Holding on to Hope During Separation (Part 1 of 2)

I was convinced that nothing can change what was going on in our marriage and I want to try anymore but my commitment to God, help me try one more time. We went to a hope restored marriage intensive and it was life changing. The counselors created the safest environment we could imagine so that let us really talk one a much different course now I believe we received a miracle that week receive your free consultation.

Hope restored.com Dr. Chapman for the person who's in the midst of separation or on the brink of divorce, perhaps only in their heart. You never know what is one piece of advice you give them to implement today to reverse that course, Jim. I think one of the first things I would say is that I'm empathetic with the pain that brings you to the place where you feel like it. I think summer condemning of people who are at that point, maybe because I've never been there but I know in my own marriage in the early years what it feels like that is not all work out that we wish and I got married that we made a big mistake in the first place is very empathetic with that person at the same time, I would say that person you know I've been working with couples at this juncture for over 35 years now and I've seen many people including all marriage who have come from that point of desperation to have the marriage they really only when they got married. There is hope and often say to them in my office. I can understand that you have no hope for your marriage. I can see that I can feel that what I have hope for your marriage. So why don't you go home. I hope for a while… See what can happen so that's the basic approach because they have to make a fundamental decision am I willing to work on the marriage.

I never asked people do you want to work on the marriage because that's a desire that's an emotion.

And I don't want to work on the marriage, many of them.

They don't have the energy to work on the right side. I don't ever ask you want to work on the marriage. I asked will you work on the marriage action or you will you are you willing to work with me your work with any other counsel you are you willing to work on the marriage because if you're willing. Then there's real hope will if you're willing, then you'll find that kind of hope and encouragement from Dr. Gary Chapman on today's Focus on the Family radio program hosted by our president and author Jim Daly I'm John Fuller and this really is a program Jim. That should throw out a lifeline in some respect to couples who think it's over it's done John a it's a good way to put it because there are many many couples in the Christian community and outside the Christian community that need perspective and that's what we want to provide today and it is really good to have certainly one of my favorite guests here Focus on the Family Dr. Gary Chapman with this before we do a formal introduction here. Focus on the Family this is our core mission to strengthen marriages. When you look at it when we look at the issues that we face here the people writing in about of the top five.

Three of the top five are about marriage and infidelity in marriage finances in the marriage things that are breaking down the conflict in marriage. That's number one. Really. Not just simple conflict in our marriage so it's happening in for us to stick our head in the sand and think that Christians don't deal with these issues is wrong and we want to supply people the tools to do better and I think the Lord is honored by that and I hope you feel that you know good communication is an attribute to our love in Christ and his love for us. So that's what we want to hit today. In fact, I want to share from a recent caller will call her Mrs. G Hua called to tell us that she had reached a point where her bags were packed think that Gary, her bags are packed and she was waiting for the right time to leave her marriage of 32 years. You think you're over the hump.

After seven years or 10 years now this woman 32 years under marriages think I'm a leaf as she continued to say that her husband travels extensively and called his wife from the road.

Ask her to listen to a Focus on the Family broadcast that he had just heard Mr. G. Told her that as he listened.

He realized the message was describing him that the Lord touched his heart and showed him that he has been prioritizing many other things in life at the expense of his own marriage. Mrs. G said that she could feel a change in her husband when what you're saying Gary as he was talking to her, which is an answer to years of prayer and as she was so excited about the possibility that their relationship would be better and be healed and wanted to let us know the impact of the program. So Gary, I'm saying all this to say people are listening that are desperate they need help they need that lifeline John that you just mentioned and we didn't give that formal introduction yet.

Dr. Gary Chapman is a best-selling author, a speaker, he's a pastor and he's director of marriage and family life, consultants, and he's written many many books he's been on this program. A number of times, and Jimmy, it was his second book that really forms the basis for conversation today. It's been retitled and it's called one more try.

And Gary welcome back to Focus on the Family.

Thank you, Jim. Good to be with you again Gary.

Let me start with the basic premise and when you get married you walk down the aisle, especially given the Christian community are thinking okay this will all work out. My expectations will be met.

He'll love me she'll love me for who I am and will grow together and this is going to be really fun and then they wake up the next day what happens in a marriage that is shutting down.

What are the things that you see in 35 years of counseling where those trigger points that are predictable.

That point in marriage in a direction toward destruction well the first thing that happens. Jim is like come down off the emotional high of being in love that is a wonderful experience incredible experience.

You feel like you will be happy forever. You just know you found the right person how long anything of research that shows that that is true that last the year two years, two years is the average and we come down off the high and only sighted people. Let's be thankful we come down off the high because we didn't have to close down business in this character education because you can't get anything done when you're in luncheon and yet it consumes your life. But we do come down off the high but many people are not ready for that. I certainly was not ready for that. I didn't know that was going to happen in two years and my wife and I been dating for two years before we got married, so pretty soon after the honeymoon. We came down off the high but everyone comes down off the high and you lose those euphoric feelings and then the difference is a murdered and you realize that some of those things your friends told you about her before you got married are true and some of those things I told you about him are true and so you see the differences you have no plan for handling the differences so you end up arguing with each other because you know you're right and you explain it to her.

You know and tell her you know and then you explain it again and before long you're saying nasty, hurtful things to each other with loud voices and before long you're thinking we might have serious mistake. We should not of gotten married but then you know if you're Christian you will, hunker down and say okay will go to work on this and couples can go on thinking they're working on it when they're really just enduring it and seven years down the road 10 years down the road.

32 years down the road you know they just laugh at it, let me ask about the signs and let me comment on that two-year average that the come down from that euphoria.

I guess say what is the expectation of that average couple. Let's talk in those terms.

What should they be expecting when they get married. What should they be anticipating the help hedge against reality against normal life, especially in for Christians and I think we often can have even loftier expectations because were Christians and we know the Lord loves us and this should work out a certain way and sometimes it doesn't. After that euphoria is gone. Talk about that then I want to ask another question for LSU nothing but question but what talk about that for a moment, but I think one thing is I should anticipate it. They should realize this is going to happen. It doesn't mean that we will lose all of the emotional feelings.

If we learn to speak each other's love language we can keep the emotional love alive in the relationship. It won't be the euphoric state, but it will be a deep sense of love. Emotional love with each other so understanding that we can keep love alive by speaking the right love language and then secondly if they have a plan for handling conflicts in most couples do not want to get married because they don't think that I have any contracts but if they have a plan for handling conflicts and this is what I would suggest that before you get married either read a book or sedan with a counselor or somebody can talk about talk to other married couples. How do you resolve conflicts when you disagree with each other and you both feel strongly about it. How do you work your way through those things and that involves empathetic listening, putting yourself in the shoes of the other person trying to understand how they could think what they think and feel what they feel, and then not condemning it but acknowledging that's the way they think that's the way they feel in their head. It makes sense, and then to say to them, you know, honey, now that I hear you, that does make a lot of sense. Now let me share with you what I was feeling and thinking and then you affirm each other. You still differ but you haven't condemned the other person you've affirmed them and then you said okay we see it differently. How can we solve it. Gary, let me ask you this question.

I thought a lot about this but when you look at it, why does our flesh run toward what is best for us.

I mean what I mean by that. It might be that you know to speak with empathy to your mate, you know the right things that should be done and yet you know sometimes it just these triggers and you respond with a harsh word or you respond with a cutting comment. It's like were feeding our flesh and eat. Why do we do that we know better. I think two things Jim I think one is we are all by nature self-centered. Now that's not all bad because that means we feed ourselves. We get exercise take care of ourselves.

But when that self-centeredness becomes selfishness so that I view all of life in terms of what I'm getting out of this. My spouse is not meeting my needs. That's where some of that comes from is where we become selfish.

Another factor is what the reason we come defensive when our spouse says certain things is because they have struck at our self-esteem. All of us have a sense of self-worth and we should have because were made in the image of God with extremely valuable when the spouse when my spouse says something to me that strikes at my self-esteem and makes me feel like they're putting me down that my idea is no good. I get defensive just happened is an emotional response to that. I want to fight or else I clam up and will run depending on my personality. Let me ask you the out on the opposite side of that, the spouse that doing it, what are they deriving from that they think they're winning something that they're not there isolating themselves. But what motivates that person to win the argument when the debate and they walk away feeling good, but their spouses crushed what I say to people is if you win an argument. Your spouse lost it's no fun to live. The loser, so I would you create one arguments lead nowhere but down the hill. Understanding communication dialogue with each other Lisa solutions. If you spend your time looking for a solution that their solution all conflicts. If you spend your time looking for the solution rather than trying to win the argument, you'll find a solution and every time you find a solution. Something you both can live with. You grow closer together. Every time you win an argument you walk away. They acquiesce, but they still know that they're right and you're wrong you sweep it under the rug and you get enough of these things swept under the rug.

That's where you get the feeling shouldn't of gotten married. Never gonna work out too many differences too many conflicts can't solve anything. Never going to be any better, and we go downhill and are thinking well let's play the tape fast forward dog people are at all stages who were listening maybe some marriages are very healthy. I hope so. I think so.

There are some marriages that are teetering they're probably in the quietness of their heart thinking.

I'm not sure of what our future will be. And then some marriages where one of the spouses is shutting down and there thinking of divorce and there hearing us right now.

That talk about why separation is a good step. Rather than divorce, obviously.

And what happens in that separation time welding. First of all, Jim.

It's important to acknowledge that separation can be a positive step because many Christians think you know if I separate. That's terrible, that's awful but sometimes there such a crisis in a marriage, and maybe is been physical abuse are verbal abuse over a long period of time they living with an alcoholic is all sorts of situations that bring you to a crisis that separation can be an act of love and what you're saying is I love you too much to sit here and let you destroy yourself and destroy me and hurt the kids I'm going to move in with my mom.

I'm not abandoning you I'm not even courting divorce. I'm just saying to you. I can't be a part of what's happening here, and if you will go and get some counseling and deal with this issue.

I am willing to reengage with you at any juncture, and we can get marriage counseling in our marriage can become what we had hoped we would have when we got married when you take that approach. It's a positive approach.

It is an act of love, not an active abandoned Gary, I can only imagine that spouses in that situation doesn't know where the trigger is though, when do I do that and it would seem to me that they'd always be saying well if this happens, then I'll do that and that thing doesn't happen or if tomorrow. He doesn't do better than I'll take that next dramatic step.

How does that listen to speak on behalf of the woman. How does she know when she needs to have that kind of direct confrontation with her. I Leslie typically don't go to that link don't go to the separation step without spending time with the counselor, a pastor and older mature trusted friend somebody that can help you assess that don't make the decision on your own because once you make a decision you going to need somebody that you can process your emotions with afterward. So don't make that step alone. I think this is where it's really really important that you have somebody walking with you through that process because that's the ultimate step is to decide to do that is a lot of things you can do before that. But when you get to that point, it can be a positive thing. Now let me be very honest, the majority of people who moved to separation. Do not do it is an act of love they do.

It is a step of survival right I'm getting out of here before get killed or before. I just have a nervous breakdown and understand that, but it would be far better if they can see it as an act of love that they're not abandoning the marriage. They're not even saying I'm going divorce this person that what they are saying is I'm going to try to do something that can be redemptive here, and often the step of separation can be the trigger that causes the other person to say I am about to lose something and I am going to get help well and I think it's important as they were were not supporting separation writing out the ideal is to have a marriage was thriving and doing well but were saying sometimes that wake-up call. That's how I would describe it as a wake-up call to say we got to do better.

This isn't healthy, and this is the ring of the bell so to speak, and there is a place for that tough love.

We talk about it in the context of marriage often it could be something where it's a habit that you need to talk about. Perhaps a bad habit, a sinful habit and the spouses wanting to get the attention that's where you would deploy tough love. Talk about the courage to do tough love.

Though it may not be separation there just might be.

How do you confront years your mate in a way that's loving but tough and what's the marshmallow type that isn't that healthy, yeah.

And I think the first of all, I always suggest tender love before. Tough love. That is, learn your spouses love language began speaking that love language on a regular basis and in about two months into that you say to them on a scale of 0 to 10, how much love. Do you feel coming from me, and if they give you an eight, nine or 10, you know you're getting through.

If they give you something less than that you say what could I do to bring that up okay and so you do that, but when you get to the eight, nine or 10, then you can make a request of them and you say honey, you know, one thing that would really make me happy and you tell them something that's been bugging you that you like for them to change.

And because they are now feeling loved by you. There far more likely to reciprocate and do that thing. Whereas if you don't give them tender love and I don't feel love coming from you. All they feel is condemnation you been nagging them about this thing now for three years and it's only thing you harp on. They're not motivated to respond to you in love because all they feel is condemnation from you. So if you can stop the condemnation just put it on hold is have a truce for six months and let's try tender love your far more likely to have a positive response from them. Let's talk about that marriage that quietly. The wife is suffering. She's not even sure if it's worth saving. How does she evaluate that. How does that spouse and husband to. How does that spouse put some kind of evaluation to it to say okay it's worth the effort is an effort not worth the effort. Well, I think.

Bottom line is always worth the effort. We will be better for having tried than simply giving up and that's why say to people you know we can't guarantee that if you do XYZ that your spouse will respond. We can say is these are the things that create a climate in which a marriage is most likely to be revived and one person almost always has to take the initiative eat and if you're the one that has come some concern. Are you the one is thinking of walking out, I would say you're the one to take the initiative because the other person showing no concern about the relationship but if you take a concern and you begin to take some steps to create a different climate and the relationship because it will not change as long as you have the climate you have now, which is adversarial and adversarial climate will not lead to growth, but a lot of climate leads to the possibility of growth so I suggested tender love approach and periodically asking your spouse questions such as what could I do to make your life easier or what did I do to be a better husband or better wife and getting that feedback and working on those things and what happens in the mind of the other person is they begin to think they're changing.

I like this person I like what's happening here and so they respond to what you are doing for them it's that kind of attitude that has the potential of turning a person and it takes discipline when I hear you say that I'm just again thinking of even my own experiences both letters and emails that we receive your Focus on the Family so often.

Again, it it's not the initial reaction that we have as human beings, we tend to want to react out of our flesh and we serve the purposes of the enemy of our souls only do that, but what about the white dissent. I hear yet, but right now I'm I'm not feeling loving. I'm not even sure I like him when they go, what I would say is first of all we have to recognize that while there is an emotional aspect of love love is basically a choice. It's a choice to look out for the interest of the other person. It's a choice to be willing to sacrifice for their benefit and because it is a choice and not simply an emotion we can love a person that we don't even like when you do and predict if you speak that love in the language that really communicates to them you're touching them at the deepest possible point because you're speaking love and you're speaking a language that they understand. Well, I appreciate the help.

I don't you know were talking about the desperate heart and the loneliness of that and the deception of it and what you're saying is there is always hope. As long as one of you is willing and when you begin to turn that and not react out of your flesh, because that spouses treating in a way that is demeaning or lacking that love if you can find your source in Christ and in your relationship with God.

It would allow you to whether that so that you can get on a better track talk about that experiences we in today but I want to ask you to stick with the sewing come back and continue the discussion, but let's end with hope today talk about those examples in the couples that you have counsel over 35 years, were you even as the counselor thought this one looks desperate yet you saw God work a miracle we had Jenna saying that over and over again.

The counseling office because when people are willing to take steps to change what is change typically takes place. It's a when they're unwilling to take steps and they just say there's no hope there's no hope there's no hope.

Then there is no hope. But when you are saying. I feel like there's no hope for this relationship but I am willing to take some steps in the right direction, then there is hope and over and over again. I've seen couples that when I first encountered them.

I was so empathetic with them. I felt the pain I understood why they had no hope. Nine months later I saw them walk out of the office holding hands with each other having settled some major issues and now having some tools of communication and understanding that's going to lead them to a lifetime of a happy marriage, which is what we should be doing, especially in the Christian community at Dr. Chapman. This is been terrific. I just want to summarize so that we can tee it up for next time that we talk today about the idea of using tender love. First and foremost and then if necessary. Tough love and you described that in your book one more try and for those that this is speaking to your heart, pick up the book. Contact Focus on the Family John you give the details in just a minute, but we want you to have this resource so that you can get on a better path and and be a witness and not just to each other in your marriage but to the world around you as well Dr. Chapman.

He also talked about creating a different climate in your marriage is we react out of our flesh we got a kind of bite. The bit in her mouth and said okay Lord I'm a do it your way and stop doing it my way to my ways just not working in the fact that love is a choice that we've gotta determine this is the direction were going to go at tomorrow let's talk about some deep tough stuff. Maybe the affair that's occurred or a wound that is devastating and hard to get over and that let's talk about the healing hope that there is even for that, that is so very desperate. Thanks for the God's going to give you strength to work on your marriage as you turn to him and we trust that we can be a part of that process for you at today's program really highlighted our mission here Focus on the Family and that's to come alongside you if you're struggling in your marriage, and to give you hope that's the bottom line.

To give you hope. Specifically, in Christ we are here for you and we have resources and a terrific team of caring Christian counselors who can listen and pray with you and point you in the right direction.

In addition, we have our hope restored marriage intensive.

This is marriage counseling for couples who are facing an extreme crisis in their relationship and who may even feel they are headed for divorce. The extended periods of counseling over multiple days allows our team of marriage counselors to get to the root of the problem and equip you to do better in the future.

The success rate for the couples who go through that intensive program. After we surveyed them two years later there's an 81% success rate, which is outstanding. I hope if you or your loved ones need that kind of counseling intervention that you will contact us today for more information. It really is like changing Jim you know I had the privilege of attending one of the sessions there. The team is so good and the work happening at hope restored is so important, so encouraging to see what God is doing there and good for you and Dana John to go and strengthen your relationship. If you support Focus on the Family and our efforts at hope restored.

Let me say thank you for helping marriages.

In this way, we have saved thousands literally thousands of marriages together.

If you have yet to get involved with us financially. May I ask you to consider joining us to cover this area of ministry to stand in the gap for those who are desperately seeking answers your monthly gift will make a huge difference and allow us to plan and budget to help even more couples have strong thriving marriages.

In fact, when you make a pledge of any amount today we'd like to send you a copy of Dr. Chapman's book, one more try as our way of saying thank you and if you can't commit to monthly amount will send you a copy of the book for one-time gift as well donate. As you can get your copy of Dr. Chapman's book all the details are in the episode or call 800 K in the work-family on behalf of Jim Daly and the entire team here. Thanks for joining us today for Focus on the Family I'm John Fuller inviting you back in the conversation with Dr. Gary Chapman and once more help you and your family thrive in Christ.

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