Love, Deferred

He also on this season of Mr. Stillman's opus.

I'm spending some time interviewing my clients here at Rosewood wealth management over the years I've had the chance to work with a lot of different people and a lot of them have really interesting stories to tell. Maybe they have a really neat job. Maybe they've accomplished something very impressive. Or maybe I just had things happen to them in life, good or bad that make for interesting stories today. I'm talking with Johnny and meaning that it was they share their story about how he ended up married each other for the last 14 years. They first met in the 60s when they were kids in rural Tennessee and dated during the young adult years.

But in the late 70s in rural East Tennessee interracial relationships weren't exactly encouraged all by the way Johnny is white. Mimi is not. This is their story about how they parted ways in 1980 Somehow Found Their Way back to each other. 26 years later, so let's go back to Tennessee when you guys first met. How did you first meet and where exactly in Tennessee that thought we first lived in spring city Tennessee Saddam Bible camp. I was 12.

She was eight. While and I was working the horses.

I was a helper and with horses. She was a camper and I was trying to help teach the campers how to ride the horses and I had found that if the campers are at times would fall on the me instead of getting on the horse. So I learned that I would hold their leg below the knee that would help them to mount on the horse instead of falling onto me so anyway when it came time for her to get on the horse. I grabbed her arm hold of her leg below her knee to set up support.

Make sure she got on the horse, and she said, bear in mind this is eight-year-old Mimi said said that is not your leg turn loose of my leg. I so I'm just trying to help you get on the horse. I don't care what you're doing you turn loose of my leg.

It doesn't belong to you, so that was sort of our initial meeting. Do you corroborate the story be remembered differently.

That is how it held that what happened and I see that you remember it all these years later right so how then did the relationship evolve from well basically.

During those years since we were young we I was teaching horses and things and she was a camper in the she came back and she basically the program was like a six year program. He was a teenager by the end she became a Boy Scout.

She started more interested in voice so she stayed at camp like girls and boys got back now and write, so she was up at the camp with the board so I rarely ever saw her, but I was also hanging out with your younger siblings because there was a four year age difference between the two of us and you were just the old part and I was having fun with your younger brothers and sisters and you were there, but you were on staff at the horses and always doing something else. So we didn't really have a relationship. I had a relationship with his sisters and his younger brother or something with him. So, at what age did you say like this guy. How many years later I was 18 and graduated from high school in my first year in college was in Dallas Texas and while I was there I got a letter from Johnny asking if I would come and work the horse program with him and I loved horses anyway so course I said yes.

So I guess the summer of my 19th year was the summer I went to work at the diner and even then I had a boyfriend though I didn't fancy him at all. He was just this mean crazy boss who had me outside in the hot sun being bitten by horse flies which draw blood by the way, create something offense. Cleaning out the stalls selling saddle blankets helping in saddles, helping give horses injections. Currying horses it was a lot of work and he was a mean taskmaster Johnny when you recruited to come work at the horse camp where you really just trying to recruited to the horse camp or were you trying to recruit her there for other reasons. Well it was interesting because the camp director brother Howard asked me to send her the letter and so I said okay but I have forgotten who she was. I didn't remember. And so when she showed up out there.

She was came down of the camp and the horse barn and she had that she can then with other people as well, but she kept hanging around. I was like so finally at one point I asked Russell who are you and she says what you sent me a letter you asked me to come out here and work with you and she had her hand on her hip, then a layer that is an you don't even know my name so I was like taken back as well. I got a little feisty one here.

So at that point in us. Okay well yes you're right I don't know your name right at the moment you remember so she told me. I realize that I consider the letter so to come to work at the camp as a helper in the horse program so we but I had a boyfriend at the time I was not interested in him. And then when he worked me that hard. I really do not interest. I was not interested. Meanwhile, though, all the girls at camp were interested in him, so they were harassing me, why are you spending so much time with him and I was incredulous because it was like you've got to be kidding me. This man is working me like I am in a sweat factory over in Vietnam and you're thinking he's cute and were making out on the barn. Are you kidding me really so I had no use for these women, and he was used to girls chasing him and I was not interested so it took him about two or three years before I did as well. I can well all anywhere down. I'm not quite sure how I did that I did take during the time of her work like she would say oh that's really something she would say that's a man's job man should be doing that and that's to do well today and you have be a man because today that's your job.

And that's what you get this evening. So let's see I worked two summers at the camp and then I took a job in Tennessee in Cleveland, Tennessee working at a children's home and it was right before that we started spending a little more time together. The group was large. We would go out as a group of the counselors at the camp and after a while the group got smaller and smaller and smaller as people went off and did their own thing and then at one point it was just the two of us we he asked me out for dinner and I was like okay sure so we went out for dinner and then we went back to the camp and that happened a couple times and then I thought now he couldn't possibly be interested in me.

I mean there too many women throwing themselves at him. So no, thank you, but then one night we were on our way back to the camp and I'm sitting on the right door and he sitting on the left door. They had the bench seats back then another vehicle and this was how he got me. He said you don't have to sit all the way over there on the door.

You can scoot over. You know, and then it hit me. Oh my goodness he likes me like you. So I froze and it seemed like an eternity, but then I gingerly started scooting across the sea and I was how we clinch the deal. Next thing we know were together and were dating then you dated for how long until it became apparent this was going to work and spell here wasn't something you and at that time. Interracial relationships were not sanctioned a whole lot in Tennessee and there was a lot of opposition, not necessarily from his immediate family, extended family was like no that's not can happen. And other people, other adults there as well. Were you getting pushback from your family was a long drive so okay so what was he wore the conversations happening in your family when we were dating. There was opposition to our relationship because of the racial that manifested itself how what would people say to you, and what conversations we had no one that tells you on the restaurants were at one time a guy came up to me and he said to me did I realize that I was sitting at the table with a black girl, yes I think I am aware of that, but thanks for pointing it out well. He also said look, she can clean your house scrap your floors. Do your laundry but you're not supposed to be seen in public with her and I was taken aback because the last time I looked it was still a free country and you could go where you wanted, but in the South.

A lot of feelings are still present, whether you want to acknowledge it or not, and they just felt the freedom to say things, the director of the camp was not on board and he told me his cell make sure this never happens on my watch and I was horrified because he was also a believer and I wanted to tell him I hate to break this to you but when you get to heaven. I'm going to be there as well and were not to be segregated, so please get over yourself, but you didn't say things like that to adults when I was that age, so I kept those thoughts to myself, but I thought it. Also, as I recall some of his extended family when they heard about it. They were like what if you marry her, you can't bring her to our house, not his parents but his extended family, and I was aware of that but my families mixed so I didn't see a problem with it's like it all sort itself out, especially since were all Christians, and it did not and how did you guys to go to the conclusion that will go our separate ways. You know was that time they were they were talking big things about you need to be led by Stanley you live to be 70 so I thought well I thought I would be 70 while I live 35 years single and 35 years married so I had more or less my mind decided I will get made. I was 35 but I never told anybody that and so your people kept asking me space you had a lot of mothers asking me to tell me that it is only worked on me for two years wore me down. I got rid of my boyfriend and then I was going to go away to college and that night he said we need to talk, and I was like okay whatever and he said I know you're going off to college and I think we should see other people and I just felt like I'd been hit with sledgehammer. I was like see other people what he means the other people. He says we should date other people and I just felt my heart breaking and cracking and I kept it together. I walked out left and never look back and you got a reason no he never said I don't want to get married till I'm 35. What this is my life plan.

He just said I think we should see other people never got an explanation so when you say you never look back.

You went to college I went to Colorado and I never look bad wherefrom there after I left college I got a job as a flight attendant and the grapevine. I heard he got married in the your he got married I moved to Europe so you got married to somebody else from that area met the girl in North Carolina and you had one son had a son. How long we were married just before John's on turn five. She'd came and told me that she was no longer live with me she didn't like little Jesus Christ so she wouldn't get out the relationship, meaning you were too religious for her is what you trying to imply that's right because we all know that I love Jesus and really just wanted to clarify wasn't sure what she might've thought that Mimi can verify very much Jesus Christ so anyway the way I had I kept John's on the race to myself.

I didn't let him go with her so you find out that he's married. This happened quite a few years later. Now you flee to the UK. Yes, your flight attendant you're seeing the world.

Yes, living in the UK and you were there. How long 13 or 14 years and had a great church good friends. Fabulous job and I'm getting paid to travel all over the world I lived in Paris for two years I was in out of Berlin for about six, but the UK was my main base and then I heard through the grapevine that Johnny had a son and I had the front upgrade. I'm so happy for him. That's wonderful and a couple years later I heard through the grapevine. John is getting a divorce and I said no, he would never because even the grapevine consisted of your family.

My sister who was married to his best friends brother but I never let on how deeply I was hurt. I just kept that wall up and when guys would try to date me I was like okay we can be friends, but we can't be more than friends and I need you to listen to this upfront is I'm not playing games. I'm not being coy. This is really how it is and after a while I just thought why my doing this cyclic dating I left.

I had a lot of friends so I did need a boyfriend, sort of. The timeline was his lady we made in 65 and then we met again will get back together where she worked for me is back in 76. She was there about 79 and then eight you think was the last time we saw each other that there was no 1986 because I had my parents had moved to North Carolina from St. Louis. I had just started flying and I came to visit them and he came over and we saw each other.

I would say the fall of 1986.

So the next time I saw him was 20 years later, being way to sit 65th anniversary was 2007. I told my family that the 65th anniversary that we all need to be answered if possible to show solidarity with our parents that we that they service for 55 years and we needed to show as a family that we believe what they did. That's not there anymore and I had been back to sometime since that night he broke. I was on to other things and so periodically, though, my mom would say hey Mimi, something is going on it to dying, don't you want to go and I'm like no I'm in London why when I come all the way back for that.

No thank you I'm good but that particular year 2006 after my brother-in-law was killed and a truck accident. My mother finally wore me down to a series of circumstances, and I finally just thought okay to shut up and I'll come for my sister just lost her husband so I came back to sometime thinking that since his father had just died, he would want to come back to the scene of so much grief so soon, so he probably wouldn't show up because that's how I would do but he was doing just the opposite, and had I known he was going to be there. You couldn't have dragged me there. God had a different plan. Just backup for a minute back in 2006 I was having troubles with John-John as a teenager in the problems but I felt that I was having was because he needed a woman in his life to teach help them to develop because God's design for the family as a father and a mother that's God's design that I was not giving God's design and so are some of the problems of the likely city if there was a woman in their life. So I prayed and I said Lord I said there was years ago I met this girl my Mimi… I think she would be a great mother for John-John.

But however you might have a different plan because last time I walked about coming didn't work so we want to work it out your way. But I said to me, it has to be robust. It's not me me I should be somebody who is like her something she would be the one that would help John-John to develop like he should get started praying a year before we met, I was blissfully unaware of this because I had my life in London.

It was great it was. What I mean. I was happy I it's like when you do a jigsaw puzzle and you find that last piece and you say oh wow, this is it. That's how I felt when I moved to London, so he's back in the states praying for girl like me, me, or better yet Mimi to show him back into my life and I have no intentions of moving back to the states at all the work that we got that they had the 65th anniversary and when I arrived on site when my friends Bill said something I would like really like to show you classes will bill us.

It is good, but since I'm just curious as to who all came back and I knew they were having them gathering of like some of the CBI students and staff everything up in Jubilee centers are want to go up there and see who all was there I would just curious as to who all showed up for this 65th anniversary SCV. My family was in it so I go upstairs and Jubilee center in the first person Caesar is the first want to say there's other people up there, but she just doesn't like you got a be getting me them easier and Bill's wife, who is my friend Diane had come to the room where I was when she saw I was registered.

She came to the room to find me but I was writing a note to my mom telling her I was on my way back to Knoxville to catch a flight to go back to London because when I got there my family wasn't there yet and I was like okay, I've done everything I needed to do. I'm done. I've come there not here got an out, so Diane called her husband Bill on the phone and said I've got Mimi where's Johnny so these two are colluding together.

It's a huge conspiracy so billing.Johnny Diane dragged me to the meeting. I was not a member of CBI I had not gone to the school there.

I was not an alumni but she said let's just go to the meeting okay and then after the meeting. You can leave so they got us in the same room together and at the end of the meeting there was a prayer and they picked this guy name Paul and he is the slowest prayer you have ever heard in your life. It took him 20 minutes to get a five minute prayer done. I have my car keys in my hand. My handbag is over my shoulder. I am ready to leave the moment he says, a man in my turnaround standing at the top of the stairs is John and I'm looking for a window to jump out of it was funny because Bill said I have something to show you. Well you know it was he, and I was had been there to get all of our lives. So I thought he'd found something from the old Fort.

We had our way. That is, she does hide out in the woods that would build and I thought he'd found something that's what he wanted to show me LOL last year's report was mean to be one thing is later. He had found something so good in the hideout who said what we know now know he walked over he has not seen me in 20 years. He doesn't know if I married, divorced, and widowed grandmother. He knows nothing. He walks over to me and grabbed me like I was the last life vest on the Titanic and just started kissing me I was like a board. It was like no take your hands off.

Leave me alone. Let me go. How dare you, and after the prayer everyone is turned around and now they're watching Johnny kiss was so embarrassed. Been dating so I have been kissing anyone since 1991 I think I quit dating.

This is 2006 and all of a sudden my first love who I have not seen in 20 years, who's totally ignored me and blown me off for 20 years is now kissing me. Go figure.

And yet here we are.

So what happened I did not know I but at that point the hunt was on.

So I put the walls up. I was the perfect flight attendant. The rest of the weekend I had the correct responses for everyone except he kept following me around trying to talk. What was so interesting was when things lead prayed for that John-John would get along with whoever the lady was well every time on the phone John-John he was with Mimi. I may need to. He just they just took it up with her. Yes, we bond so really bonded so they do and out, so I'd have to worry about him because only one rocket funding. My sister had gotten his phone number and wrote it in her handwriting and threw it in my purse. So when I got back to the to London, I switched my civilian purse to my airline purse and I saw this number. Well, it had a North Carolina number I'm thinking it's a relative that there was no name on the number so when we got I got the number and I decided to call it, on a layover and I called it, and he answered, and I hung up I would like and so my girlfriend saw the aftermath of that phone call and she said what's going on with you. I've never seen you this way your like tense all the time and I was like oh no to something from my past came up and I'm just trying to cope with it.

So they worked on me for two weeks to call and call and call and so the next time I was in San Francisco. I said if you will give me peace. I will call so I called and he wasn't there so I left a message and hung up and I was off the hook because I've done what I said and it was all on him. Well, he got part of the message and started calling every Hilton there was in the San Francisco area. There was five Hiltons because part of the message broke off and so because I've done what I said and now I can get them off my back but they said would you call it one more time.

So in the lobby before were getting our pickup to go back to San Francisco airport.

I call this time he picked up and then I was just panic stricken. I was like now would like to supply can't talk because I'm leaving San Francisco, he says, but it's taken me all day to try to find you do know how many hotels are in San Francisco, so I said look, I'll call you the next layover, so I fly back to London and then the next time I came to San Francisco I called. He said when you coming back to the states when you can see your mom and I said well you know like in a month or so. So he's his final pick you up and I wasn't sure about that because I was trying to put the toothpaste back in the tube and didn't work so that was we saw each other in June 2006 I came back from my mom's birthday in July the end of July and he picked me up and like I said the hunt was on.

I didn't know he was serious he was. He was stalking me and I had no clue I was no yet we can make this work you want a fishing buddy I can do that but she came around one time but in August, John-John the camp over near Asheville open boom area just what will help once you go with me to pick up John-John and you like to sort of what the I suck. Get your own motel room, enabling a slow play portal and we can go over and get John-John bring about And so I did want to see John-John again. So I said yes. So the John Doe was the bait did a nice long drive to work on some more. That's right.

So we walked over to Boone and the right. On Friday Lynn said he would get up with over there get John-John and then we had a nice leisurely drive back spent some time visiting over there doing things that we do think JoJo with 30 John Doe between zero and Mimi said no little girls going on. It was surreal. I kept thinking what am I doing here. Here he is with his son and then I'm here.

What am I doing here so anyway we go along and then one day John-John comes in he's is very Sunday. He said that means income Thursday said what I said. I said I have an extra gum shirt is, why did she just took too long and John-John was older this point they use 1515 so anyway it and so as I was told Laura sobor this is not how this will work out. I was supposed be the one who asked her to come to church and she will still drift is asking that she's going because John JavaScript essence allows that this is the is not going on the way I hello plant and so God reminded me that you know things are not about my plan.

He has the whole thing in mind. I just have the moment and mine. So anyway she came to church and I was still trying to figure out why was there. What I was doing my mother even said what's going on with you and Johnny now because my whole family knew and he knew I hadn't seen in 20 years and my mother was like whoa, what's going on with him.

I says I don't know mom maybe once a fishing buddy. I don't know I just know that I'm going back to London and I went back to London. Then I came back the next set of days off. I had and he took me out for dinner and we were sitting in his truck in front of his apartment and he said so where would you like to get married and I looked at him and I said I beg your pardon leases so I can see you haven't thought about it I said no I haven't thought about it you haven't seen in 20 years and you see me three times now when you're talking marriage really know, but he was serious so that was maybe August. I came back in September and then he says we need to talk, and I'm still remembering the last time you and I said I might need a drink and some Valium for this talk, he says no it's not the kind of talk. So we got in the car and he said I just want to know what happened is all of those years ago and I thought no, you cannot possibly have amnesia. So I took him down memory lane and I could see it was starting to come back to him so he said while yeah I forgot about that yet. I did say that didn't die. You did well did apologize. Yes, he did apologize and we talked some more, but I wasn't wanting to punish him or hurt him.

You know that was water way under that bridge but I wasn't wanting to date or get back you know he's pushing this marriage thing so we finally talked and I said look okay, then we need to address us and he says okay I'm willing to do that, whatever you want and willing to do so I said well look, you've got a divorce behind you. I've never been married.

The odds aren't good in our favor. So there is some organization called family life today and they had a we can to remember. I knew it was coming. I said we need to get hooked up with that because they have good advice for people, so there was actually one ball and he booked us as she left, she flew all you do it you take care of the mayor got its registered and then when I came back that October for the conference. That's when I decided maybe this is real.

You have date night on Saturday night so I decided that was going to be the good time. Popular question so I have this all planned that I'm going to get ^ hello put it on the pop top can I will give her ring whole. Well, the place where you have popped up. Can somebody come and cleaned out so the kids were on and are going to store trying to find Geertz and they were out of the carriage that day and meanwhile she's in the car and I might make it all the stops of these different pieces seized by learned males and fills the room, doing everything and of oneself who were ousted when you go with me up on the roof and she said yeah I said okay so I still haven't figured out a little better ring. So I took all that well I got my ring from a trucking seers ought to call the cookies off more. We go up on the roof because I'm thinking we get up on the roof. The beep airplanes up there flying around so we get up on the roof and there's no airplanes flying around and I said well this is not what I had figured it all and she's number we mean was this not figured as well where we just going to anyway so I get no money and I hold up my bring them a tricky and I asked her to marry me and she's down there right just like that with her hand over her mouth. What is this and I'm like well this is where you post to say yes, there is no but it was ring. It was a tricky ring like a key ring.

He says it's the key ring for my truck most important and I had no idea it was coming. I was blindsided did not see that one coming. So I said yes some the people church did they do know that I propose to her, so they didn't think that it was real because I had there was no ring what the problem was was the ring her sister told me that she really wanted her mother's ring. Her mother came to me and says I know maybe once this my ring but it's in bad shape.

So I brought some by the church there who had a friend who does jewelry and like to quickly clean up and reset the jewels and got all fixed up every so I was waiting on the screen come back they wasn't coming back. So if when I finally did get it.

I think this was in January wasn't in January and so we had actually met at the horse trainer, so I knew where horse Reyna was here in Durham so I drove to the horse. Reyna and she did nowhere and were always going to what I was going there anything else let us get there us to just sit here in the garment of us just one check something out. So get out my going there and asked the people with whom I want to propose to her in the horse Reyna when I was okay and whether not they had a class going on or whatever. This is no fun.

So we go out here and I have her mother's ring this time and I get down on my knees. I asked her to marry me come home of her mother's ring and she still little say yes she says that looks like my mother's ring. I said it is secure with other is that you wanted it so I'm giving this to you is real ring now you to where so you're still flighted to your stool flying around the world, but no planning away. I told him because when I came back is everything anything for the wedding. I said no, not until you go back and tell your entire family that were getting married. I said because I'm not to be a surprised anybody in this time I'm taking no prisoners. I've Artie tried that that did not work for me, so let me tell you how were going to do it now. So I came back he says if you want anything for the wedding. I said, have you told your entire family at well no not yet I said will then know I haven't bought a toothpick yet you finish your job and then we'll talk.

So he did when you were younger you broke your heart know you for 20 years.

He kisses you out of the blue with this reunion. He then proposes to you with the key ring from his truck keys. Yes, why did you say yes because he was one itch that I never could scratch. I never got over him and I refuse to settle and I dated other guys they didn't measure up liquidating.

I didn't need a man to fulfill me are complete me. I had a rough patch when my younger sister got married, and that all of my siblings were married and I went to her wedding in every cycle mean you're such a nice girl, why you married.

Why don't you have a husband I want to say why you want to give me yours but I did have a wobble at that point I kept thinking what's wrong with me that I'm not in a relationship. I don't have anyone, and God said maybe I need to be enough for you, so I struggled for a couple years with that and finally I yielded, I said conjure, but even then, God didn't bring us back together was another 810 years before we reconnected and when he came back into my life.

I didn't really want a relationship as I was living in three countries. I had a mother I was taking care of a blind eye with lupus. My life was full, and I'd Artie made my future plans.

I had my life planned out and God had other plans and so we brought them back into my life. I fussed. It got a bit and told him off but then I said okay God, but I want what you want more than I want what I want and if this is your will, then you're going to have to prove it to me and I will follow so he came back into my life and he refused to take no for an answer and I finally let myself believe that it could happen. So yeah, I'm keeping my thanks to Johnny and Mimi for sharing their story of the funny things about their breakup to me is how much angst was created simply because of lack of communication even though there was this layer of racial strife surrounding the situation. Johnny didn't care about that at all. That wasn't what you call things off, he just had this idea in his head, but didn't want to get married until he was 35 but close even communicate that at all. So Mimi of course had no idea what to think and spent the next quarter-century flying all over the world. Never really knowing what went wrong. In any event now been together for the last 15 years. Terrific and very happy couple. Hope you enjoyed this episode of Mr. Stillman's opus will talk with you again soon