Where is God When I’m Hurting?

I have grown in prayer, not as I have read books about prayer books about God when you see what a person is like you're either repelled or drawn if you prayer is it just going through life as if God is actually there, like he's your friend and father, and cares for you and welcome to family life today where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most and will send Dave Wilson and you can find us@familylifetoday.com or on our family life. This is family life today. You know, one of the things I've honestly struggled with, you know this is reconciling the God of the Old Testament with the God of the new test. You have struck us like how can this happen.

I mean there's been times when I've gone to the one your Bible and I'm like I don't read anymore. In the Old Testament just feels.

I got to go to wrath, and Jesus in the New Testament who said if you want to see the father, look at me.

He's a he's a loving God and a Mike how these two go together.

Are they really the same God. This is gonna be a great conversation today because a lot of people have wrestled with that very same issue that I that I think are really going to help them but you know before we jump into that.

We can say this is a really critical month for family life. It's December is our year and giving match where if you give your your donation will be doubled because we have generous donors and to match your gift up to $1.59 it's a gift from God.

This is the time to give because it it will be double yeah and I believe in that you love what we do. A family today and you share with others and we can't do that without you joining with us prayerfully and financially.

So if you'd like to jump in right now. Go to family life today.com or call us at one 800 FL today and make your donation and that will keep this ministry going and thriving in change in your life and others as well. And just as a thank you for your generous giving working to send you ready to tell gifts to gift playing cards which are likely guards or cover self-starters or both. Yeah. And then we got a devotional written by our guest today. Day Norlin which is devotional on the Psalms, 150 different devotions which will literally make 2022 a great year so Dane glad to have your student today welcome the family of today. Thank you guys, good to talk to you know we had two programs talking about your book gentle and lowly, and as a pastor in Chicago area and Naperville and dad husband and five kids. This understanding of of God that we talked about for the last couple programs of Jesus being gentle and lowly crying you guys yeah several days in a row that she wants me to start crying and I when I was reading it and we talked about this. Just being in really hit okay to say softly know what it was strongly pushed back like microwave. This is who he is and so as we mentioned already. It seems different. For a lot of us of the God of the Old Testament, a God of holiness and wrath and judgment in this gentle lowly Jesus, and Jesus said if you see me you seen the father. I I am the father once. What I want to know it. God's like Jesus is the visible representation. So he's the heart of God.

But it doesn't feel like the same God, so that you do a great depth about this in booklet talk about how do you reconcile those two different views. I guess there's a couple weeks, at that one is what actually one out at the end after the entire Old Testament God is sending his son to die in our place for our sins.

Satisfying his perfect justice.

Yes and proving his perfect love. So at the end of the day, he didn't say forget it I'm done.

You guys are out of luck.

He saved us, that one would look from a macro perspective, but there's passage after passage that bubbles up as we read through the Old Testament. If we can make it past February and are one year reading planet through Leviticus I near the New Testament there is generally heart of Christ actually is what I said if I have to go to only one part of the Bible to talk about what God's heart is profits are perhaps the most blushing. The most effusive place to find I don't talk more about hell more than Jesus there in Matthew 11 the end of chapter 11 saying I'm gentle lowly Hardee's walking around saying woe to you, Beth SATA, woe to you cores and because they didn't repent, but we read you know in a passage like Exodus 34 which is the scholars will say this is the definitive self revelation of God in the Old Testament. This is what in John one, the apostle John alludes to, and says this text got up and walked around on two legs on planet Earth.

Moses says show me your glory and God does not respond. I will make all my glory pass before he responses us. I will make all my goodness pass before you apparently God defines his glories as goodness. He says the Lord, the Lord God, merciful and gracious. One of the first words out of his mouth, a God merciful and gracious, slow to anger like we were over the yellow labs are great because they they just published so much before the NICU slow, irreverent analogy, slow to anger and abounding in steadfast love and faithfulness. Keeping steadfast love for thousands 2000 generations usually what that means than the text was on the safe but will note by no means you know a quick guilty but will visit the sins of the fathers on the children. The children's children's I think what are you withdrawing all the glory you just said the answer is no, he says, down to the third and fourth generation judgment will roll down to a thousand generations steadfast love will roll and he doesn't mean at generation number 1000 and want to kick your done. It a Hebrew way of saying it will never end. That's the proportion three or 4 to 1000 and more. God's judgment, which is true and fearsome gods abounding love that is so beautiful and I tell you one of the things I found really interesting your book is when you comment on Lamentations 3 which I read it and just you don't comment as you did in the book, but it says he does not afflict from his heart or grieve the children of men. Other words you get into. He does not afflict from his heart.

What 70 will Dave you and I are going to die one day. Not having plums out and enjoy that were never going just download that have that in her back pocket and move on to better other truths. This is wondrous, right here in the middle of Lamentations when basically the entire nation is going into meltdown. It's the worst things could be circumstantially in the very middle verse of the entire book is the exact middle and that there's a literary point about God says he doesn't from his heart afflict or grieve the children of men does he afflict or grieve the children meant yes but he doesn't do it from his heart.

He sovereignly overruling all the good and the hard things wash into our lives. It's all under his fatherly care, but the hard things aren't from his heart. What is that mean apparently it's not as if he is chuckling and sort of have a little wry smile on his face thinking I'm going to teach them our tears elicit his tears used to teaching the Bible guys because of Jesus and the Holy Spirit. When we are in dismay and distress. Christ himself feels that dismay and distress himself more acutely so God is not afflict from his heart. It is so different because we think tell you this. I thought of this this morning as I was reflecting on the truth out of general lowly my dad when I was five, six, seven years old.

Her girlfriends was drinking too much. I found out later dimly remember this took me on trips with this mistresses while still married my mom ends up divorcing. This is in the early 60s very few divorces at the time, so I'm now being raised by single mom and is just myself and my little brother. We moved to another state to basically go live near my mom's parents that she needed help. All that to say within about six weeks. My little brother dies of leukemia while at at the end of this tragic year and I know my dad over years later as he softened up and I had more of a relay ship with them in college. I know he always felt like that death was God's punishment for his sin, he articulated it like one time but I know it was like there talk about that because I think a lot of us feel like that sort of God we we do we do things wrong, and these are the kind of bad things happen to us because that's the heart of death will God couldn't have punished your dad's son for your dad's sin, because he had already punished his own son for your dad sent all God's divine ferocious wrath justly deserved by each one of us and I'm number one on the list.

If we are in Christ has been fully exhausted. Not like you got most of it out, but he might have another tantrum fully exhausted on the cross of Jesus Christ. Jesus experienced hell and condemnation so that we though we will die. When we look back at the cross we see our deserved Ellen condemnation back there if we are not in Christ.

If we are not safe in Christ than our Helen condemnation is out in the future if were in Christ, we can look back and say it's behind me because Jesus told that there I'm never going to face that again, hardship, pain, suffering, death, yes, but never Helen condemnation and you're right if we deeply deeply disbelieve that so we gotta keep telling each other. I think we do have to keep telling time. I probably should bring this up, this is something we talked about in one of our seminary classes assistant Dane now stump. Well, I just think this think he stumbled behind on either the heart when David says let's bring the ark into Jerusalem and Isaiah is carrying the ark and he slips the ark falls and as I die I meet at think you know if we make one wrong move guides cannot annihilate us. Well that is a very solemn and rising sobering passages in it and just one or two thoughts. One is we don't know exactly what was going on in others heart that I seminary set. Apparently there was some kind of pride or recalcitrance heart heartedness or stubbornness or willfulness or something such that this way RC principal puts it in the holiness of God such that was a proudly assumed his hand was less profane than the ground. Why couldn't the ark hit the ground.

But here's the sinful man is all all study the ark, and he assumed that he was more holy than the ground something like that. So we don't know what was going on inside of his heart, but the ark that he reached out and touch. There was something there that deeply displease God and God made an example of him now. Okay, that's true, all right, that's very sobering. Jesus Christ showed up and he said destroy this temple and in three days I'll build. He was the temple Ephesians to the same thing. He's the chief cornerstone. We are living stones being built up in him and the ark was the forerunner of the tabernacle and the temple.

We are ourselves not only touching that ark and not dying were part of it.

We are part of that temple movably and visibly we have been swept by grace up into it into fellowship with God. What the ark was always meant to do restore even the ark in the tabernacle, which was just an RV to a home tabernacle's a movable temple in the temple that was a little miniature guard novenas were fellowship, the profane and sacred come together all over again as I got it wrong.

Let us take note and let us all the more wonder that we've been brought into this very thing, fellowship, and present so that was actually way better than I've ever had. Explain fidelity was unstoppable.

And that really was in the mass I would say to people to when we were reading Scripture and something seems like seem fair that usually something deeper behind it, but you can always count on God's love and mercy.

Being there and you wrote any type of this little bit as you think about the Old Testament and the punishment you actually read read your exact quote. Mercy is natural to him. Punishment is unnatural even called like strange natural strange that is so contradictory to what I read is like it is. It seems like punishment is naturally like every page of feels like the Old Testament it isn't right but it feels that way because exam sounds almost like media jumps in controversy because it it leaves higher.

How is mercy, natural punishment, unnatural, not in the sense that God is like. He's 100% merciful end at 85% judging or anything like that. We believe in a doctrine called divine simplicity just in one quick sentence. All that means is any attribute that God is he is 100%. He's not like a pie with slices and the love slices a little bigger than the raft slicing though. Every attribute is he's 100%. We believe that that's Orthodox theology. We believe that for 2000 years.

Okay now having said that, how does the Bible talk about God.

I want to talk about God in the way the Bible does not in the categories of philosophical theology house Bible talk about God this is Jonathan Edwards and Palms Goodwin both say Old Testament Scriptures speak of punishment being God. Strange work. What they mean by that is it's something less natural to him it's it's something that he has to sort of like the water on the one you're making mac & cheese with water on the stovetop and it takes a while to boil up sound like a microwave. There's something unnatural in him for him to judge because what pours out of his own deepest heart most naturally is mercy, we saw their limitations. Three. And that's the consistent testimony of Scripture. He will not wink at sin. He will judge sin over the impenitent.

But for those who humbled himself to help save me. I need help I'm back who have the honesty to do that they will experience what is most natural to God. We think it's on at what is most natural to God, which is the flood like nature of his mercy and embrace who I like that you like a flood like nature of his mercy IME at this again. It's like mine blown part of me thinking of how the sermons I preached over 30 years did I articulate that well enough for people to understand the beauty the softness the gentleness of their father, who absolutely adores them and they want to run to not run away from in their sin, and I don't know right now is lovingly arming thank you Dan for writing this in and talk about this. Here's a thought I had when I was just listening to you. I thought that has this changed your prayer life will pray differently now that you have a different view of who is all I have grown in prayer, not as I have read books about prayer. God had II grow in prayer. I don't need someone to tell me here's three tips chapters 5 steps. Here's a new strategy right but if I see who is your talk about my dad earlier him. When you see what a person is like you're either repelled or drawn and yeah that's all prayer is just going through life as if God is actually there. Like is your friend and father, and cares for you, not just a force, or up like a platonic ideal way out there some abstraction, but a person with a P a person not human, but a person that we relate to so I have so much growth I needed my prayer life. Okay, let it let don't hear what I'm not saying my son but I can pray and enjoy praying, if this is who God is. I have felt that I think as I've gotten older I run to him before is more of a discipline I need to break this into my vitamin of the day. My prayers and praying and now it has become that. Maybe it's because I see him more clearly of who he is, I would. I mean, I get teary talking about because he's my best friend. I know that since. But I also know Lisa, Keith, God, he's a king he's made a mistake he the creator and yet suit loves me and I said this before day, but when we were dating and had that infatuation the love the feelings is still there.

Quick guide yet I feel bad about the father about this, but that's because I spent so much time now and I desperation for him being with him.

You can't be with him that much without being changed by his love a man and a just a footnote to that sister.

There is one person in the universe who really understands us, our spouses, they understands better than any other human right. But there are some things words like this is what I'm saying you don't God and Christ is never mystified that we what's going on inside. They understand exactly where we are at and that is powerfully winsome leaf drawing us to him that they understand us.

We will never be misunderstood. You know is so critical. As you know better than anybody because you wrote the book for us to understand this proper clear vision of who God is through Jesus because I'm used to preach. This is one of my themes is not the size your faith that matters in the society are God's words. You can muster seaside face.

Jesus said at tiny but if it's in a small God it out.

You need Mozart in a huge yet and I don't remember saying to a guy once who is going through something in my church. Actually a friend who's gone through so Mike I use this pat answer. Hey dude you know this, but let me remind you, Jesus is with you in this and you I said as I comforting is that Jesus pretty disappointed home respond. My oh so you think about that if you also my guys with them, but there are you of God is he's an angry guy across yeah right like I'd rather be alone than that, but when you understand he's gentle and lowly. He's crying with you.

He's holding you he's powerful it's like know that getting that's gonna get me through the thinking of our listeners. Like if you haven't experienced him in that way. Continue to run doing no when his word. Listen to it on audio download telling you version out there so many ways to connect to him, the more year with him. I think the more we see him and understand his love for us. Again, thank you. What a joy to talk with you.

Thank you for so many of us are picture of who God is, has been shaped by our relationship with our earthly father or by something we heard in childhood that may or may not have been accurate what we've been hearing this week is Dave and Ann Wilson talked with Dana Portland's that are picture of who God is, should be shaped first and foremost by what we see in his son Jesus, who describes himself as being gentle and lowly, and when we start to see that this is the God who we serve the God who has saved us.

It changes everything for us things book which is called gentle and lowly has been a bestseller. We got copies of it in our family life to resource Center.

I think there are probably people you know you may be on this list as well. People who need this book and especially during the Christmas season, you may want to get several copies to be able to give things book as a gift to others. You can go to our website family left@a.com to request your copy or you can call one 800 FL today in the title of the book is gentle and lowly by Dana Portland order it online@familylifeto.com or by calling 1-800-358-6329 that's one 800 F as in family L as in life, and then the word today that today is the first day of December and December is an important month for all of us. It's a significant month for us here at family life and we got the president of family life David Robbins here with us today. David help our listeners understand why December is such a significant month for this ministry.

40% of the donations that come in to help fuel ministry of family life come in during this month and the reason it's so important is certainly to help us feel more ministry, but it fuels more ministry to people like Steven and Rachel. They were like many couples in this past 18 months. At the end of themselves when they were thinking about their marriage and struggling, and the pressure was beginning to build and become overwhelming in their home and out of desperation.

They decided to reach out to family life and go to their first ever weekend to remember marriage get away and ensuring with us. They were doubting whether or not their marriage could be restored at all, but as they went. God met them in that place began to find some peace and today Steven and Rachel continue working on their marriage and have shared their newfound strength with friends and neighbors by building community around them and have actually formed an outreach ministry to other marriages but their amazing transformation and transition into pouring and other marriages came because of generous partners just like you who helped fuel the ministry of family life and minister to them in their great time of need. Well, I think our listeners need to know that when you give your helping us reach and equip more people like Steven and Rachel more ministry happens as a result, it grows exponentially, and that's why it's so critical that we hear from you during the month of December. As you said David, this is a an important month for us and the good news is, every donation we receive this month is can be matched dollar for dollar up to a total of one of the half million dollars thanks to some generous friends would put that matching gift fund together for us, so your donation will be matched and will say thank you for your gift by sending you a copy of Dana, Portland's new devotional book from the book of Psalms hundred and 50 daily devotions from the book of Psalms.

The book is called in the Lord. I take refuge, this is a beautiful hardcover book that we will send you as a thank you gift when you donate today. We will also send you a deck of playing cards so that as you play a card game on each card.

There are some conversation starters to get you talking about meaningful things while you have fun together. Those gifts are way of saying thank you, when you support this ministry your year-end make an online donation of family life to date.com or call to donate at one 800 FL today and again we want to say thank you for your support and to pray for us that will be able to take full advantage of this matching gift opportunity here during the month of December and we hope you can join us back tomorrow. How many times do people say to you, how you doing and you say I'm doing okay. And the question is are you really doing okay you know what that means to know how to tell how you're doing. Deborah Flaig is good. Join us tomorrow to talk about how we're doing and how we can know how were doing. Hope you can be with us for that on behalf of our hosts David and Wilson on Bob Lapine.

We will see you back next time for another edition of family life today like today is a production of family life accrue ministry helping you pursue the relationships that matter most