecy in Isaiah 9, which ties in with the prophecy in Isaiah 11.

So Matthew really realizes well there's more.

This is the essence of fulfillment, bringing it to its full meaning or for example Psalm 22 is Psalm 22, a prophecy that does this prophecy.

It's a Psalm of anguish. The psalmist cries out in pain and and and David cries out in the midst of his suffering to God wife you forsaken and and and he goes through the terrible things he's experiencing and then God delivers them from the jaws of death and his deliverance is so great that stole to the ends of the earth, and people come to worship the God of Israel because of this great deliverance and yet there's nothing in David's life that goes as far as what was written in Psalm 22, nor was any deliverance he experience so great that was told to the ends of the earth. People came to the knowledge of God's word, but the Messiah the ideal right to suffer the perfect right to suffer brings it to its full meaning, and now he takes on his own lips.

Psalm 22 and he now lives this out to the full and he is literally delivered from death. I mean he actually dies and is delivered from the jaws of death itself or themselves, so this is this is how messianic prophecy is multilayered and then there are certain things plays on words like in Matthew two referencing the words of the prophets that that the Messiah would be a a Nazarene someone from Nazareth said where is that written notes prophets plural. So there different themes that weave together here and most likely play on words that the Messiah will be and that's their business that the the stump, the branch that that comes out in Isaiah 11 and net say are rhyming with Nazarene or someone from Nazareth play on words so it's it's rich and multifaceted. If you just look at it that each one is just direct the future prophecy. This will happen about the Messiah. This is a son like that somehow the Hebrew Bible is written, when rightly understood.

There is a rich tapestry, all of which points to Jesus being the Messiah of Israel, the Savior of the world.

Okay, condensed things of study for many many decades written hundreds and thousands of pages on ultimately try to make it simple useful. I hope it requires global K-1 analysis perspective here on the line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown your voice of more cultural and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown is known as detective. He is emerged as one of the most fascinating important voices in Christian apologetics today became famous versus the cold case homicide detective's newest book person of interest and what gets my attention with this book is the subtitle why Jesus still matters in the world that rejects the Bible, given for you.

I'm speaking about.

Yet it is J Warner Wallace and without further ado, Jim is great to have you back on the broadcast with us. Thanks for joining us. Well, you know, Dr. Brown, your work with such a pivotal important to me. I wrote a chapter about property.

No way I would've been able to tackle that topic. I had already purchased your book so your books are sitting in my library. I appreciate you awesome. Are you answering Jewish objections to Jesus and I'm so glad and I did see that the note that you referenced. With appreciation, so thanks so much heat beat before we dive into your book. There's a fascinating story you told me we were chatting before an apologetics conference.

You told me about your son getting involved in law enforcement and he's driving around the community, but not really seeing a lot of issues or action or problems so you got the vehicle with him and drove around the same community and pointed out all kinds of things he didn't see that's an acquired skill that you have correct so funny because you know you don't want your kids to know I could balance right between do I want my kids to know where all the dangers are and when I'm watching crimes occurring right yeah I guess you do some point. We also want to protect your kids from things and so so I was in this position were my someone pretty young start to do the job wasn't really sure what to be looking for you no one. So I got are my personal car.

We drove around we set a parking lot a huge store and I watch I showed him watch these two guys are doing and they walked in the store. They basically boosted the bait they shoplifted stuff out under their coat and they got their cars and got about the canal brought the bottle back and exchange them for cash to best overtake the always be bought or got the gift, they would take it back and give you cash or give your certificate he could use something else or whatever they were doing this with a returning stolen goods and wanting to see what that looks like right-center you ever get to sit for a while and we were playing car. Would you be hard to do if you're in a marked unit right because ABC used it but you can find a way sometimes do that.

I just wanted to see what those things look like in real time because you might just drive by that she somebody you know coming out with a big code you know admit that I think there may have a door but not carrying any bags with the deal with that right there for something I got to speak out on a lot of things you take for granted and I wanted to go see those members of the first Avenue. Why is Apollo forces once you've seen it. It's hard on see it even when you're off duty didn't necessarily want to introduce them to that, level of suspicion that you carry with you the rest your life as you are you you came to same nationally and datelined things like that because the cases that had been cold unsolved for many many years you went back and reviewed the evidence and they were able to find the, the guilty party homicides, etc. so you then take that knowledge and begin to apply it to apologetics so examining the Gospels the counts of the Gospels or evidence for creator, how did you do it in. In this particular book. What sets person of interest apart from your previous work out… Or print a wonder you cannot make a case for Jesus of Nazareth with out the information from the New Testament is know it do that. I get that but interestingly there's a lot of evidence outside of the New Testament which is dependent on the New Testament that give us insight even if every New Testament was destroyed. So for example I work a lot of these nobody murderers or you have somebody killed his wife and they get through the body and he pretend like she ran off and he reports her as a missing person be a family threat that tragically national headlines and and then you noted the letter find the body going and have good reason. But why should you believe he's dead. I had a couple of the body was never recovered. LW to make a case to the jury what number one. It is not missing. If the murderers were to hear the guy who did it.

Now how do you do that when you have no evidence from the crime take care of those days. Nobody would even take a picture was reported missing person so no one took a picture of a crime scene they never recovered a body of single piece of physical evidence. Now do we do while we tell people if, on the day she vanished. She was actually a murder. That's an explosive event and all bombs are preceded by fuses that burned toward the detonation of bombs explode their shrapnel all over the blast radius. So we make those cases we investigate those cases by simply demonstrating what happened at the fuse and what happened.

The fallout that we can tell you of a felony occurred on the day she went missing. So we did the same thing with with a person of interest to look if you had if you just for whatever reason. Imagine this world in which they successfully destroyed every New Testament's analysis is that the every absent future dystopian planet where no New Testament exists, will it turns out. If you're on planet Earth, you would have enough information from the views and fallout of history to know what why we call the first entry for example the first century what is it about Jesus of Nazareth that was so spectacular. What did people believe about him and include someone who is just a regular human being is a small insignificant Jewish sage of the first century in this corner of the Roman Empire. Could he really have this kind of if he wasn't something other than and that's what were trying to do a person of interest is to take a look at my book okays Christianity examines what in the New Testament. This book examines everything that outside… And the approach of course it is fascinating friends that the new book by J.

Juan Wallace person of interest its own five weeks.

It really has hundreds of raving positive reviews on Amazon's you do want to check it out. You know, this reminds me of a story of a of a famous ultra-Orthodox Jewish rabbi early in the 20th century, who was known for his piety and his self-sacrifice and his graciousness and there was some court cases where his testimony was being used and and someone told the judge. Somebody stole from him and he went running down the streets and you forgot to take this and the judge says does anybody believe that they don't know but who else would they tell stories about like the effects of the sky was not known for being exceptional. You wouldn't even have these exaggerated stories so I agree point he was really wise, but legends emerge right and that's what I thought as an anomaly.

Route 35.

Or became my my thinking.

I was lucky. If Jesus is something if you God.

Like they say would splash be bigger in me, the only record of this, the only people talking about the four Gospel authors give me a break to be more with their wallet because the bulk of the most part my educator growing up did not include the impact of Jesus on civilization.

It should have, but it didn't always purely ignorant of the kind of impact that means if symbiotic is just to me was remarkable and hard to deny that hard to reconcile. If you just another guy in the line of history yet exactly.

So why the movements you know it's one thing if we credit or you just internal lead Christian documents. My with these followers of Jesus die for a lie. If the euro today been so confused with hallucinations that they thought he rose and did and was still in a die for that, but the repercussions the ripple effect of of his life and death and resurrection go far beyond that and and that's the question what what caused this. What what made this happen.

So again just to look all we can do is is touch on some of the contents of the book you start with the fuse in the fog Jesus without the New Testament than the question, Jesus, the average ancient the cultural fuse, but chapters 3 Jesus the copycat Savior? The spiritual fuse when he cover their territory that you know Jesus is not at all. Ignite a real historical character somebody was made up in a long line of dying and rising Savior that all have similar attributes report artist there were guys exactly like the deity it exactly like that of course not.

As relatively true. There are some broad overarching similarities between ancient mythologies that proceed Jesus and that that the person named Jesus of Nazareth in history of the question then becomes allowed to be some similarities will it turns out I can't redo all the ancient mythologies. You can look I find like me to 15 could probably find a few more or if you last of the overarching similarities between these mythology. They are very broad and not specific so you thought you could say that yes many of them.

For example, enter into the world in a supernatural way, but the specifics of how they enter into the world is very different. One will pop out of the side of a mountain leaving a cavelike Methodist another is born out of the five another God, a Jesus, for example, of course, as part of a virgin not know why were they all be born, and some will think about it if you're thinking hard about deity, even ancient or as a modern you're going to assume assume certain attributes of deity. Like for example if God is supernatural. Would you be surprised to think that he would bite enter into the world in a supernatural way that meat is not a Micah like an unusual thought to have if you're thinking about God. To begin with and this is what I think the ancient did CS Lewis of it this way that that really the tips are are the ancient stories about God from the minds of human whereas the story of Jesus is God's myth, not meaning to say a falsehood but a story about deity that is grounded in what we call real thing. So it turns out that if God was trying to actually meet the expectation of ancients who are thinking about God because they are created in the image of God.

This is what Paul talking about in acts 17 right you people are very religious, because requesting a bunch of things are being worshiped only tell you who the real God will that's what's happening with the appearance of Jesus to turns out, all those 15 attributes, no mythology has more than maybe 10 and sometimes dispute with six of these attributes, but there is a person who arrives in history who possesses all 15 of the expectations of ancient and that is Jesus of Nazareth is the only one who possesses all 15 attributes and if you think about that for a second ideally really think that Jewish authors in the first century like St. Matthew is to craft together what he hopes Jews will accept of their Messiah.

A mythology that is grounded in built on the piecemeal kind of puzzling of ancient pagan mythologies really that's a pretty big stretch to imagine he would do that and I think the reality of it is that God is simply appearing in meeting the expectations of those of us to think deeply about God.you know it so interesting you break coming up little will come right back with the idea of constructing a myth about the virgin birth southernmost Slattery myth beat because all all that's gonna happen if is this is being taught in your lifetime is everyone's conflict.

It's just a legitimate honey. I know I wasn't with anybody else's I conceive urgently while you were at war.

This just what happened.

Right short. That's why he's accused of sexual morality and and that's why. Interestingly enough, when you study world religion or the founders of different cultures. They might even claim that they were God themselves, but they they would construct this virgin birth Ms. because it opens up the door, the accusations of immorality.

In any case, just scratching the surface. The new book they want a lawless person of interest, the right it's the line of fire with your host activist, author, international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown voice of more cultural and spiritual revolution get into the line of fire now by calling 6643 here again is Dr. Michael Brown running as friends you have, J. Warner Wallace on talking about his new book person of interest which shows demonstrates argues a strong case for why Jesus is still absolutely relevant to everyone being on the planet. Even if we didn't have the New Testament history tell us that is the case, Jim. Quick question before we go back into some of the contents of the book. I'm sure you been blessed and thrilled to see the impact your books have had. Sure you get lots of testimonies from readers who come to faith or been strengthened in the faith through your material. Obviously it's to God's glory. But what is it that seems to really help people about your material. If you were say okay this one helps eerily mention my work in Jewish apologetics is how people what is tend to hear the most is as to why your books are so helpful to others, or maybe on your part. I think are testable and that that's a big deal right on, and I'm not. I don't have a doctorate degree in cloth of your history or any of those languages are evident, but I try to do it is now II bring in experts for jury trials, and we spent weeks in front. Presenting evidence that we often present the testimony of expert related that evidence, but at the end that 10 week trial has to be summarized in a three hour closing argument, and that a rebuttal and so we have to figure out a way to take all of that data and eventually present in a way that is persuasive and and after some and I can't spend 10 weeks doing the 10 weeks of redundant 10 weeks so I don't figure out summarized in three hours and so in the end I think were trying to do is stand on the shoulders of giants and and and translate and translate difficult concepts in a way and people at the most part may not be familiar with the work of textual and Agra criticism or with the work of historians, but for the most part in watching detective shows and they have a sense about how to put a case together and if I can you show them how this is a parallel that this is a very similar we reconstruct an event from the past, even for just 40 years ago in a murder. We often have similar challenges. You might have to reconstruct the past about any ancient figure or historical figure so as such, similar parallel so I think what what we try to do is to make it kind of throw the ball in a way that people can catch it yeah and done done so very well with appreciation for many of us to begin the new book person of interest in my favorite part, the subtitle why Jesus still matters in the world that rejects the Bible that that's the reality of where we live today and so much of America being post-Christian young people not having the same back and we can't make the same assumptions so before you came on the first half-hour my broadcast today. I gave an overview of messianic prophecy so that would be chapter 4 Jesus the mistaken Messiah and then chapter 5 in the fullness of time.

Jesus arrives at the list. Let's look at chapter 6 Jesus the unfounded fiction, the dissemination fall out what you cover their yeah I think there's aspect of culture that were important to me. I was about literature and art and music in education and science areas that were important to me as a nonbeliever but that person literature is so dominated by Jesus. He had no one been written about no inter-historical character has been written about more than Jesus of Nazareth and is not even close to the second-place finisher. Now that we've got all kinds of conversations are recorded on ancient documents in the first 300 years of the Christian history now and I picked up 300 years because you think about it. I don't think Lalit by the time Rome takes over anything.

Don't… Power corrupts and doesn't know the government can corrupt certain principles that can change the story… Go before any of that occurred before that, the, the edict of Milan of the unit of the Thessalonica village. Those documents are written by that, but we called anti-Nicene fathers, and by all of the non-Christian. Either they be Greek or Roman or Persian or Egyptian or Jewish, who wrote about Jesus, their voices, or they said something about Jesus, and their voices got recorded on ancient manuscripts. It turns out that there are more non-Christian voices recorded in antiquity about saying something about Jesus there actually are Christian voices saying something about Jesus, especially if you include, for example, the all the noncanonical authors. The Gnostics that the people who were not Christians that were identified at the time by the church fathers as non-Christian, who had something to say is a contract to co-opt the story of Jesus for their own purposes. While it turns out that you can reconstruct the truth about Jesus from Allied business is often true right because I was, I compare the book to the stories that have been written about Elvis again, and only about 40 years that the legends related to Elvis have been written over and over and over again all kinds of rabbit trails, but all of them assume the true narrative of the boy who grew up and became one of the most successful recording artist of all time so they they stand on those truths as they rabbit trail off into my stable yet. He spent the night in Memphis. What we can rectify records of spending the night meant that the Dell site and he was sleeping with us this this rockstar will that part of the lie, but it turns out you noted how the law you had to say something that was true. He did spend that night and so it with the same kind of thing happens with Jesus.

They will tell many lies the ancients because they pay a black one reason or another to defame or to twist Jesus in their own purpose, but they have to stand on truth claims in order to help align and from those those lies you can reconstruct truth related Jesus what they say in common about Jesus before they take on their own particular life that we try to do that chapter and even the idea people talk about will lost books of the Bible or there is an original Christianity has been hidden from us in and look you have to look at these other gospels, and these other accounts and at any given week, we can give strong historical reasons why we reject these other books is such as quote the Gnostic Gospels. But the question is why was everybody talking about the sky. What is so amazing and exceptional and and how is it look if when Jesus was accused of driving out demons and healing the sick by the power of Satan.

I was asked the question why was he accused of doing that and the answer is because he was doing. He was actually give us a contrive had demons. That's what I had to concoct an explanation. If Elvis just grew up as some unknown kid indicts among the guys somewhere you wouldn't have all the legends and of course the Elvis legends are trillions of the Jesus life in center-right and so just a technical appointment going to wait at the same time that Elvis was out there in Memphis and Nashville and doing having his career.

There were lots of other struggling singers got recorded yet there there been hundreds of books written about Elvis and what one or two are none of some of these other contemporary why is that because Elvis was something different. He stood out in a way and achieve something that the others didn't want a similar way you look. There I met volitional act, whichever the book just talk about how many other people in history claim to be the Jewish Messiah and there are number over the 12th-century and and if you look at them you don't know that yet no one even knows those names if they could pipe at that list apart but go. A lot of people will because they didn't have the kind of impact that this man who claimed to be the Jewish Messiah did and I think it people even realize that most of the things they love are deeply indebted to the worldview, inaugurated by Jesus of Nazareth, they might look at him differently and that's what were trying to do with a book like this is to show just how remarkable and beautiful.

Jesus really is and that's why he had that kind of impact on the arts, literature and music and science and education and even other world religions that are not Christian.

Hat tip Jesus in some way because they embody and I'm assuming a just just want to get this said, anyway, that you would say absolutely you wrote this book not just a string to the faith of Christians but to help those that are outside the faith that was is accessible to them. You you've got a relative that is an atheist, or someone that thinks New Testament with this just another religious book. This book is written in such a way that it's not full of Christianity's skin be accessible for for them correct, yet still writing a lot of it from my own perspective is donated by a present. Why don't you BC and A.D. designations until the last chapter, because for most the time I was actually doing this investigation as a 35-year-old detective II was not a believer and so I never would've. I would've been brought more than happy with that.

The BC for BCE and the CE backing out designations of history. That's how I saw history. It was not the common era, but before Jesus about that to me seem like a relevant with but with the partners that we are into a new era. What causes the new era to begin why we call this the first century, when of course it wasn't the first century, in which humans lived in recorded history. We will call it that for a reason.

And why do we do that because everything starts a new and by the way, literature and music and science and education explode after Jesus there is something new happening in history the first century because God enters into his creation and everything changed yet again. Some of this covered in Jesus. The jury DDD imagination file chapter Jesus the illiterate?

The education for Jesus.

The sign style?

The explanation fought so I'm just friends.

Either you say what we want to get into this, we have limited time so get the book K-1 Wallace person of interest why Jesus still matters in the world that rejects the Bible hey Jim keep doing the great work you helping a lot of people want standing on your shoulder library. Thanks so much, will that's that's very kind of us men great talking to you all right yeah I know I love to with all the interviews that he's doing the enthusiasm zero I was appreciate that with authors that they they love the content of the work to do in hey, great talking with you and yeah I was I was blessed when when we interacted about having him on the show that he pointed out that that he felt the work to be done. Jewish apologetics was the best you'd seen with messianic prophecy. So glad to make our contribution. We have our unique journeys. Jim as a detective right atheist detective Cole case homicide detective is the same investigative skills to lead into the truth, the gospel me as a Jewish believer confronted by the rabbis and challenged and as we studied and learned and again our faith became his case real for the first time in my right friends really catching up a lot of stuff happening in the world around us licks broadcast.

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