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Janet - Mefferd - Today - Batya Ungar-Sargon (Bad News) Greg Jantz (Suicide)

Janet Mefferd Today / Janet Mefferd
The Cross Radio
November 17, 2021 4:00 am

Janet - Mefferd - Today - Batya Ungar-Sargon (Bad News) Greg Jantz (Suicide)

Janet Mefferd Today / Janet Mefferd

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November 17, 2021 4:00 am

How did journalists become the affluent, ideological mouthpiece of Wokeness, and how are they undermining democracy? I'll talk about it with Batya Ungar-Sargon, deputy opinion editor at Newsweek and author of the book, "Bad News." Plus: Dr. Gregory Jantz , founder of The Center: A Place of Hope, discusses his book: "So Much to Live For: How to Provide Help and Hope to Someone Considering Suicide." That's next time on Wednesday's JANET MEFFERD TODAY.

What's Right What's Left
Pastor Ernie Sanders
What's Right What's Left
Pastor Ernie Sanders
Truth For a New Generation
Alex McFarland

This archived broadcast of Janet Mefford today is brought to you by Hartford, Lebanon, God is using hard for Lebanon to bring practical assistance and the gospel to the stricken refugee families in Lebanon for a gift of $116 you can give a child in his family survival essentials for four months and the hope of Jesus Christ which lasts forever. Call now 888-247-5499 888-247-5499 there's a banner to, our confidence is in Christ alone, I sort of know you so much for joining us and last year New York Times opinion editor and columnist Barry Y sent shockwaves to journalistic circles and beyond when she resigned her post through a letter that made some critical points about the decline of American journalism. She said that the lessons following the election of Donald Trump should have been about the importance of understanding other Americans. The necessity of resisting tribalism and the centrality of the free exchange of ideas to a democratic society. Instead, she wrote a new consensus has emerged in the press.

The truth is in the process of collective discovery but in orthodoxy already known to an enlightened few whose job is to inform everyone else and Weiss also added the paper of record is more and more the record of those living in a distant galaxy, one whose concerns are profoundly removed on the lives of most people. Well, she saw the problem clearly in my next guest also sees the problems within our woke media and explains how journalism got to this point in her new book by John Garst. Argon is the deputy opinion editor at Newsweek and author of the new book called bad news. How woke media is undermining democracy batch. It's great to have you with us. Thank you so much for being here me well. I appreciate your book very much because I was a newspaper woman myself and I worked in newsrooms for a number of years as a reporter and editor I have to say, I wondered this for years. We were taught journalists are supposed to be objective and fair and report both sides of a story.

Now it seems being woke is a requirement to job description as it were to be a journalist, which is not I would say universally true, necessarily, but what happened to journalism as it supposed to be executed out in the public square, on behalf of the readers are in my back looks like it's about rate actually about lack what happened to journalism wide over the course of the 20th century journalist went from being basically working-class with the blue-collar trade and now today journalists are part of the American elite.

You think back to 1937 he did a survey of all of the highest-ranking journalist in America. The Washington cohort) half of them had a college degree at 11 have even gone to high school boy today in 2015 they did another survey found that 92% of journalist had a college degree. Now, compared to just 36% of Americans right they have a college degree, they increasingly come from the absolute elite of universities in your time, the Wall Street Journal, the Washington Post and MPR only cake interns from the top 1% of universities in their own land you know Gerard used to be a job at page sort of like being a cop journalist there in the top 10% and my argument my pocket journalist became much more coastal much more educated much more liberal and much more land woke they brought the very extreme IDX from the University into the newsroom like them and now they are centrally policing anybody who disagrees out of their newsroom. Yeah, you're right about that.

What was it that happens. I mean, I can think of a few significant points that occurred over the years that brought journalism to where it is right now you talk about a lot of this in your book, but can you trace it for us a little bit how this shift took place from having people who were basically more Brooke blue-collar working in newsrooms to these elitists who seem to dominate the profession now.

One of them wife for example hello okay be you. Most Americans got their news from newspapers and night when I was the first year that the majority of Americans that they were getting their news from television.

Now if you're going on TV you're getting a very immediate version of the new dragger getting moving pictures are getting audio right so you have to bring something new to the table to shift from being scripted to be more interpretive right you get a better friend to interpret for you, which meant that you be able to be able to write one paragraph and interpret The collecting for people with a college degree. And when people with a college degree 30 coming journalist would know you know they fled by paper of more people you hire degree higher caliber right because there's always that how markets work really really jumpstarted. This was done all the private and plan right what Woodward and Bernstein being immortalized in Hollywood. Journal of the mind from being the muckraking job for being something that had a lot of glands are associated with it right. They brought down this very unpopular president. They were represented by the like talk in this movie. Right. Only people who like at Harvard were working on the Harvard Crimson harbor get the people you like, who like to play and he would never dreamed of becoming a journalist right. It was a high-class high-caliber job.

He went on became how well it kind of people right from the oblique. They really started journalism as a worthy or the profession worthy of their plan and add more and more. You know elite people started becoming more elite people by applying in the print got even more morally good. The digital age with white on steroids so that you know the really it is destroyed little local news local news is really the last place where you could really find you know people you have a college degree doing the job in teaching the younger generation because most 5% of journalism jobs on the call, you know, there are increasingly peopled by only live broth and every generation is more and more extreme, and it is enough to where right now everything I say use the word woke up with the work from sociologists because they noticed is that white liberals now their views on race are further to the left than black American female American and not those are the people who are now seeing and dominating American user while you're right on the money. I think about everything you just said and one of the points you made about the Watergate era I think is so significant because I have read and I experience this to the generation that was very much influenced by all the Presidents men Woodward and Bernstein in that era that led did it not to a lot of people going into journalism because they wanted to be activists.

They wanted to be able to have that kind of power you because you think about journalism largely you would have your byline there, but a lot of people would never pay attention to the byline. All of a sudden it seem like journalist could be stars and that got a lot of people into the profession.

Driving out, it would seem a lot of other people from a blue-collar background who might not be of that ilk do you see that trend when you are looking at all the evidence leading up to the era were now absolutely slightly more liberal than American. That large left alleged that you no more likely to be pro-choice and pro-life, and so forth. But you, when most of the newspaper where you know in the heartland across the country weren't no small American town that had one newspaper right you would handle the more liberal they would always have pro little guy outlet Outlook but their bodies would be the owner of the region are both right.

They would be pulling everything back to the factor because if you veer too far to the left you by 50% of your reader no longer anymore. You know that you're not going to make a big name for themselves and really have been benefiting from last divide in America by docketing any quality to get our economy is working really well for people and knowledge industry.

Jonathan people have that elite education and that's why you're seeing a lot of that white light increasingly are talking about things like weight because they don't want to talk about the cost that I they have benefited from. So these media leads as you point out now believe the only inequality that matters is racial inequality. That's with it is boiled down to now the real court. There are areas where we struggle with them in America.

Of course right here. For example, police reality is something that impact black Americans disproportionately urgency here. We should all be talking about that. The real problem is you know when Pres. Trump pushed the first step back through right and released 5000 black men from prison woke being a good American you know I go to police reform bill that will be invoked. That would be a good American conscience is important issue is what you think from the police, which is something that anyone percent of all is right went white diversity content ideas about real inequality with income equality you want to pick up on this when we come back from the break badge on Garside on with us will be back this is Janet math or turbine league international Esther is 17 years old and part of the Maasai tribe in Kenya Africa. Like many of her age and gender. Esther was subjected to practices not taught in the Bible. One is arranged marriage where a woman is forced to marry someone she doesn't know the other is female circumcision done out of superstitious belief with no known health benefits. Esther lived with bitter unforgiveness until finally volunteer introduced her to Jesus. Now she's let her husband to Christ and she seen 60 young women come to them race the hope of the gospel, but Bibles are scarce in this part of Kenya so please join by believe in sending God's word to Bible's believers in Africa and around the world for only $5.20 vitals costs $100 most generous gift by calling 800 yes word 800 YESWORD 800-937-9673 for there is a vitally manner to play Janet hi this is Janet Matt for for pre-born Candace talks about finding out she was pregnant. Thankfully, and ultrasound provided by pre-born allowed her to hear her baby's heartbeat sonogram sealed the deal for me baby was like this tiny little spectrum of hope. I saw his heart beating on the screen and knowing that there's life growing inside me sonogram changed my life.

I went from just Candace to mom thinking everybody that is given these gifts, you guys are giving more than money. You guys are giving love, which you make a leadership gift and sponsor a machine today.

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It's called bad news by badge on Garside on she is the deputy opinion editor at Newsweek and we were discussing this problem of woke this in the media how we got here, and this point that you're making about you and your book that will openness in the media is more about class than it is about race. You know when were talking about what's going on with these white elite liberals by and large, going further to the left than me.

Even a lot of black Americans who are their readers might go. How is this benefiting them is, is this increasing their circulation numbers or is this just virtue signaling, by and large for their friends on Twitter.I went out and I wanted when I was writing. I know that black Americans are not well, you know, I know that Latino Americans are not woke, I know that you know that most of the liberals I know are not well known working-class American no matter who they vote for our woke that not liberal outlets turned woke but the market come from.

When you know Matt is of American I got totally not into this and we want to be busy for a bit and make a profit is doing the same thing out of the question that I wanted to answer what I found that no with digital media. What happened with the Internet when all these big legacy publications like that you like in your time. We are Washington, and PRN in the Atlantic and box and the Republic all be out each have their own audience that they were catering to lick their own house style in their own perspective that going for this game. 67 8 million highly educated, affluent coastal liberals. They are all going for that now, because everything is nationalized right because digital media you can you know everything about the reader know where you're coming to you from you know what would make them click. You know what would make him stand. Like I can tell you Janet work digital media. I know exactly how long people are everything but we are staying on an article I know what words again make them close that browser. I know how much money my readers make me know them and what with all the publication switched from measuring success in terms of mass circulation, measuring in terms of engagement who comment on your article on Facebook share on Twitter how many impressions online and that's what you're now selling to advertiser when you measure you're always going to be catering to the most extreme because the most extreme people are only about a stray right screws and another problem now that really bugs me every time I see this. It was so ingrained into us in journalism school that your opinion doesn't matter unless you're writing an opinion piece and that your job or your colonists. Your opinion is to not even be discerned by the reader whose reading what you're reporting on your job is to get site a and site B if it's something controversy all and tell what's going on into the public service of actually reporting the news. Now you have journalists going out on Twitter and making it as clear as day where they stand on every single issue, especially when it comes to woke this does not compromise the entire enterprise of journalism. Why even stay in business. You're not a journalist anymore.

If you're to be doing that you're violating the ethics of learning and nearing of people that deliberately don't agree with. Coming from the left, I just could not understand how my fellow left knee what they were finding nearing working-class American people who quit the law by every metric that they had one by right there were the millions of dollars in your calling everything a person who voted for Donald Trump race and all the people without a college degree of black American working class people you know you can bring nearing of the faithful, like the people in these liberal enclaves delete enclaves who are right you are living well, justifying their contempt for people who are struggling. People were committing death parents who if I could bring along an integral part of American society. That's why I wrote this book, you know, yeah, you're right about that is this helping them though because they think I know that they're basically catering like you mentioned before to their elitist friends in the same several million people who were in that kind of upper-class sector but is there some point at which this is going to backfire on them spectacularly at the voting booth because you see what happened just recently in Virginia and the school boards where the parents are showing up in their so angry about the woke this in the schools. You can only deride them. It would seem and insult them so long before they will turn to two and say I want nothing to do with the New York Times. I don't care about the Washington Post and the corporate ownership part of it. It seems also as part of the equation. I realize that's kind of a two-pronged question there, but what about those two angles what what about the working class really at the end of the day being important for them.

Do they care about them at all and will this turn in another direction.

Do you think the country journalism. The abandonment of the working class within your time Vino in 1899, you know, it really two models of journalism.

I start the book with the populace model of people really going for that mass circulation working-class reader and kind model which was all about catering to the elite and the aspirational elite. Now that your time and mileage of totally wine in the mainstream liberal media you still be conservative media catering to the working class.

You know III have pocketed on one screen and another screen everything all day all day long and the difference between them is not about race and class, whether they're picturing a viewer like the college degree that that you see I like profitable. The first started you don't naturally started to reward knowledge, industry.though journalists are more affluent the market is rewarded them for doing that is rewarded college professor than other end and colder than people who are in need job meritocratic job right that requiring elite education and income to look down on people who don't have that our economy does not work for the working class anymore is my view because I thought of the socialist think that the government should be working for the working class. But you know it much in the way that I think Pres. Trump economy was working for the working class in ways that were quietly though, so if the ground and profitable because if you can convince your advertiser that your readers are all affluent may charge more for now you can fill in the ascription basement of the Scripture mild in your time than others are using you're getting me affluent liberal to come to you expecting a certain kind of thing right and they're willing to pay a premium price for that because they feel flattered by what they read in your PJs you're only going to double down on that right your indicator to that weird thing with the Kyle right now cover what you're seeing with the lack of coverage of inflation is what you're seeing right beyond him coverage which was they were basically like all the people voted for my wife that's true, but because that's what affluent white liberals want to read in the New York Times right like NASA viewed a therapeutic conflict back in my with the conservative you have a real opportunity here you a opportunity to just be normal Republican Party will not do the opening the lid off right. They would just not leading into the same thing of the anti-woke from the right, which is just a mirror image of walking on the left and just backed working-class people show up in the black community explained that you know school choice within their best interest. Like the time to cultivate those relationships to develop an agenda grant dignity to working-class Americans.

I really feel like it could be it could be huge that that's not what I want to be well right and when you're dividing the country.

In this way by saying whites no benefit from this and that and their supremacists and they're all racist and even if they deny it. It doesn't make any difference you can never win and and I think there's that component to, but it is about class. I think you're really right in your premise here that it really is about class more than it is about race what you think the future holds about you. Do you think that there is a way to turn things around in journalism or were you working at Newsweek.

Obviously there other people who are like-minded in journalistic circles.

Although it is frustrating when you're thinking the way you do in a wool culture.

I guess what what what do you think can be done to save journalism. If anything, no new pew study that came out last week and only 6% of Americans identify as progressive and only six per kind of black American identify progressive the whole house of cards out of the car to come down. I think Americans are too smart for that. They, I think there's a huge consumer boycott of the news happening right now and you know the most important thing we can do is we learn what it means to be American to love and respect our fellow Americans who disagree with that and not let people make money off of making our fellow Americans that affect how we were that's that's good I think that's important. Do you see things like the resignation of Barry Weiss and those kinds of moments being importance as kind of a corrector toward what's going on in the newsrooms do think that has much of an effect when those kinds of things happen why you know it even better corrected no inviting me on.

It was great was great. I think people I figure that I think we think working for a shift back to back to a more normal way of talking.

Everything that hopefully you having people about class tomorrow, which is really what I want to see yeah you to do.

But although Brian seltzer. I'm not really sure will invite you back after you made so much sense to lease or in the long run, but I think that was great that she went though because you're reaching an audience that you might not of reached otherwise. And that's fantastic.

Now I think that's great.

And you know it really comes down to the fact that America is such a great nation because we are different from one another and yet were e pluribus unum. At least that's how we used to be, and we need to be that way again awoke, this just doesn't do the job. This is just such a good read the name of the book is bad news.

How will the media is undermining democracy by Boettcher Unger start on from Newsweek so good to talk to you but you keep up the good work.

I really enjoyed your book okay you to take care your listening to Janet today will be this archived broadcast of Janet today is brought to you by Hartford, Lebanon, God is using hard for Lebanon to bring practical assistance and the gospel to the stricken refugee families in Lebanon for a gift of $116 you can give a child in his family survival essentials for four months and the hope of Jesus Christ which lasts forever. Call now 888-247-5499 888-247-5499 there's a banner to

Here's your host Joe welcome back.

How much impact to the pandemic lockdowns and subsequent ramifications have on this suicide rate in America last year, while recent CDC data for 2020 shows an alarming increase in the suicide rates for all groups of younger Americans between the ages of 10 and 34, the rate of suicide went up 5% in 2020, among 25 to 34-year-olds.

This is absolutely tragic and horrifying to consider that anybody would consider or carry out a suicide, but it is especially horrendous to see this trend among young people who have their whole lives ahead of them. If you know someone who is considering suicide. The question is what you do about it and how can we give suicidal people the hope that comes only through Jesus Christ, author and speaker Dr. Gregory Jantz joins us today to talk about it. He is the founder of the center, a place of hope and his new book is so much to live for, how to provide help and hope to someone considering suicide. Great.

It's great to have you back. How are you today I am alive and well in a difficult popular technology even to say the word suicide is not a topic I thought I was going to ever write about until I saw what was going on.

Yes, what are your thoughts because that's been in the news quite a bit lately, suicide rates, and especially when you consider these statistics on younger Americans my heavens.

It's horrible. It is another one. It's difficult to look at the reality of it.

But right now about age 12, Janet age 17 that age range, suicide is the second leading cause of really and so that our young people for their there at high risk last year of the whole virtual school thing failed terribly. We had the highest academic failure ever so we've got kids that didn't do well academically.

They were isolated and all the social rules of trade so it's been a very confusing time for our youth. Plus diction addiction is dropping to younger ages and we need to look at that. That's interesting that when you say that suicide became the second leading cause of death among ages 12 to 17. What was it before. Was it fifth, sixth, I mean how far down was it prior to the pandemic will double check, but it was nowhere near the top, not an age group. We were concerned about as a relates to suicide, but as social media really grow groups, the primary vector faults connector for our youth. We began to see a pattern of suicide we began to see oil. How is social media influencing this and for some, you know, there could be cyber bullying betrayal. There's a lot that's wrapped into what's happening to kids in social media also. It's just to say on this for moments when you're looking at your child who might be between the ages of 12 and 17. What you do to mitigate that you might not even recognize that your child is feeling sad or feeling bullied or what have you. How in the world do you navigate that and it is interesting is to try to navigate anywhere yes sicko that you know the kids a lot of times they give one word answers. How are you today finds how school fine to engage them well-prepared look times to be really tricky, but here's a few things to look for this vague disconnect from their normal peer group socially. Do you see them on hundred percent of the time walking around your butt and their disconnecting from you and family were usually there would be a connection are they so isolating that there is no not leaving the room we see maybe some hygiene issues that they're not taking good care of their hygiene things that they normally cared about you not seeing that and are they potentially really struggling in school or academic socially we do start to add up the points of the struggle what's so important is we keep the communication going on our part.

That's because those are all good things to look for is that is normal teen behavior. I think at times, but when you're putting it all together. It can be something that you can really pay attention to and see that there's a bigger problem and this is where you kinda talk about the importance of the family and click people who are close to not just a child but close to anybody who might be considering suicide.

How important is it for multiple people to maybe be in the loop and paying attention to these things, you know, we really do want multiple people for one person to look at this or one person in a parent or loved one to come to be carrying the whole thing about talking about it. I think that's where we potentially could have regret.

So we want to engage others, plus it's really important that we at some point ask have you ever thought of arming yourself for tell me what's going on.

Have you ever thought about killing yourself. The have both with things get severe to have those conversations actually could be a part of throwing them a life ring really important.

Bringing up suicide does not give them ideas but sometimes opening up that door is very important because now we can start to get some help may be needed so pretty there's a lot of prayer for wisdom here.

Praying for wisdom, but don't be afraid to speak up.

Well that's excellent who is most at risk. I mean we're talking about younger Americans because of the CDC numbers.

But overall, who is at the most risk for suicide. Statistically well we know there's another age group were very concerned about happens to be a man, approximately age 50 and above the were seeing more men in this age category who were taking their lives is maybe some things we've all been through the last couple of years maybe feeling like a failure.

I can't take it anymore. So the burdens feel so great that it kind of move the person over to that despair. And when you feel despair is when you feel like I don't have any option and we lose our ability to think clearly. We become very irrational. We also know that alcohol consumption is way up in this age categories so we've seen and we've seen here at the center of quite a few folks coming in who were working from home and they started drinking during the workday. I think of a situation with some IT professionals know that well. I started drinking about 4 o'clock and then later as time went along well.

I started drinking around one in the afternoon, basically working from home and drinking alcohol. Alcohol sales are at all-time highs all go consumption is very high and this is something were concerned about how that factors into the feeling of despair is terrible.

Do most people if you I don't know what the info says about this of the research says about this but I'm just curious when you're talking about being worried about somebody who might be suicidal and just being honest in saying have you ever thought about harming yourself.

Do you have any suicidal thoughts. Is it the case that people her feeling suicidal will normally admit it or they try to hide it. What is the normal response of the typical response from somebody do they usually want to talk about suicide is again. I guess my basic question usually want to talk about the pain and there's times were a person may responded and usually do. Respondent in a direction that allows us to do the conversation so they may say John is really afraid about what I'm going to do and then I'm good at what he is thinking about doing thought about harming herself, so we really want to begin that dialogue now. It's so important that when we see the conversation going that way and also say hey I want to be a part of getting you some help. Can I do that for you.

This is where we want to involve others and working to ask for for some time let me have it a day here with that be all right with you, will you keep yourself safe from working to work on getting some help and and really getting their agreement. Most of the time this kind of dialogue is really important and and people who are struggling will usually give you time all that's good to know because for a lot of people. They think that this is the untouchable subject, even if they have suspicions that somebody might be on the verge. They don't want to make it worse by talking about it, but you've given some really good tips here were to dive into more of them. When we come back from the break so much to live for the book by Dr. Gregory chances with us and will come back after this. For those of us who live in America. It may be hard to believe but there are people in the country of Lebanon who have never heard about Jesus. That's exactly why hard for Lebanon is there working in the nation that home to more than 2 million Syrian refugee families who have arrived there to escape civil war and terrorism but every day hard for Lebanon is they are reaching out to these needy families in Jesus name telling them about him, and providing food, Christian education and survival essentials in the Lord is changing their lives. Let me tell you about one of those refugees anything who is 10 years old she lost her mother when she was just a toddler, but hard for Lebanon met her as they were delivering food portions to her family with no opportunity for formal education and Eva wakes her father up early in the morning when hard for Lebanon's educational fund truck is scheduled to arrive recently during a skit about God's love honey for placed her faith and trust in Jesus for salvation. And now, because her father is illiterate. She's reading the Bible to him each evening. This family, although currently living in very tough times is slowly starting to realize the hope that only comes through Jesus Christ and the hope that only reaches them because people like you give to get the gospel to them. Your single investment of just $116 help someone like and Eva and her family with supplies needed to survive the next four months and the hope of the gospel which lasts forever. Perhaps you could help a family like this for an entire year by joining our whole provider team at just $29 a month. Whatever you can do please call now 888-247-5499.

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Please call now the number is 888-247-5499 that number again 888-247-5499. Thank you and God bless you for your generosity. You're listening to Dr. Gregory chances to ITS founder of the center, a place of hope in his book is called so much to live for, how to provide help and hope to someone considering suicide.

One of the things you also tackle in the book.

Greg is some of the myths and the misconceptions people have about suicide. Normally it's not always mental illness and mental illness. Driving this is that correct right so we don't think in terms of the oldest person is mentally ill but we may want to look at this in a little different light person probably is become overwhelmed. The coping mechanism for Pat are working, they probably feel very disconnected and here's what's really important.

They probably feel really unlovable, or unworthy, and if there struggling in a relationship with God. They may feel like will God could love me. And so when you feel like you're unlovable, you end up feeling like you don't have any value and it's like then this apathy.

Oh, I don't care about my life. I don't care about living because it really doesn't matter were seen way too many folks cut in that apathy and that despair about their future needs isn't the case. I've heard it said a number of times throughout the years that it is instead people want to die. It's that they don't want to feel what they're feeling in terms of their pain. Is that typical that most of them really don't want to die would really appreciate somebody coming along and trying to get them help so well said Janet, thank you because one of the things that they do is I can't tolerate this pain anymore. I don't see any other option. Most the time a person ends up suicidal and the right now it's about every 11 to 13 seconds somebody in our country fixed a lot so it happening all the time and we all know, maybe somebody or have a family member or ever friend or loved one.

So most of us have been touched by knowing somebody who's committed suicide in the ripple effect that is very dramatic so but a person does what relief they can't handle anymore. They lose the rational thinking and if we alcohol or drugs, we increase the probability that they're going to act on something. Okay so when you're talking about red flags you have a section in your book on the red flags to watch for some people may know some of some of these but what would be the most important red flags to keep an eye on in general. For someone who might be considering committing suicide quote. There's one red flag. We probably need to mention per person who's really been caught playing suicide and they make that decision and you've seen them struggle and struggle and struggle maybe with depression under, and now all of a sudden they seem like they're okay and and they seem like almost like a borderline joyful like what just happened so often when a person is odd as it sounds.

But what a person makes a decision to take their life there is a relief. They have a plan they're not telling us.

Of course they seem like the relieved and we may misinterpret that everything's okay. It's right. Is there an easy way or away at all to distinguish between the release that they've decided to kill themselves and release that they feel better how you even tell you I think the relief they make the decision. We seem pretty drastic like all of a sudden they seem like well what happened there. Okay, yeah, and they're not as a person really is getting better.

It's a more gradual process usually with they may feel some relief because of their talking about it there's somebody helping their getting to maybe some of the core issues they may be dealing with some of the trauma that brought them there and so there may be that relief, but that's usually more gradual. The person doesn't suddenly feel like everything okay yes that's good advice. Actually that's very good advice. The suddenness versus the gradual healing.

What about the really the downward spiral. That's what you call it in the book of suicide, how it plays out.

You talk about issues like the person feeling disappointment and discouragement in the later stages. It turns to things like depression and despair. Is there any point in that process. Greg where it's too late to intervene in too late to save someone's life. That sounds kinda cold but just out of curiosity, is a you should you catch it in on the earlier you catch it the better obviously. But what about in those later stages, is it harder to turn that person back from what he's considering doing the later status where they've done a lot of contemplation. They're probably spending a lot of time in contemplation because it's really not the decision they want to make maybe there deep into thinking that maybe there try to figure out how what I do it, but they really really don't want to do it.

Yes, people who have survived this suicide attempt will describe the I didn't know what else to do and and most of them know. I know this is the answer, but I'm so overwhelmed I don't know what else to do and that's that's where you get so disconnected from reality. It's never too late to save a life and really it was some situations that I saw that were so so caught my attention and just so spoke to me that I go. We need this, we have the capacity to save lives and I want to get the word out. Well, there's hope you got a lot of time give us the time we need to help you put together a hope plan speak that's important.

I like to that you have within the chapter here on a descent into darkness. You talk about the seven powerful promises to battle the downward spiral.

And there are seven scriptural promises here that you offer. One. One of my favorite verses. First Peter 57 cast all your anxiety upon him because he cares for you. You know Scripture can cut through the heart in a way that mere talking can't.

As Christians, when were dealing with somebody who might be considering suicide.

How do you take the word of God and apply it to that person's life in an effective way. Well, we that's exactly what we want to do and sort of number one pray with and pray that you will give words that represent truth and comfort, so when a person feels like you're suicidal. They don't. We don't want to be preaching to them but we want to give them the truth of God's word and this is where we oftentimes were asking for some time were asking can I help explain some of this and spend some time with you for always looking for time, there can be a revelation of truth. We also edit and my position as I'm going to pray and ask the Holy Spirit, God spirit to work in their lives for their receptive so that their receptive to new information and really receptive to God working in their life. So it's it's a balance between we can't be too pushy because it already know about.

And so, but we want to speak truth and the truth of God's word is powerful and that can be an anchor of hope. Yes, well, to know that God cares about you and God cares about your life. You matter to him. You don't just matter to the people around you, and I would imagine there are four a lot of people they've never heard that before. There plenty of people out there who've never heard the gospel and have never read the Bible that would be an encouragement to say the one who made you, doesn't want you to do this, don't do this right needle arts reimburse, which is one of the verse seven versus the truth versus Jeremiah 2911 talks about that you have a future and a hope.

In fact, when you come to our main doors that verses on the wall.

We want everybody to know that there's hope in God has a plan want to be a part of of helping with the plan, but when you're in despair. You don't see a future with the hope and that's why we do it good as you walk through the despair working to be with you but that despair your to come out on the other side of that and I don't always know what God to do in their life, but it's always good's. That's right, you know you do some tips here. People can read in your book about stepping in and speaking up at one of the things that I think is so significant as being there just being there that the person doesn't feel alone, even if it takes a while to get back to you coming out of the crisis and stepping toward getting well. Having somebody by your side is a big deal because for a lot of people feeling alone is the worst of it is an episode to be with them and I just physically around and be careful that we don't were not trying to get answers to everything because if you're suicidal at times.

You really need somebody to listen and not to give you all the quick answers you need to have a sense that you are valued and loved and cared about and so that listing here is really powerful and that's one of the things that we all can do for somebody excellence well such good advice.

So much to live for is the name of the book by my guess Dr. Gregory Janssen.

You can find out more at the website a place of Always good to talk to. Thank you so much for being with us and thank you for your wisdom I really appreciate it good to be with all right take care and God bless and God bless you too. Thanks a lot for listening to Jennifer today will see next