When Mountains Crumble

I've learned that window is truly at the temporary identity that child of God is for ever since Spanish huge stained on the last of my first let's say my name, Dr. welcome relationship with Gary Chapman, author of the New York Times bestseller the five love my today grief will leave you with empty arms full of question you need permission to simply feel what you think you'll appreciate the perspective of today's gas grenade this June day. She joined us earlier this year. This is our final bus. The broadcast building relationship.

Chapman wrote the book when Milton's rebuilding life after losing someone you love Gary I know your heart is with military families who sacrificed so much.

I know with your experience as a pastor you walk a lot of grieving people who've experienced the loss.

Every pastor is walk the journey with the number of years and I certainly have. But you know there's a real difference between a pastor walking with others through their journey and the pastor experiencing death in his own family think all of us want to empathize and where we will learn some things today. Along those lines as well.

How do we walk with people who are suffering, but until you go through it. You don't really understand the depth of the pain and all of that.

So I'm really looking forward to our conversation today. I am to let me introduce our guests the need Jeanette a GEN AE is a young mom and recent military widow learning to carry both joy and sorrow in the same breath as an author or speaker, poet and artist.

She walks alongside the brokenhearted, offering practical and creative ways to lead a Spirit led life.

That's what we're in here about today you find a free brief guide to do that@whenmountainscrumble.com or you can find more information@ 5lovelanguages.com welcome to Building Relationships and honored to be here like you actually have to tell you what I told my mom that this interview with, but I was little nervous that she is like crazy. I like your entire family and Barbara married Steve, thanks for all you do think you are really glad my guess is that this is a book and a ministry that you didn't really ask for far even dream about, but you are trying to embrace it and that is that is that fair is that a fair assessment 1000%. Yes, fourth grade, I knew I was called to write. I never expected this would be my first became a Christian. I mean I was actually in the mountains of Colorado in the same range that I would. Years later, at least that was the day I surrendered all I really just got to trust you. What I is grace to continue to believe will tell us a little bit about your husband Dan fall in love you give us the story.

Thank you for asking about first name to because honestly that's one of the best ways you can honor someone who has lost a loved one is just like me asking honestly more like Jesus anyone I have ever he was jovial and adventurous and just really stable.

He just really was our rock of our family had actually been asking my small group to pray for me. I swing dancing partner that you know why I just really need to go dancing partner and so they were praying for me and then met through mutual friends. On his first day in town just moved here to Colorado and yet he he asked me a few questions, we headed off a little and he found out that I sleep and so he sent me and girl in front of me and I was talking we were all walking together. She turned around and slapped my little letter that's really I'm not saying that's how we fell in love we tie learn to follow and healing to lead system really beautiful picture of her marriage to long was it from the time you told like couple days actually on our very first day there was that couple that we get meeting with and they said all you're such a sweet couple. How long have you been married that same mutual friend without a first date.

I think it was about lover here when we got married. How long were you married before the deceased. Yeah, we were married for 11 years and a lot of moves during that time. What precipitated that yes, the military family we go and Air Force sentence and he had actually been in the military for nine years.

A fire we got married so he had a lot of moves under his belt before I joined the club here that written a lot of different states and also just had crazy situations. Everywhere he went so both of our first big moves had a newborn. Both times, and postpartum depression and are trying to make friends in that situation and just a lot of change. He traveled a lot. He child nationally. He was gone a lot and so we just always just kind have learned that I guess. Early in my marriage I learned that you know truly at the end of the day the Lord is still my Dan's covering of prayers covered me even when he wasn't physically in the home learning that early really saved me, now every military couple could long time appointment and that sort of thing you are just really getting ready to move again. Is my understanding just before the before you file the house been pushed away. Tell us about the Colorado moved around and are very last-minute, actually back to Colorado so we have been here for six weeks.

You are in a temporary apartment house hunting and that's when we lost him when he was on a hike in times he had done a lot of 14 years over 3014 years. There's over halfway, in the mall but that's when we lost him was shortly after we went to town so no check Tom yet know in a school community around us.

We were used to really having solid communities and digging in quickly and deeply with those around us that we didn't have any network in place when we lost him. So while he was talking yes and we there's a lot of unknowns around it just had to learn to trust God with unanswered questions terms we don't understand not only what happens.

Certainly not what happened. I remember sitting around the table in the Virginia with a group of military was understood. Tell me what it's like one of the wives said this she said well Doc Sherman. She said every time I hear a door slam the car door slam outside of my apartment. I listen carefully to see if there's a second card slams because I know that if there's been a death there be two people coming to my door and thought while those of us who are civilians have no concept of the reality that when people deployed. For example, you don't know what's going on what happens in the course certainly would be expecting this to happen.

What is not deployed is home disliking a mountain so we have to live with a lot of unknowns right yes I think the military community. They do a lot of pre-grieving if that makes sense. You're faced with the reality of the breath of life and how short that is very quickly.

It just seems to be in the forefront. However, when my my husband to deploy on it was a long deployment and so interesting because people would ask you know where is he is he safe and I was kind of like like that and it was so cool because God just gave me this response. I think you know he is just as safe where he is across the world as he would be here driving home from work and it's just the understanding that he is in, God's hands matter where he is or what he's doing so actually gave me a lot of comfort when I was home with my husband deployed, not knowing if he would come home because I just knew I had him no matter what the plus for the Christian walk with God.

This is Building Relationships with Dr. Gary Chapman, our guest today is author Denita Jenae our featured resource. Today is her moving book when mountains rebuilding life after losing someone you love. You can find out more at our website.

Five love languages.com I have to ask about the title where that comes from. I read a book a long time ago was in the 80s by Dr. C. Everett Koop, you wrote this he and his wife floated about their son, who died in a mountain climbing accident where the rockface sheared off and the title that was sometimes mountains move tell us about the title that you came up with curse that's amazing.

A cat so I will have to find that for my duckling mountains crumble comes from two places.

Part of it is literally just my story.

He he died in the Sangre de Cristo Mountains which means the blood of Christ, mountains and he really like I mentioned before, he was the rock of our family and that of Christ Jesus is our rock, our earthly rocketing we all depended on him.

He was a picture of the cornerstone that we all leaned on and so when he died. Everything we needed to be stable, crumbled and fell apart. And so I just knew that that was imagery that people could connect with whether you know no matter how they lost their loved one experience of okay everything I just need to be stable yesterday is now gone. Today, so that's the first part of the second part just 54 verse 10 mountains might think Hills might be my faithful love for you will never be shaken. In my covenant promises PC will never be removed. Since Lord has compassion on you.

Verse picture that mountains may shake crumbled that God's love well never couple. It is our constant stable children to do the we have to girls girls what are their ages. No, my youngest and oldest just yesterday turned 12, so here you were doing a new setting your family was not there extended family time to make friends. You have a church home. It was just to the children. Did you get through that.

That's a great question.

Part of me wants to tell you I have no idea who the other part of me wants to tell you that God's grace held us in ways I cannot even there's no words to explain. We had people praying for us all over the nation that couldn't be here taking a physically For us, but they really were praying and so that's proof to me that you know prayer really does change things so we lost him and then it was certainly after that try to make while trying to make friends when you're like just die like a really need a friend friends like that's hard, very rare person that will step into that and say like a lock on you know we were already isolated. We were already not able to stock or toilet paper excite the brains to like remember to get the store and then you know that the world caved in and in a way it was a grace to because I learned that Jesus sometimes he is your only friend. And he was not for me and so I did the comfort that he gave to me through the Holy Spirit.

During that time. Just me and him that's really where out of that comfort. He call me to pass out to others through this book. So he knew he was doing didn't feel like it, but then we frowned through the years. Sometimes when people go through an unexpected like this should and walls, turn away from God so God let me dial if he loved me he would let this happen. Did you struggle with any of those feelings. That's okay. I am sure I can't even tell you because so much of it feels like a playwright like so much of it feels like a fog. But I do know that I knew enough about God to know that his love for me didn't change my circumstance we had faced my own death just years before the last stand because we didn't know if I was going to make it. I had a bunch of chronic illness and autoimmune issues and it was to the point where I was writing down my wishes right like my last.

I was really facing my own mortality and in a nine learned to pray through that we learn to fast and pray before God and cry out to we walked through that trial together, which really strengthened me for this one because I just knew that I come to this place where God you are faithful even if I had to face time rock and I have no faith left.

I still thought he was faithful so that that carried me for those who do question God for the loss of a loved one is it okay to do that and other biblical examples of. Oh yeah, I mean when I didn't know if I was can make it. That's when I probably question got even more because it was like I like why Chris when Dan died. It was also why lie lie lie not okay. We were not created for death rate and so one of my favorite people ever is this and he is our example. He asked why right there on the cross, my God, my God, why did you forsake me saying the same. I have prayed so many times in the last few decades, probably of my life like God where are you. Why are you ditching me why are you leaving me right now and that Jesus gives us an example have to even say that out loud, right. Like you said not for our benefit so that we would know even Jesus himself the son of God is saying why and he gave us permission) that moment right before he saved us permission to also say God I don't understand you losing your friend or loved one brings a lot of sudden changes this earlier, but what ways did you experience grief changing you your personality or your noted that I was probably very quiet spoken very unique in many ways before losing my husband and now I still am in some regards. I've honestly had just become a little more feisty like a got a little scrappy.

You have to learn to the key here only for kids three needs in a very new way when you know this is a piece suddenly now find that you now head of household in earthly means right. I went from being the one I got to follow to not having to make all the other shots make all the decisions. But the piece was huge like to go from military disability and to go from dependent primary happily married to a widow and that was very quick blow. I've learned that widow is truly at the temporary identity. You know, being a military family. It's a temporary identity military family forever.

At some point will retire a child of God is forever and so that's just been a huge thing to have to honor the loss of my enemies, but also to say at the end of the day my I'm still a citizen of heaven and I'm still daughter ask do you remember the first time after the first time you actually were able to laugh again because humor is part of the of the writing of your book. I can tell, as per your personality, but when you have no relevant crumbles and everything is change there in the air get sucked out of feel like it gets taken up a whole world and you're just kind of walking on shifting said use old metaphors here, but was there a point where you remember laughing and did you feel guilty for laughing at the top talk about that process. Okay, so I can't tell you that I remember the first time that I laughed, but I can tell you that I remember thinking about process like it surprised me were still laughing having their young children.

I think it really helps right like I had a four-year-old and a nine-year-old at the time and so laughter with children, it still remains right and I just remember thinking how we still laugh like in the guilt.

I think that's so cool that you brought that because that was banana muffins. My husband was so amazing and he would cook and do all things and he bakes these amazing banana muffins and he had some in the freezer. Make like double boxes so that we could freeze them and have them for easy breakfast and so we would you know when I was looking in the freezer, trying to figure out breakfast and my family a few weeks later and I was like these will be the last muffins that we ever have of his right, and I knew I could let those month and not freezer that freezer burn and we end up throwing them away or we can actually partake in the things that he left for us to enjoy. Laughter was one of those things. Dan made us laugh. He knew how and I knew that he wanted us to keep living life even if he couldn't be there. I and so for me the muffins was like a huge moment. You know what we are going to continue to enjoy life as much as we are able, even if he's not right here by us.

So for me that's a picks of the laughter to just a great question because so many people struggle with guilt like Mylanta still be right, even laughing happy. Yeah, you know that he would want you to tell the story of how you find a guy who could swing this break but you know you as a rock star and his boss like I know that you guys don't know a lot about what you spouses do, but they are truly keeping the world safe. So like, yes, he really was a rock star on all fronts. He really was stored as well.

Well, as you look back on all of this you still in the process processing life was or what one thing stood out that you thought you were the most prepared for. Yes, it was the physical pain. I didn't realize I mean I'm thinking after the funeral I felt like I had whiplash.

I've been in a car accident before so I had experience with class. But this was this was like a truck hit me literally and the way that grief which is kind of beat us. He likes shooting across my chest and shoulders are my hips you now show up in different places in my body that it was physical like all like you physically feel the death of your loved one way that I was not prepared for. Thanks for joining us today for Building Relationships with Dr. Gary Chapman, author of the New York Times bestseller "The 5 Love Languages" . Our guest is Denita Jenae and were talking about her book one mountains rebuilding life after losing someone you love. You can find out more at 5lovelanguages.com that's five love languages.com before you took her break talking about physical pain that you failed your body after you after the funeral with. And so, in the book you do talk about taking care of yourself being gracious to yourself. Being kind to yourself when you're grieving.

So what are some practical ways that our listeners are going through this can take care of themselves.

So for me I needed to learn to create more margin in my schedule and my expectations of myself I was raised in like hippie culture and I went to college and you know you recycle, reduce, reuse, and paper plates are not a question by paper plates, so there were just them basic things I had to do to create margin and just give myself out and some of that was scheduling right like thank you so much for actually inviting me to an actual thing where there will be actual people.

I am so excited but hate just in case like grief hits me. I may not be able to make it last-minute just like you know stuff like that to create margin even ahead of time, like yes I'd like to, but if I'm in, you know, tears on a total mess. I will be there so you know this is going to be fine because I also really did learn that my love language change just like my personality and identity which is changed so you know my very like bottom of the bucket. Love language was physical touch, so I thought that Dan, you know, he just just like with me or you know me, and when that was completely gone. I really like all the sudden that's my number one love language need right now. My kids don't even really want to hug me today.

They don't want to snuggle so I had to know how to recognize first all okay this is a new need in my life and to how on earth am I gonna try to sell that love language and so I started getting massages but it's just this. It's just my kids seeing their love languages change. We had to readjust. Okay, how do we take care of each other in the family. Now it's different is grief something that you have to embrace rather than trying to run away from it or how to respond. What I love about God is that he doesn't make us do anything so you can render grief if you want you you can embrace grief if you need to let I do believe that grief is not meant to be forever in his design.

It is a season I think it's unfair that life is that says that the days of our sorrow will be ended and so it is it is healing. If we embrace our grief and work through it, but there will be times where it's just like you know why I just need to completely check out golf or watch a silly style because we can't be in heavy state grieving for so long before we just spiral down so there is kind of like pushing pony effect on you. Love that he he just says you know what what you need you need a distraction right now. Do you need to deal so we cry likes to talk it out and he just is so present no report of the process right sometimes or grow your weeping just feeling so deeply in terms your plan put put something away from for your from a moment from the intense stage of grief.

I wonder if you experience that you see something benevolent muffin or you see a picture of who they are playing the Air Force of somebody in uniform. Is there something that creeps up on you and is kind of a trigger for the grief for you. Yes I call those gray funds there when you don't expect them and all the sudden you're like you just ban here is grief right in your face. I remember, and definitely not when I see someone in uniform and it's like like your heart, so I think because we walked to the plane and it was a long seven months. You kind of get this like oh, about seven month mark after he died.

A house is looking out the window like okay now. He should be home any day now and I catch myself thinking that so many times your brain is working on overtime when you're grieving because it's time to figure out what just happened and so does grief on a show when you talk about healing from loss use the term grief work orders grief work look like. I think understanding that it really is a work like you kind have to make yourself face to face that sometimes there is such a grace of the denial and actually think that that's a gift from God. When we feel that fog and that denial also know then there's times where we have to really work out and figure out okay you know what is what is my life now you know even just figure out okay. How has my love language change since I lost my husband. That's grief work because you trying to put the pieces back together and you're trying to figure out even just a small practical way. Okay, how am I going to keep rebuilding life, you keep moving on. Even in the face of such loss just understanding that it is work I think helps because you can take a break from your work, but you have to work so your love language change explainer to school but more because what I heard you showing was that you turn to good soldiers because it was physical touch certainly didn't pick the place of Richard good father to be meaningful.

Friends have been very few had for him sooner close at hand geographically and very good dogs and that sort of thing. I'm assuming that would've been super super meaningful to you. Absolutely. A few months after my husband died. I ended up going to writers conference where these people knew me as online friends, but it was the first time I had seen people who knew me before everyone else in town here.

Save a couple people everyone else just knew us as this newly grieving family didn't know like life before, but this conference they knew me before and after and so they hunt me and I remember like oh like I needed this and I think that every single person I saw it was just like me for relationships and community and especially in our grief. Some people isolate also still need to know enough people when they were ready for him.

So I it was II remember, probably every single one of my very first hugs in the whole first few months because they were so rare but still powerful for me to do for those of us were trying to walk with people grief, it's important for us to know what their love languages may be quality time and for those people having lunch with him sitting down or taking a walk with them would communicate depleted or cared about them. So use another word that is talk about grief brain tells about that when I wanted a baby and she's pregnant.

There's this phenomenon called Prego brain or mommy brain and it's real. I remember putting my cereal away in the refrigerator and the milk away in the pantry and it's just like grief brain is so similar, except that instead of your brain working overtime to process that you're creating a new life now. Your brain is working overtime trying to process what just happened and who did I just lose and how does that change everything and so in a way increased brain feels like his total. I started writing my words backwards like switching letters around, that I started stuttering, your whole person is trying to understand this loss and just knowing that that's the thing is so helpful because otherwise you're like I am going out of my mind. When you know the other people and there's an actual freight for a fellow widow is the one who told me that phrase I like about this because I just thought I was losing it completely to really come up with new regular grief work grief ball. All of them very meaningful yeah yeah our English language doesn't seem to talk a lot about great so we gotta make it up to make up some ways to talk about it. Thanks for joining us today for Building Relationships with Dr. Gary Chapman, author of the New York Times bestseller "The 5 Love Languages" needed today is our guest in our featured resources. Her book when mountains rebuilding life after losing someone you love. You can find that and more simple ways to strengthen relationships@ 5lovelanguages.com click resources and then Building Relationships.

When you go to five love languages.com.some of the process of walking through grief do not only things we talked about what to talk about art and dueling with heart instead of simply verbally processing open art be helpful to a greater portion so the cool thing about the way we are created is the fight or flight thing right. So when we are understaffed, or when we are in a state of being threatened, kind of what happens is I left on our right brains split all the cortisol fills up down the middle and so the problem is like just talking it through, is not always going to help those two sides of the brain, reconnect, and so things like writing courses can help like really lace back together in the left and the right brain same with art so kind in excess it's coming.

I healing in a totally different way that it just jogs some things loose in a way that may be, you know, if you do, probably having trouble even just reading or writing sometimes just doodling allows you to process things in a way that he may not even ask to be able to deal if you can't write a sentence talk about how can it help those who are suffering from loss so lament is very powerful lament is just getting honest with God about what is really hard and honestly this is what opens the door to let the comforter rush opens the door to say God like open up and let you know how I'm really doing and he rested healing for me, I'm learning that a lot of people have even in the church do not know the word lament and so it's this ancient coping mechanism and suffering that our faith and culture has truly forgotten and I think that if we can embrace lament coming before the Lord with honesty like gut honesty about how hard this is.

Think that's what's missing and why a lot of people are turning to much more harmful coping mechanisms because we forgotten this biblical tool of government is truly beautiful but it's hard to biblical others. Another word from Jesus was talking Sherman well said blessed are those who mourn, but it does always seem like a blessing. What you think Jesus meant when he said yeah it doesn't always feel like a blessing to mourn. There's a difference between grieving and morning greeting is what you do you know when you're trying to figure this out and it's often what you do in your own internal thing morning is a public display that you are creating inside so you want to train times they would hang the black wreath on the door, they would all kinds of ways that the household would show that it was morning, and that would trigger to other people in the community. I'll likely need to take a different way of approaching their morning right now today see it in the bumper stickers on the car like we remember our soldier or the bands that people will wear around their arms on my drown or something in honor of someone lost that's a public way of displaying their grief and when we are bringing that morning into public, then it becomes communal and I really believe that that's what invites this blessing healing because we really were made for the body of Christ really were made for community and so if we don't mourn and we don't let other people know that were even hurting.

We totally missed opportunity. Sir we might we might avoid people saying some dumb thing but we also the blessing of the healing that comes in community from experience when we know someone was morning quarter some of the best ways for us to support to the ministry of presence is more powerful than people understand the very beginning showing up at the funeral just your presence there. It means more than people understand some practical ways. Put the date of death in your phone. Even then, the first year the second year, even 18 years later yet text or call Fran on that day and say hey like I just know you're not alone and I love you pray. But don't just pray so pray, definitely, but also asked God for a practical idea is kind of this tension of like hey I'm going to help you, but also can you give me permission. So like if God gives you an idea of you know I can help them get their oil changed and tell them hey like to get your oil changed and asked him, it comes up. That's one thing off your mind and your plate. When was the last day that was service and not just keep I'll just keep my phone and I'll just take care like it's a way think can I can I do this but not making them come up with all the things that maybe they could get US options. That's kind of just like I want to honor you if you I'm bringing you a meal. But if you want company. I'll stay and if you want me to just stop it off. I will so it's kind of the psych what you need in this hour will go.

Most of us want to help your book is going to help many many couples and individuals to know how to effectively walk with people who are going through grief share with you some last words of encouragement to those of our listeners who are grieving right yes grief is so disorienting, and it turned everything upside down and so I guess one of the last things I would want to leave with, and is just this assurance that they are not alone and all.

And that big emotions and heavy questions that they're facing.

That's why I created that free resource that was mentioned in the very beginning. It's just a grief guide helps people understand, in a quick way that there's no no timeline that it's disorienting all these different things, puts on paper in a visual way. That's just like oh I'm not crazy and I'm not alone.

Would you just took a moment and pray for those who are listening be honored to father, I think you that you draw near to the brokenhearted, I think you that you don't avoid the broken hearted you draw near to them and whether we can feel it or perceive it, we know that you are near today. I pray that you would open her eyes to be able to see open it used to be able to hear the ways that you are showing up for them. It is probably in a new way. It's probably in a way that they need more than they ever needed that in a way that is not what they're used to expecting from you so can't I just pray that you would help them to see how you are stepping in and so present and loving on them so beautifully in your kind ways healing and comfort and peace. Jesus, thanks for being with us to go and thanks for investing time and energy to write this book. Thank you for having spent on. I appreciate the author of mountains, humble find out more. Five love languages.com subtitled building life after losing someone five love languages.com grief God go to window next week. Lucy's first build relationships calling child was given a terminal diagnosis face darkest days of purpose and one thank you to our production teams with generous banking relationships with Dr. Gary Chapman's radio Association published a ministry of